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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi doby owners/breeders

I am from the uk and had dobermann dogs previously not for 10 years though,
I decided after alot of thought, perhaps not enough thought, to get puppies.

However being blind to the sibling rivalry i purchased sisters, the puppys have been docked and imported to england from southern ireland.

The person selling the dogs gave me no advice or did not even mention the issues that can arise with siblings living together.

I admit that i should have done more research before purchasing , but wish some advice on the best way forward, please.

The bitches are fighting some times to a intense level where neither will back down. They also on the other hand the pupps show lots of love towards each other, they sleep together in the same basket. i have 2 baskets

looking on forums i have realised there can be issues withy siblings ie alpha/omega who's top dog, I suppose that im asking for advice on wether i should try to rehome one of the pups now or wether to try and train them.

Im obviously not experienced so as much advice whould be great, im really shocked that the seller gave me no advice on siblings ect.

Any help or advice you can give would be fantastic, thanks
 

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Sadly the person that sold you the pups was a back yard breeder and was only in it just for the money. I suggest that you re-home one of them as this will only get worse as they get older. Even if you try to make it work it will be a full time job training them, with no guarantee. You also risk the 2 bonding to each other rather than you.

Even the most ethical breeders can have a difficult time raising litter mates together. For the best interest in the pups and yourself I think it would be best to re-home one of them. Is there a reputable rescue in your area? Because you don't want to just give a pup to someone random as you will not know what type of home they will be going to. A reputable rescue will do interviews and make sure they find the right fit.

http://www.dobermantalk.com/puppy-corner/65881-absolutely-excellent-article-littermate-syndrome.html
 

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Welcome to the forum.

Sadly there are lots of bad breeders in Ireland who know they can sell puppies to the UK because they can avoid the docking laws. People do enough research to know they can get a docked dog if they import, but thats generally it.

I would recommend trying to speak to the breeder to see if they will take the puppy back, and if not try to approach all of the dobermann rehoming associations in the UK. They are over flowing with dogs at the moment, but since you have a young female then she has more of a chance of being rehomed quicker. Sadly males send to get suck there for a long time.

Are they spayed? Please do not give a dobermann to anyone without her being spayed, she could end up going to the wrong kind of home.

http://www.dobermanntrust.org.uk/
Dobermann Rehoming | Rescue Centres For Doberman Dogs | Dobermann Dogs
Dobermann Rescue | Dobermann Rescue UK
Home

If you cannot find help for her in a breed specific rescue, please speak to me further and I will help you.

In the mean time, I wouldnt leave them alone together for long periods of time and make sure you feed them seperatley and remove any articles which they could be come posessive of (bones, toys ect) At this age I cant imagine they would do any serious damage to each other, but as they get older things could become dangerous. I would make sure they have plenty of alone time for training individually.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for your help and advice , i feel a right idiot. you both catorgorically say i should re home one of the pups?

I will ring the seller and talk with him, i have a friend with an 8 year old dog dobermann would that work ?

If he brought one of the bitches up,(6 months+) could they then be rehomed together at a later stage?

I feel such an idiot, thanks for advice
 

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Whats done is done, we all make mistakes all thats important is that you learn from them and dont make the same mistake twice! :)

Honestly, people do get litter mates and raise them up to 12+ years and never have any issues. Other people get them with no problems until 18 months where they suddenly want to kill each other and cannot even be in the same room. Others have issues right away. It really depends on the personalities of the pups and some people are just lucky. I would say most times i've read and heard about, its has unfortunately not worked out. I've read about owners coming home to find one dog has killed the other more than once, and its always so sad to read as the owner has previously said 'Oh they're fine, they have little scraps but they eat together and sleep together no problems'. I'm not saying it cant be done, but its not easy and not something I would recommend especially to someone new to the breed. If you did decide to keep both, I wouldnt ever leave them alone together.

The problem with a 'wait and see' attitude to it is at 18 months-2 years old when two adult dobermanns want to fight it can result in serious injury or death. A young puppy is also much easier to rehome than an older dog. Its also a lot of work to ensure both dogs are getting appropriate training and socialisation; dogs which are raised together as puppies tend to become very 'doggy' and more intrested in dogs than people, so take a lot more training, as shadowolf mentioned.

I would say at 6 months would not be any better, as the dog is not fully mature. Perhaps if the dog was re-introduced at 2 years then there is a possibility, but even same sex aggression is quite a prominent issue in the breed, although normally with males it can happen with females too. I've never heard of anyone trying, so perhaps someone else can chime in here.

Got any pictures?
 

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Amelia couldn't have said it better, you are just taking a big risk if you are going to attempt to raise them together. You will get a lot more advice a few hours from now with people that have dealt with this before. You are going to have a lot more people telling you the same thing, re-home. Because like I said before even the best breeders can have a hard time raising litter mates. In the end its just not fair because puppies need constant attention, training and exercise mentally and physically. I can't imagine doing that with two puppies that are the same age and trying to individually train the two.

Everyone wants to keep two adorable puppies but you have to see it at a logical stand point and realize that when they get older that its going to get harder and harder to separate the two if the get into a fight and the constant stress of wondering if they might get out their crate or something in attempt to kill each other.

Like amelia said, we all make mistakes. All that matters is that you learn from them and don't make them again. There are a lot of knowledgeable people here on this forum that have YEARS! of experience with this wonderful breed. Anything that is going to be said for the most part is from first hand experience, they are attempting to relay their knowledge to prevent something catastrophic from happening.

they are adorable by the way.
 
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I had the same feeling, like Amelia there are going to be a few people here to point you in the right direction in how and where to place one of the pups.
 

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I do not know much about outside of U.S standards on how going about trying to report a byb. One of the biggest things you can do is just educate yourself and not buy from a byb again, next time rescue or buy from a reputable breeder. In a few hours you will probably get a few more responses as it is 3 in the morning where I'm from. Some people have more knowledge that I do about how to go about reporting the byb.
 

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They are adorable, look at those cute little puppy bellies! :)

To be honest, theres not really anyone you can report them to if the puppies are healthy. Are they kennel club registered? If they are kennel club assured breeders, you could report them to the kennel club but I doubt they would be able to do anything as there is no law against selling two puppies together and its not against their rules and regs. Did you actually go and visit the kennel or did you just get them to ship straight to you? If you didnt visit them, its unfortunately likley you bought from a puppy mill who will just ship to anyone who wants one with little care for the welfare of the puppies or the breeding parents. If you like, you can PM me the name of the breeder and I can try to look into them if you're interested to know more about them.

Id really recommend speaking to the Dobermann rescues, a docked puppy female would be quite desirable, so its really important that she goes to the right home and a reputable, breed specific rescue will be able to complete thorough home checks to ensure the best home. They also offer lifetime support, so if the adopter cannot keep the dog any more then the dog will have to go back to the rescue. Docked puppies, in in a country where docking is illegal, can unfortunately attract the wrong kind of attension.

May I ask where in the UK you are located? Im in Milton Keynes.
 

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I don't know about where you live, but in the states turning them in does very little if any good. There is just not enough legislation to protect dogs this way.

I have not raised littermates but have helped a friend who was having trouble with her GSDs, a totally different breed does make a difference. It wasn't easy and there was and still is rumbles.

I did, however, raise 2 females that could not be put together. One female was fine (the doberman) but the other wanted to kill the doberman on sight. This was not an easy time in my life, but by that time I was in love with both and we made it work, very diligently. Ultimately, years later, they were able to live together and I dare say love each other, but even then I had to be 100% diligent about supervision. When fights happaned I was right there and they did happen. When they happen they are scary and do cause damage. We had abrasions sutured, ears drained, face abscesses drained, etc. and this was all right in front of me at all times, when they were best buddies otherwise. Treats, meals, sleeping quarters, everything separate. But, even with all this the female dog that wanted to kill the female doberman ended up going into a deep depression when she died. They did bond. It just goes to show how much their determination to fight, despite even being best of buddies can be.

Honestly, as much as I know it tears you up, rehoming is going to be the best thing for not only you but your puppies. Is your friend a good home? That would be wonderful for you to be able to still have a relationship with her. The girls could probably still play for visits, but have a much better chance at a happy, nonhectic life.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
Hi Nuneaton, warwickshire just down the a5 from MK.


There microchipped and have had 1 injection at 2 weeks old, i only got them friday night, so was going to book in at vets wednesday, i have wormed them on saturday.

I found the dogs on puppy for sale site, went to a farm where the seller had 3 bitches left, i spoke on the phone with him and asked how does it work, what checks do you need to do? he replied none just come and pick them up, i was so blind.

I am going to s[peak to my friend first who has a 8 year old male, do you think one of the puppys would settle in ok in that enviroment?

Massive thanks for your help, chris
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
hbwright ty, yes its a good home will see what he says, i dont want to send back to seller, as if he is going to take back anyway:( thanks for your advice
 

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I almost was blind by the byb gimmick as well, but luckily I found this site and they helped point me in the right direction. All that matters now is that you are attempting to make things right. As for your friend with the other dog it all depends on the two when they meet. The other dog might like one pup over the other or not like either of them so have some options available for yourself.
 

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Raising two pups is many times more difficult than raising one... it is not something that I would choose to do. However, I am curious about whether or not you have spent time around puppies this age and watching them interact with each other. If you have not, it is possible that you are misinterpreting what you are seeing... normal puppy interaction may include a certain amount of violent barbarism. If you do not have experience in this area, possibly you might want to have someone evaluate them and determine if the situation is as you are thinking or if it is normal puppy stuff.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Hi, mmctaq

I seem to be getting advice that its just not a good idea with siblings, i would never forgive myself if something happened. They do play fight but neither backs down so ends up being full blown:( but they are gentle and caring with each other to. I will see what the majority advice is by the end of the day , but it seems to point towards re homing as the best option for the pupps, thanks for your advice
 

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Yeah I would speak to your friend, you could do a trial and see how it goes if your friend is interested in the pup; as hbwright said if you could rehome her with your friend tho has an older dog that would be excellent. From my experience, puppies really benefit from the experience of an older dog who can teach them manners and their calm nature often has a good affect on the younger puppy. You might even be able to walk your pups together; sometimes walking with dogs outside of the house can be completely different to them actually living together. We've met up with my boys litter mates before and they've had a great time playing (super rough!)

If you'd ever like to go for a walk with the dogs when your pup is a bit older, let me know! :) My boy Rupert loves other dogs and it'll be great socialisation for your pup.

I'd really recommend getting her into a puppy class asap; pets at home and your local vets will probably offer 4-6 week puppy courses which teach really basic training and will get your puppy used to lots of different types of dogs and different areas. The more work you put in now, the more you will get out of her when she's older.

Are these different puppies or the same? doberman pups for sale for sale in Offaly : €425 - DoneDeal.co.uk This add was put up yesterday, yet you say there was only 3 in total you saw when you were there? Did you see the mother with the pups? Could there have been other places on the farm where they were hiding other dogs? It could be that someone just decided to breed their pets and doesnt know anything about dobermanns or any issues that can arise, or could be that they are sneaky and breeding lots of dogs. But it can be so difficult to tell.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
hiya the farm was in stourbridge uk, i did not travel to ireland.No Parents were seem there was a male there but was told was the uncle, 10 months old. they were listed £850 each,

they need injection ect soon as well and need to treat for fleas,

I feel sick, am so upset. so annoyed with myself for getting in this situation.

i cant get one in classes until had all there injections? some advice on injections would be great if you dont mind?
 
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