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Small Handful of Woman
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A quick question for one of the more knowledgeable members out there...my red dobie's coat has thickened and gotten a lot more shiny since we adopted her and started her on some better quality food (TOTW).
I notice that her fur has a more vigorous consistency than my sister's boxer, or my brother's weimaraner (both dogs have very very soft, silky coats.)
Is this usual for Dobies? The AKC site describes Doberman coats as "Smooth-haired, short, hard, thick and close-lying" What do they mean by "hard?"
Just curious! :)
 

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I might be interpreting your question wrong, so just ignore me if I answer wrong!

Dobermans should not have a soft, velvet feeling coat. Usually their forechests are softer than the rest of their bodies, but overall their coats should be somewhat coarse feeling. I've met some with almosy wirey, harsh feeling coats which I don't like. Mine are nice to pet. They aren't velvety, but they're not overly coarse either. They just feel nice and smooth. Not prickly or anything. But definitely not as soft as most Boxers or Danes that I've known.
 

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Small Handful of Woman
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I might be interpreting your question wrong, so just ignore me if I answer wrong!

Dobermans should not have a soft, velvet feeling coat. Usually their forechests are softer than the rest of their bodies, but overall their coats should be somewhat coarse feeling. I've met some with almosy wirey, harsh feeling coats which I don't like. Mine are nice to pet. They aren't velvety, but they're not overly coarse either. They just feel nice and smooth. Not prickly or anything. But definitely not as soft as most Boxers or Danes that I've known.
Thanks for the quick reply! That's exactly the answer I was looking for :) Much appreciated!
 

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joie de vivre
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I've also noticed that black Dobes tend to be smoother/slicker feeling than red ones. My girls' red coats are coarser than any black Dobe I've met, but they're still smooth and slick. By coarser I mean the individual hairs are thicker on a red Dobe than that of a black Dobe.

Could just be the Dobes I've met but that's what I've noticed.
 

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My Red Dobes coat is what I would call course, almost wiry, especially along his back. He also doesnt shed as much as my Terriers. (thank heavens).
 

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Some of the red Dobermans I knew suffered from some hair loss on their lower backs near their tails (not sure what from, I forget - could've been thyroid, maybe alopecia). More red Dobes I know are very coarse and wirey feeling and their coats are not as thick as they should be... they're kind of sparse. And then more with seemingly nice coats to look at are very coarse feeling and really not that nice to pet. And they seem very prone to hives and allergies. It seems to me that consistantly nice coats seem to only happen in blacks, at least among the Dobermans I know anyway. Probably not everywhere. Ripley doesn't feel much different than any black dogs I know though, and to be honest, he and his red brother and one red half brother are the only red Dobermans I personally know with nice coats. They're thick, smooth feeling, etc. Reds have always been my favourite, but I was actually a little afraid that Ripley was going to have a terrible coat as an adult based on the sheer amount of red Dobes I've known with yucky coats. And not all of these red dogs are from the same breeder or lineage, so I'm not sure what it is, but my experience has been that nice red coats are not overly common.
 

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joie de vivre
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Some of the red Dobermans I knew suffered from some hair loss on their lower backs near their tails (not sure what from, I forget - could've been thyroid, maybe alopecia). More red Dobes I know are very coarse and wirey feeling and their coats are not as thick as they should be... they're kind of sparse. And then more with seemingly nice coats to look at are very coarse feeling and really not that nice to pet. And they seem very prone to hives and allergies. It seems to me that consistantly nice coats seem to only happen in blacks, at least among the Dobermans I know anyway. Probably not everywhere. Ripley doesn't feel much different than any black dogs I know though, and to be honest, he and his red brother and one red half brother are the only red Dobermans I personally know with nice coats. They're thick, smooth feeling, etc. Reds have always been my favourite, but I was actually a little afraid that Ripley was going to have a terrible coat as an adult based on the sheer amount of red Dobes I've known with yucky coats. And not all of these red dogs are from the same breeder or lineage, so I'm not sure what it is, but my experience has been that nice red coats are not overly common.
I agree with all this. Both my girls have good red coats but they're not as slick feeling as the black Dobes I've known. In a side-by-side comparison of my girls with a black Dobe, you can just see the difference in thickness of individual hair strands between my girls and a black.

I've also noticed that the darker red Dobes seem to have thicker, coarser hair and the lighter reds seem to have softer, thinner hair.

Both Fiona and Tali's coats are influenced by diet. Their coats are fantastic on Acana and Orijen and they both get probiotics, fish oil, and vitamin E twice daily. But when I tried feeding TOTW...oi. Their coats became sun bleached looking and blotchy and they both got horribly dry skin (super dry fur and skin - really flaky and itchy). Thankfully, it was really easy to correct with a diet change though.
 

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I call Rhett 'Fuzzy Puppy' and Michael usually corrects me 'Bristle-y Puppy' and he is actually correct. Shiny, lays flat but the hair actually has a bristle texture...almost like a mans eyebrow hair, a bit course and a bit stiff but smooth. And I pet Rhett backwards, where I go against the grain or lay of the hair and he loves that and it feels good not sharp. :)
 

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Sea Hag
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I've owned reds from a variety of different bloodlines and all of them had thick hard (correct) coats, healthy coats and skin. I see a lot of reds that are being shown by handler friends-I just don't agree with the idea that good red coats aren't common. I don't think they're the least bit uncommon.

You definitely see more reds with the desirable hard coat than you will blacks. In one of Joanna Walker's books, she mentions that reds have more hairs per square inch than blacks as well.

My Murrey bitch (red) was known far and wide for her coat, a lot of people felt she had one of the most correct coats they'd ever seen. Her coat was so hard she was basically water resistant-water rolled right off of her. You had to dump creme rinse on her coat when you bathed her to soften up her coat enough for it to "take" water.
 

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Thanks, Murreydobe! Like I said, I wasn't sure if it was actually a red thing or not. Just that my experience with red dogs has been that reds have poorer coats for some reason. I wonder why? Mine has a nice coat, but most I have seen and have known just do not.
 
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Small Handful of Woman
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I've owned reds from a variety of different bloodlines and all of them had thick hard (correct) coats, healthy coats and skin. I see a lot of reds that are being shown by handler friends-I just don't agree with the idea that good red coats aren't common. I don't think they're the least bit uncommon.

You definitely see more reds with the desirable hard coat than you will blacks. In one of Joanna Walker's books, she mentions that reds have more hairs per square inch than blacks as well.

My Murrey bitch (red) was known far and wide for her coat, a lot of people felt she had one of the most correct coats they'd ever seen. Her coat was so hard she was basically water resistant-water rolled right off of her. You had to dump creme rinse on her coat when you bathed her to soften up her coat enough for it to "take" water.
Thanks everyone for the great posts!
I definitely relate to the description of the red coats, thicker individual strands, almost coarse but smooth and shiny.
And Roxy IS waterproof, I swear :D
I just needed confirmation that it was normal, because I had a comment comparing her hair to her doggie "cousins" and mama don't like anyone criticizing her baby! :boxing3:
 

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Small Handful of Woman
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I agree with all this. Both my girls have good red coats but they're not as slick feeling as the black Dobes I've known. In a side-by-side comparison of my girls with a black Dobe, you can just see the difference in thickness of individual hair strands between my girls and a black.

I've also noticed that the darker red Dobes seem to have thicker, coarser hair and the lighter reds seem to have softer, thinner hair.

Both Fiona and Tali's coats are influenced by diet. Their coats are fantastic on Acana and Orijen and they both get probiotics, fish oil, and vitamin E twice daily. But when I tried feeding TOTW...oi. Their coats became sun bleached looking and blotchy and they both got horribly dry skin (super dry fur and skin - really flaky and itchy). Thankfully, it was really easy to correct with a diet change though.
Interesting about the TOTW, cuz it's been awesome for us! I will be keeping a close eye though!
 

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Liberty has a very slow growing coat that took quite some time to recover fully from a staph infection, but it is glorious otherwise. It's very dark and quite thick everywhere except the lowest portion of her stomach and groin area. Her fur is longer (almost twice Nietzsche's individual hair length), coarse, and far more water resistant. Nietzsche's is thin, very soft and velvety, and very short. He is poorly bred and has pretty serious hypothyroidism though. At least they're both very shiny!
 

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I agree with all this. Both my girls have good red coats but they're not as slick feeling as the black Dobes I've known. In a side-by-side comparison of my girls with a black Dobe, you can just see the difference in thickness of individual hair strands between my girls and a black.

I've also noticed that the darker red Dobes seem to have thicker, coarser hair and the lighter reds seem to have softer, thinner hair.

Both Fiona and Tali's coats are influenced by diet. Their coats are fantastic on Acana and Orijen and they both get probiotics, fish oil, and vitamin E twice daily. But when I tried feeding TOTW...oi. Their coats became sun bleached looking and blotchy and they both got horribly dry skin (super dry fur and skin - really flaky and itchy). Thankfully, it was really easy to correct with a diet change though.
I agree with your first two paragraphs, my girl is darker than her sister and is the darkest the breeder has had the past few years.
Her dad(b&t) and sister both have the nice short dense coats that feel much smoother than hers and once washed are incredibly shiny all over. Mabel on the other hand has a slightly coarser feel and once washed is shiny yes but no where near the degree of the other two, I also notice in general but especially after a bath that she has lots of hairs all over that tend to stick up not straight but more away from the body until a few days later when her freshly bathed shine goes away and she is just a clean semi shiny dober girl
I would also say she definitely has more hair and it's thicker than her dad but his coat is more dense and her sisters coat is like her dads as well and she's a lighter red.
Never thought there could be so much variety in a short haired breed! :p

She also gets Solid Gold seameal powder with her food, I love what it does for coats in general! and it has given her that extra bit of thickness and shine than beforehand that she wasn't even lacking :)
 
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joie de vivre
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Interesting about the TOTW, cuz it's been awesome for us! I will be keeping a close eye though!
It's a good food and I like the ingredients. Plenty of Dobes do really well on it, but for some reason my two don't. I was bummed to find they don't because it's a good price in my area, too!
 
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Oliver didn't do well on TOTW. When we got him he had very dry coarse hair and it wasn't shiny. It felt like pig hair. We started him on salmon oil with his food and it has really helped. He is very dark now and is shiny, his hair is kind of coarse.
 

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Small Handful of Woman
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Food with Fish and Coat Problems

Just gonna post this, in case it can help anyone at any point down the road: When we first adopted Roxy, her coat was dull and really flaky.
Through a long process of elimination, I figured out that she actually seems to react poorly to anything with fish or fish oil in it! (I know, supposed to be the opposite right?)
The TOTW version that we have her on has no fish or fish oil in the ingredients, and her coat is now thick, shiny and flake free! :nicejob:
She also did well on a FROMM 4-star food that had no fish either (Duck & Sweet Potato) but it was a little too rich for her tummy.
This is probably just specific to her...but who knows?
Thanks again to everybody and all your wonderful help & comments!:D
 

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Broadway Dobermans
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Wow. Well I was quite surprised to read this thread. For the past 12 years I've had black dobes. Their coats were/are silky, soft, velvety, smooth. I just love them.
My current red boy, when he was a small puppy, had soft, fuzzy puppy fur. Now that's he's maturing, I know what you are talking about! His coat is very different from my black dobes. Who knew. I would never have guessed there would be a difference. My pup's coat is thicker, a bit courser and just different to the touch from my others.
Why do you think there is a difference? All of the new things I'm learning with a red!
 

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Yesterday I was at a Dog Show in Zaragoza and saw a Red Dobe girl there whose coat was awful, it felt dry to the touch and she had tiny bald spots peeking through. I got chatting to her humans and they said their vet says she hasnt got any mites or the like and had given them some cream for it but that it didnt seem to be working. I asked them what food they fed to her and they said 'dog food' (about right for here). I pressed them and discovered it was a low quality dog food that is more ash than anything else. I showed them pics of my boy, (instantly they asked if I would like to stud him to their girl and I had to tell them much to their disappointment he was castrated) and told them which food I give him (now mine is not top quality but it far outstrips what they are feeding her and actually costs not much more (about 2 euros a bag more) I also expounded the benefits of adding Olive Oil to a dogs feed. We discussed it further and they decided to add oil to their girls feed and look into buying a better quality dog food, (changed over slowly so as not to upset her tummy).

There is a saying, 'you are what you eat' and I think in this sort of case it is oh so true.
 
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