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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
SUNNYSIDE DOBERMANS - Home

An person I know Is looking at getting a puppy from this breeder in the future,

I see some red flags, but then they have some titles, and health testing on some of the dogs, the pedigrees not to stellar on the American dogs, and the Euro dogs are Ehhh/ IMO. Does anyone know of any of these dogs.

They are in No way my cup of tea, but for my "co-worker" who only wants a pet she doesn't really care. But any Feedback good or bad would help.

It looks like they have already had 3 litters this year. - My co-worker doesn't just want my opinion, so I told her I'd ask around. She thinks I am a dog snob, lol no I just care about breeder ethics, and the quality of the dogs being bred, titles and health testings
:roflmao:
 

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I am just learning but I have been told you can see the test papers and have your vet evaluate

for me I love puppies and the more the merrier it SEEMS but many breeders have told me to be carefull about people who have multiple litters in a year--not sure exactly why but I have heard that ALOT..................I"m sure someone here can qualify
 

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joie de vivre
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I am just learning but I have been told you can see the test papers and have your vet evaluate

for me I love puppies and the more the merrier it SEEMS but many breeders have told me to be carefull about people who have multiple litters in a year--not sure exactly why but I have heard that ALOT..................I"m sure someone here can qualify
People who have multiple litters year after year are likely breeding for money and there are more than enough pets in the world without mediocre breeders pumping out more dogs constantly. This is one main reason why shelters and rescues are so full. It's a matter of ethics.

Plus, what quality of life do those dogs have if they're constantly whelping litters and sitting around in kennels waiting to be bred again and again and again? Stark contrast in quality of life compared to the pet who's owner titles them and keeps them active in some venue and maybe/occasionally breeds them within the proper age range for breeding, rather than constantly whelping litters as soon as they have a heat or just sitting around waiting to be bred again.

Also, litters are a lot of work. If someone has litter after litter on the ground or a few litters at once the chances probably aren't great that the puppies are being properly cared for and socialized.

Breeding is expensive. If someone can pump out several litters per year, chances are they're cutting corners (not titling, not health testing, not taking proper care of the puppies or their dogs in general). It's not always the case, but it is a possibility and something any puppy buyer should consider and decide how they feel about it for themselves. I personally don't want to give my money to someone using their dogs like an ATM because I believe animals should be treated better than that. So I choose to give my money to a breeder who treats her animals to the standards I hold for myself.
 

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yea one lady told me having a litter is exhausting...just one a year....they do have to be properly socialized...who wants a 95 pound unruly possibly dangerous dog...
 

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It appears they only breed their own dogs together which is a red flag to me. I also don't see very sound dogs in the pictures. Even if one does not want to do conformation, I would hope someone wants a sound healty Doberman.

I believe everyone is entitled to a sound in mind and body Doberman and this isn't what I see on the web site at a quick glance.
 

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Sea Hag
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for me I love puppies and the more the merrier it SEEMS but many breeders have told me to be carefull about people who have multiple litters in a year--not sure exactly why but I have heard that ALOT..................I"m sure someone here can qualify
I think this is something that can't be condemned in every situation on an across the board basis.

Many times there are co owners involved, where puppies are whelped in the home at different locations, socialized properly, etc. Absolutely nothing wrong with that if the other necessary criteria are met: proving the worth of breeding stock with titles and health testing, temperament evaluations, etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
YA, So I'll print this out ant show her. She just didn't believe me when I said to stay away.
I hope the replies were towards the other poster not me. I completely health test my dogs, and title in either Show and or Working titles. I also am a vet tech for 9 years and my family has bred, imported and trained/Titled Sch3,IPO3,IRON Dog3 -some of the Top American Bulldogs in the US. So I hope those comments weren't directed toward me.


I found out last week at the AKC rally trial I went to I did the Cardiology clinic, and found o ut my 9 year old male dobe is in Moderate DCM heart failure witha Grade 2 murmur.
So I tried to Educate my Coworker on Responsible Owner, and Breeder ethics, But she won't listen to me. So I'll print this out and bring it to her today. So she can see that just "any" ol doberman will be fine for her. because they are not all Created Equal. She's a few years older than me and thinks I'm stuck up for telling her these things
 

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well I must not know much because to me they seem fine...they say they health test and they have titles...not sure what is so bad about them except possibly raising too many
 

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Sea Hag
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well I must not know much because to me they seem fine...they say they health test and they have titles...not sure what is so bad about them except possibly raising too many
The titles they have are from an organization that sets the bar *very* low. Pretty much any dog who enters their shows will go home with a title...you pay your money, show in three shows and your dog is a "champion".

This can't be compared to an AKC champion title-far more difficult to achieve...thousands of dogs compete in AKC shows every year, only around 200 of the dobermans shown every year earn a ch. title.

The dogs shown on that website are really poor quality dogs, definitely not what any reputable person would consider breeding quality dogs. The pedigrees of the American dogs are totally undistinguished-nothing worth building on.
 

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well I must not know much because to me they seem fine...they say they health test and they have titles...not sure what is so bad about them except possibly raising too many
What titles do they have? Are they good titles? Are they of value? A title is not a title, not all titles are equal, etc. Just a note, anyone can get an IABCA title. Notice they don't have AKC or even UKC titles, just IABCA Intl titles. They are NOT the same.

Are they sound structurally? Can you tell me how well they meet the Dobe standard?

You may want to do research on what makes a breeder reputable vs not reputable. It may shed some light as to why others might not think this is a good breeder.
 

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ah thanks for claryifying... I do want to learn about this stuff

so I guess these are "McTitles..."

I see....
 

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QUESTION
are these AKC titles online or publicly available...what's to stop someone from creating a title on their computer?? and how do you know what dog they are titling...that it is really that particular dog....
 

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QUESTION
are these AKC titles online or publicly available...what's to stop someone from creating a title on their computer?? and how do you know what dog they are titling...that it is really that particular dog....
You can search AKC titles at the AKC website. You need to create an account which is free. ou can search titles and progression of titles for free and they have a few reports you can pay for.
 

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Also, the "Euro" pedigrees were all Altobello, Del Littorio, and the like. They are not exactly known to be overly discriminating in who they sell dogs to. Lots of Euro greeders have dogs from these bloodlines.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Also, the "Euro" pedigrees were all Altobello, Del Littorio, and the like. They are not exactly known to be overly discriminating in who they sell dogs to. Lots of Euro greeders have dogs from these bloodlines.

I'd never buy, sell or allow any of my dogs to be bred to any of the Euro Greeder dogs! Dejan and Slobdokan sell dogs to anyone now days. Things weren't always like this, but I guess the money is more important.

Also the reason I won't ever be paying any money for any dogs from any of these kennels Del Nasi, Betelges, Sant Kreal, Pride of Russia, Grande De Vinko, Pride of Russia, Altobello, Jahrestal etc dogs. Because now days everyone who has the money, can have dogs straight from these kinds of kennels, then they breed these dogs to inferior American Crap. and then goes the cycle of turning something mediocre to even worse and worthless. Either they have abandoned their breeder ethics, or they are breeding or selling to irresponsible people who in turn breed and exploit their dogs, I feel should be put in the same boat, especially if they continue to sell their dogs to these "greeders, BYB's we have in the US."

The only Altobello Dog I support is Idane Di Altobello, Because His owner is Responsible, and has been very successful with him. Other than that. NO one else.

And people wonder why I am going through the trouble to import pups from lines that are almost non existent anymore, because I don't want what everyone else has. not enough diversity in the bloodlines here.
 

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I'd never buy, sell or allow any of my dogs to be bred to any of the Euro Greeder dogs!
Jicole! You bred to a Thunder Valley dog. What do you think they are? And I mean no offense to you in saying this, but even a quick look at that website would have told you this. That's just not right to say this when you yourself have done it. Sorry, but it's just not okay.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Yes I had a hard time using Thunder Valley Dobe's Thor, But the fact that I was lied to by his owner about multiple things and found out after the mating. Yes I he was not my first choice but He was fully health tested, and had a BH already. I Don't Like Thunder valley or Family Dobes, But what the new owner of the dog does with it, health tests and titles, than I don't think I should be bashed! I'm not the only one using nice dogs from unfavorable breeders. Thor's owner did NOT know of the reputation of the breeder she got Thor from until after she bought him. I can say some things too but about some big name breeders "who" people think are great breeders but and for the most part they are but. But no one is perfect!

Lorna- You know I love you guys so I don't want to get into, but you bred Cowboy to Eva-Erin's dog who is a Dei Dohse dog. Even though it s a Wendy Breeding. So the same point you made with Isis being Bred to Thor can be said about Cowboy to Eva. Even though she is titled and from good lines she still came from Dei Dohse. Same goes for the Devonshire Bitch you were going to Stud Cowboy out too. To me Its more important that if someone gets a dog from a breeder, greeder or w.e, its more important to me to focus on the fact on What the Dogs and their owner's are doing. Just because the breeder's ethics are ****, doesn't mean they won't produce any nice puppies. Trust me I did NOT like the Breeder Thor came from, but his owner is doing everything right and not being unethical breeder like the breeder he came from. Trust me it could be alot worse. I have much more I'd like to say.. but Now I remember why I stayed off these forums for so long.
 
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