[freeflow246]

Before you misunderstand me, I'll just say that I am well aware of the dangers that come with an all black Doberman, since they're pretty much all bred for color and not health and temperament. I'm also not so sure that I like the way they look anyway. I was just curious if there is any possibility that they will be just as healthy as other color Dobermans in the future. I know that white - or really albino - Dobermans are unhealthy because of the problems associated with albinism, but as far as I know black Dobermans only suffer from poor breeding.

And while I'm on the subject of color, fawn Dobermans are just as healthy as red, blue, and black/rust, right?

Sorry, that's two questions. I cheated.

 

[monicaei]

I have two rescue fawns. Fawns, and blues, both normally suffer from something called Color Dilution Alopecia to some degree (mild = a more brittle, thinner coat to severe = totally bald except the rust). CDA also opens up the door for a host of skin problems. Otherwise, they are wonderful dogs. A bit "off center" mentally in my experience (but my experience is limited to the rescue world so it could be the bad breeding or life experience) but charming none the less. )

Can't speak about the melanisitic dogs. Is someone now intentionally breeding these dogs.
too??? Link to this please! Sigh.

 

[CH4Sure]

Before you misunderstand me, I'll just say that I am well aware of the dangers that come with an all black Doberman, since they're pretty much all bred for color and not health and temperament. I'm also not so sure that I like the way they look anyway. I was just curious if there is any possibility that they will be just as healthy as other color Dobermans in the future. I know that white - or really albino - Dobermans are unhealthy because of the problems associated with albinism, but as far as I know black Dobermans only suffer from poor breeding.

And while I'm on the subject of color, fawn Dobermans are just as healthy as red, blue, and black/rust, right?

Sorry, that's two questions. I cheated.

freeflow there are no more dangers that come with a black doberman than there are with a red. Where exactly are you getting this info from? It's not accurate by any means.

 

[PatchworkRobot]

freeflow there are no more dangers that come with a black doberman than there are with a red. Where exactly are you getting this info from? It's not accurate by any means.

Freeflow means the melanisitic dobies, not black and rust, but the black with no rust markings at all.

 

[CH4Sure]

Freeflow means the melanisitic dobies, not black and rust, but the black with no rust markings at all.

oopsie. my bad. I don't think I have ever seen one of those. Is that true then?

 

[DogsR4Life]

freeflow there are no more dangers that come with a black doberman than there are with a red. Where exactly are you getting this info from? It's not accurate by any means.

Freeflow is looking at black dobermans from BYB's. These breeders throw all health tests, temperament, and conformation out the window, striving for that all black doberman.

To the OP, I dont think the all black doberman will have any 'special' problems specific to their coat pattern, but I'm sure they will have some health problems from careless breeding, regardless of coat colour.

EDIT: Darn, I type too slow Sorry CH4Sure.

 

[GingerGunlock]

freeflow there are no more dangers that come with a black doberman than there are with a red. Where exactly are you getting this info from? It's not accurate by any means.

I believe the OP means all black, not "black and tan". Theoretically, a breeder who breeds for all black (melanistic) Dobermans is just as guilty as one who breeds for albinos, which is a temperamental crapshoot, from what I understand. I do not have personal experience with either, though.


(ETA: was at work and not fast enough, sorry for the echo )

 

[monicaei]

Freeflow is looking at black dobermans from BYB's. These breeders throw all health tests, temperament, and conformation out the window, striving for that all black doberman.

To the OP, I dont think the all black doberman will have any 'special' problems specific to their coat pattern, but I'm sure they will have some health problems from careless breeding, regardless of coat colour.

Seriously? The BYBs are in this market now? This is the new white?

Odds are if it isn't a single dog with a spontaneous genetic mutation with in a litter, there will be a host of unforeseen problems. Breeding for a genetic anomaly involves ALOT of inbreeding, not line breeding but indiscriminate inbreeding. That's not gonna end well. Trust me, I'd bet cold hard cash that if this is a new trend it wont be long til the problems show up. What they will
be, who knows.

 

[Jonesy'sMom]

I haven't seen many Melanistic Dobermans I can think of 2 right now... One is or was in a rescue in Georgia, the other was Taz (a tripod) I don't know how many of you remember that dog...

Those are the only 2 I can think of

 

[PatchworkRobot]

oopsie. my bad. I don't think I have ever seen one of those. Is that true then?

Here's one
http://www.dobermantalk.com/new-member-introduction/60243-hey-all-hello-our-all-black-new-pup.html
The one on this forum is the only all black doberman that I've ever seen. He's quite beautiful but I'm not sure I'd ever want one. There is something "off" about the look to me. As for health issues, I have no idea.

 

[CH4Sure]

ok the dog is cute, all dogs are, but for the breed I wouldn't have even known it was a dobe without seeing the ears taped. very strange looking. It just doesn't look right.

 

[workingk9s]

OP, if you get the all black puppy from a reputable breeder that health tests and knows a lot about longevity in the lines, I am pretty sure it will be as healthy as a regular colored puppy. I.e. no color mutant alopecia or anything.

If you get the puppy from a crappy BYB, then it is just as likely to be as unhealthy as the other colors.

PS. I know someone who just lost a 5 year old from DCM and who had clinical vWD, seizures and was hypothyroid. He was red. The color wasn't the problem. The breeder was.

So, it isn't the color that is bad... it is poor breeding that is bad.

 

[freeflow246]

Oh yes, I know that it's not the color that causes problems. But breeding specifically for color does cause problems, from what I understand.

All black Dobes have not become a full-blown trend among BYBs yet, but it has BYB all over it. I asked the question because I saw an add for all black puppies on this puppy finder website (don't recall the name at the moment, and it was a while ago, so search history has hidden it by now). The puppies went pretty quickly as there were only about four or five, and the asking price was actually pretty fair for a 'rare' and 'healthy' Dobe; around $500 I think. But the fact that the entire litter was black got me suspicious.

It's fodder for BYBs. Just think: a 'rare' color without the problems associated with albinism. Cha-ching!

IMO, it really detracts from the whole Doberman look. Their markings are one of their most easily recognizable traits. But, if reputable breeders are able to overcome the inbreeding that is sure to result, solid black Dobes might become a common color. People seem to like solid black dogs. I know I like the look of a solid black German Shepherd.

 

[monicaei]

Ok, this may be a repost, as my last one was lost in cyberspace.

Actually, all black dogs are NOT popular. They are the last dogs (all breed) to be adopted from shelters. However RARE dogs are another story. A RARE black dobe means money. Melanism, like albinism, occurs spontaneously occasionally. No big deal. Having multiple melanistic, or albinistic, pups in one litter IS intentional breeding of dogs known to have this in their genetic makeup. It's not accidental. If it's profitable, it WILL lead to serious problems.

Also, is melanism solely a "black" thing? If not, wanna guess how much the rare silver dobe pups will sell for?

Edit to add: this s not meant to minimize the problems in albino dogs, or compare melanistic dogs and their health issues. It is meant to say that multiple albanistic or melanistic dogs in a single litter means only one thing. Breeding for that. Breeding for a genetic abnormality won't end well. Ever. It's a shallow gene pool, and selecting for one trait while ignoring ALL others is like jumping off the high dive without checking the water depth

 

[freeflow246]

Wow, black dogs aren't popular? Guess I just know a lot of people with solid black dogs. I was under the impression that people considered solid black a 'tough' color, and wanted their 'tough' dogs like that, but I must have been wrong. I often am.

And silver Dobes? Never heard of those. Sounds sketchy though.

 

[workingk9s]

Silver may be a marketing tool for blue Dobermans. That color in other breeds is called silver.

 

[ZeldaRules]

Wow, black dogs aren't popular? Guess I just know a lot of people with solid black dogs. I was under the impression that people considered solid black a 'tough' color, and wanted their 'tough' dogs like that, but I must have been wrong. I often am.

And silver Dobes? Never heard of those. Sounds sketchy though.

If you're talking labs, then nope..black labs and black lab mixes are a dime a dozen at any shelter and always get passed up. Now solid black shepherds on the other hand are generally pretty attractive to people, most people aren't even aware they exist. At least with my experiences in owning them. I am always giddy like a school girl when we get bi-colors and solid blacks in the rescue.

 

[freeflow246]

If you're talking labs, then nope..black labs and black lab mixes are a dime a dozen at any shelter and always get passed up. Now solid black shepherds on the other hand are generally pretty attractive to people, most people aren't even aware they exist. At least with my experiences in owning them. I am always giddy like a school girl when we get bi-colors and solid blacks in the rescue.

Ah yes, the labs. My nearby shelters have almost as many labs as pits (95 pits within 30 miles of me). Shame since they aren't even passed up out of fear. People just don't want them.

And silver dobermans appear to be Dobes with some Weimaraner down the line. Couldn't find much about them.

 

[ZeldaRules]

Ah yes, the labs. My nearby shelters have almost as many labs as pits (95 pits within 30 miles of me). Shame since they aren't even passed up out of fear. People just don't want them.

Which is ironic since labs are one of the most popular family dogs to own by the masses...

 

[monicaei]

The silver dobe was a joke about the oh so rare and expensive dilutes.