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I have another question to this concerning GSD's. If you look at most GSD's now they tend to breed them with their rear ends on the ground practically. (If you understand what I am trying to say) So wouldn't that slow them down alot, or cause them to have alot of hip problems too? I don't personally like the way they look now, but maybe that is the difference in show v.s. working types. Just a thought on how they work compared to mals and dobes or any other working lines. Why do the breeders breed for that look? Just curious.
 

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Higher level OB, practical agi, scent work, tracking, protection etc. I remember the sheps being a pain in the ass as pups, the dobes were butt hurt a lot, and the mals got it all done asap. my personal mal passed a sch2 ob routine at 6 months with a 92. mock trail of course, but still impressive for his age. i have since sold him to a security firm for narc. now i just have the dobe and focus on pet training.
I'm having a difficult time believing this. That's quite the accomplishment; do you have a video or pics? I would think the jumps would put a lot of pressure on his growing limbs.
 

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I have another question to this concerning GSD's. If you look at most GSD's now they tend to breed them with their rear ends on the ground practically. (If you understand what I am trying to say) So wouldn't that slow them down alot, or cause them to have alot of hip problems too? I don't personally like the way they look now, but maybe that is the difference in show v.s. working types. Just a thought on how they work compared to mals and dobes or any other working lines. Why do the breeders breed for that look? Just curious.
Yes, those are showline dogs you are describing. Most working line GSD's are pretty square with some having maybe a slight angulation/slope. Most showline GSD's that I have seen, are ****ters when it comes to working drive. It seems to me more so than most Euro Dobermann showline dogs.
 

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How ironic..I have been researching this and just sent an e-mail to DOD, "why are Dobies not used anymore" I have had 3 different Dobermans as service dogs, I am a paraplegic and would never get another breed..............7/30/2013. I wanted to find a veteran Dobie handler and write a story, and bring some good attention back to the breed...can anyone help or know of a handler that had dobie..they saved so many soilders in WW2, now they are just used in moviesas the "bad dog or guard dog" they are smart wonderfully smart and loving...please help save our Dobermans .Beth
 

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Sorry for jumping on an old thread.

I had a friend that was a SNCO at the Lackland AFB Military Working Dog facility, and a career K9 police officer.
He told me basically Dobe's think too much and don't always blindly do what instructed if the circumstances are chaotic (they may know better, and they know it), and also that the breed has been watered down by "the show ring crowd" over the years and losing "working ability".

Anyway, for what it's worth.
 

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hi guys...
I want to know , why do not police and army use doberman anymore ?
What are the reasons ?
To be honest, I used to see more dobermans as police dogs when I was kid but now It is becoming so rare to see a doberman as a police dog ?
I love dobermans. They are so amazing but It seems police & army prefer german shepherd and belgian malinois over dobermans. What do german shepherd and belgian malinois have that dobermans lack ?
I have been told several times by several k9 handlers & other dog owners that dobermans are not multi-handlers... Some say, doberman do not have that solid nerve(quality of being calm and confident even in new ,strange & adverse situation) needed to work for police..but i do not believe it much.. I am keen to know, what are the real reasons ?
I request all people to please let me and others know.. What are the real reasons behind not working of dobermans in police and army anymore ?
Thanks.
I'd say it majorly depends on the dogs genetics... German shepherds or Belgian Mallinois all have one thing common...both dog are shepherding breeds... Dobermans are working....majorly protection....police or the army need little protection towards themselves(I mean they are protection).... sorry if your a law enforcement agent🤷...... Shepherding breeds on the other hand have that added advantage....they are natural shepherds...and it's easier to train a dog protection work than it is to teaching it shepherding work....the same way German shepherds shepherd sheep 🐏🐑 is almost similar to controlling (shepherding) rioting crowds or perceived criminals....if a working class dog is thrown in the above situation... automatically it perceives everyone as a threat(sensible they are protection dogs) so they are more likely to cause more "trouble" making police to have a bad rep(which should be the last thing they want)

I normally notice this in working class dog breeds....when they go to apprehend someone...they can't really do it right "naturally", they'll always turn back to my sure your safe (naturally, that's why they were breed...for protection...have to make sure their handler is safe) in the few seconds it take to make sure your safe....the so called bad guys are fleeing...this all reduces efficiency 🤷

I also notice they are one handler dogs(generally) so they tend to have a hard time taking instructions from someone they less like...this could be dangerous...their tolerance level is lower than usual...any mistake from the less liked handler and the less liked handler might have to expirience the consequences of their actions...(though it is also common in Mallinois and Dutch Shepherds...also genetics)

So to me, in a nut shell. They want a multi-purpose dog for their diverse duties...in which Doberman's are not looked at.

Okey, this is my general observations, there are exceptions. I've seen Dobermans who've got more game than German shepherds. Thank you.
 

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Welcome to the forum!

Your question has been answered before on this forum as well as many other forums. Sadly for the Dobermann breed, a lot of people refuse to accept the real reasons that Dobermann’s are seldom used in Police work. Many folks who profess to love the breed make excuses or repeat myths instead of facing reality. Unless people accept the situation for what it is and make a dedicated effort to turn it around, it is unlikely you will see many Dobermann’s in Police or Military service ever again.

The bottom line is that relativity speaking, there are very few Dobermann’s capable of doing police work. There are a number of reasons for this, but the short simplistic answer is that many more breeders valued the working temperament of the Malinios and German Shepherd Dog over the appearance, while on the other hand too many Dobermann breeders have valued the dog’s appearance over its working temperament. This has resulted in there being many, many more GSD’s and Malinois having the necessary temperament compared to very, very few Dobemann’s.

Asking a K9 handler what he thinks about working dogs, breeds or why one dog is used instead of another, may or may not get you a legitimate answer.

While some handlers may be very knowledgeable about dogs in general, other dog handlers can be factually ignorant. Don’t assume that just because someone is a Police Dog Handler (or a Military dog handler) that he has good overall dog knowledge.

Asking a K9 handler general dog or breed questions is like asking a Soldier general firearms questions or asking him why the army uses gun XYZ instead of gun ABC- you may or may not get a knowledgeable answer.

The K9 handler can probably tell you a whole bunch about his dog and his departments training methods and the Soldier can probably tell you a whole bunch about how to use and maintain his issued weapon. But in both cases their factual information may not extend beyond what their employer has taught them about the dog/gun they are issued.

Anyone who has served in the military and knows guns can tell you that Soldiers/Marines/Airman/etc will often be heard repeating myths or spouting off absolute nonsense about firearms. Some K9 handlers have never even trained a dog of their own before their department selected them to be a handler. Expecting them to be a dog expert is quite unrealistic.

If you are sincerely interested then what you need to do is find a person who selects Police dogs for a mid to large department and ask him. Then find a broker who imports Police dogs and ask him. Between those two sources you will get some legitimate answers instead of excuses and myths.

Then maybe you will have the knowledge to become the kind of person who helps the Dobermann breed recover a working temperament.
I tend to agree with this opinion. They bread out the working temperament of the Doberman starting in the 1960s, instead favoring the look. That's why they fell out of favor.

Back then there were many Dobermans biting judges and handlers in the ring according to one book I read. Dobermans became feared for their sharpness. The AKC started promoting breeding of a more docile dog that could be shown in the ring. It became all about the look.

The same thing happened in Europe, though the Germans maintain some form of the original breed for Shuntzhund. Contrary to what I read in old books, I don't think the Doberman disappear in Europe after the war. All that history was written by American authors. I know one breeder that has seen breeding charts going back before the war. I wish more European breeders in this forum would comment on this.

There has been recently an uptake in the breeding of working lines. All kinds of dogs are getting on the action, and so many Doberman breeders are beginning to breed for working aptitude.

My last one was from a working line and all the comments from elder people were how much he reminded them of the old Doberman. He was sharp, with lots of prey drive, alert, and very protective. Much more robust, so people often ask me were I got him. Of course, this was the issue with the original Doberman.

The Doberman became so popular, that they started breeding trashy unstable dogs for profit, like the pitbull. That's the big problem when a breed becomes popular for the wrong reasons. It kills the breed.

The AKC/DCPA also deserves mention here. This trend of breeding just for looks has some bad side effects. Everyone wants to breed to the favorite look of the day. So they breed from the few dogs that have that look. Soon, we have a small gene pool, everyone breeding from descendents of these few dogs, with all the health problems that are associated with it and the implicit inbreeding.

How do you determine the correctness of the dog by running them in a ring and without trials to test the intended temperament of the breed? Conformance is to some degree subjective once you are within the specifications. That's why today's favorite dog look is different from yesterday's favorite look. It's killing the breed!

IMO, this idea of promoting two standards, Euro and American, is killing the breed health wise. We need to widen the gene pool. You have to cross the dogs from both sides to widen the gene pool. There is no way around that.

"The Doberman Pincher is in serious trouble."
 

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So I just know what it’s like over in my little corner of the world… Dobies here in my state are bred mostly for being calm pets and not working dogs. Over all GSD seem a lot more…aggressive in their actions. A little more bite first ask questions later. I looked a lot at the two breeds when I was getting my dog and it was talking about how GSD has a little bit quicker reaction time and a MUCH harder temperament compared to the more sensitive Doberman in training (got that info off Fenrir Canine). In my experience with my GSD as her instincts are coming out and from what the breeder said about her parents they are always kind of “switched on”. Suspicious and aloof, even when we’ll socialized they still looking to owner for “is this guy ok?”. Also said GSD are able to handle the more “aversive” training methods much better than a Doberman would, who need a softer more understanding handler.
Anywho, just what I’ve seen reading up on them! Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong!
 

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This thread is so necro... It is over ten years old, with only a handful posting since 2013 and only 3 since 2015.

Only one of the early commenters is even still active.

John L.
Portland OR
 

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Yeah, the thread is old and I've read it in the past and every time I re-read it I'm reminded of the time a Canadian trainer of dogs for use as a variety of police or military purposes told me. Even before you get to evaluations on basic temperament and trainability there is the problem with Dobermans when it comes to something as basic as the fact that as a smooth coated dog they are just plain not as weather resistant as the breeds you see being used for military or police purposes.

dobebug
 

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hi guys...
I want to know , why do not police and army use doberman anymore ?
What are the reasons ?
To be honest, I used to see more dobermans as police dogs when I was kid but now It is becoming so rare to see a doberman as a police dog ?
I love dobermans. They are so amazing but It seems police & army prefer german shepherd and belgian malinois over dobermans. What do german shepherd and belgian malinois have that dobermans lack ?
I have been told several times by several k9 handlers & other dog owners that dobermans are not multi-handlers... Some say, doberman do not have that solid nerve(quality of being calm and confident even in new ,strange & adverse situation) needed to work for police..but i do not believe it much.. I am keen to know, what are the real reasons ?
I request all people to please let me and others know.. What are the real reasons behind not working of dobermans in police and army anymore ?
Thanks.
hi guys...
I want to know , why do not police and army use doberman anymore ?
What are the reasons ?
To be honest, I used to see more dobermans as police dogs when I was kid but now It is becoming so rare to see a doberman as a police dog ?
I love dobermans. They are so amazing but It seems police & army prefer german shepherd and belgian malinois over dobermans. What do german shepherd and belgian malinois have that dobermans lack ?
I have been told several times by several k9 handlers & other dog owners that dobermans are not multi-handlers... Some say, doberman do not have that solid nerve(quality of being calm and confident even in new ,strange & adverse situation) needed to work for police..but i do not believe it much.. I am keen to know, what are the real reasons ?
I request all people to please let me and others know.. What are the real reasons behind not working of dobermans in police and army anymore ?
Thanks.
Let me tell you the fact.
Dobies cost more (especially work line)
There are more than 1 type of Dobermann.
Dobies don't have undercoat
Changing owner or handler is close to impossible
It's the only of of its kind , Personal Protection dog. And so a velcro dog.
They've have Gsd too in their blood lines.
They're not just intelligent they're intelligent and head strong.
They test you out to the core. Unlike other breeds, Dobermann requires strong leadership 100% of the time to make them know the work is worth it.
Dobermann will work only for consistent and smart leader.

Dobermanns are known for outsmarting theirs owners/ handlers.

They need a reason to work.
Best breed for off leash.
Overall The Dobermann owns you
 

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This is an old thread. It will be closed per DT policy.

Solomon, glad to have you here. Feel free to chime in on other posts (or even start your own thread) In fact, why don't you head over to the newcomer's forum and introduce yourself.
 
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