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Discussion Starter #1
So I'm very happy I stumbled upon this site, as I have been panicking about my recent doberman purchase. This will be the first dog that I have ever owned. As a birthday present, my totally unaware best friend purchased me a doberman over the internet from a company under the name of Purebred Breeds LLC.

Now, I'm totally different and have done full research on this company as well as dobermans in general. I am totally convinced that this is the perfect breed of dog for myself (especially after reading some awesome posts on this site), however, I am freaking out based on what I have read regarding the company from which he was purchased.

The dog was purchased for a little less than 4k, and looks absolutely beautiful in its pictures. However, after reading the absolutely horrible and atrocious things about this company. I have to say I am in total panic over the state in which I may receive this dog. I asked for some recent pictures of the puppy, and got a few today which I wanted to share in hopes of someone being able to identify whether this puppy looks as if it is good condition or not.

Regardless, I am still going to take care of it, and hope for the best.
 

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Got mutt?
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Oh, dear....
 

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Holier Than Now
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Looks like your typical byb puppy.

I assume, since you did do some reading, that you now realize no decent breeder would ever sell their puppies thru a broker like this, right?

I would personally ask the friend to start the refund process, and go find a breeder whose program is worthy of support.

It is easy to love puppy breath--it's hearbreaking and expensive and frustrating, to wind up with a dog who cannot go fulfill dreams with you, due to health and temperament issues. It's frustrating to feel like you built the new wing on the vet clinic, and to watch others have fun with their dogs while you are home nursing yet another injury or illness.

Many who have started out with poorly bred dogs go on to become great, educated Doberman folks, many working in rescue or involved in dog shows or trials/dog sport.

The thing is, these folks here can help guide you to the less-heartbreaking way to get there--it's not a great feeling, as you learn more, to see the horrid conditions for these poor Doberman mamas, that get supported when people buy from brokers/mills/bybs.
 

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Bazinga!
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Looks like your typical byb puppy.

I assume, since you did do some reading, that you now realize no decent breeder would ever sell their puppies thru a broker like this, right?

I would personally ask the friend to start the refund process, and go find a breeder whose program is worthy of support.

It is easy to love puppy breath--it's hearbreaking and expensive and frustrating, to wind up with a dog who cannot go fulfill dreams with you, due to health and temperament issues. It's frustrating to feel like you built the new wing on the vet clinic, and to watch others have fun with their dogs while you are home nursing yet another injury or illness.

Many who have started out with poorly bred dogs go on to become great, educated Doberman folks, many working in rescue or involved in dog shows or trials/dog sport.

The thing is, these folks here can help guide you to the less-heartbreaking way to get there--it's not a great feeling, as you learn more, to see the horrid conditions for these poor Doberman mamas, that get supported when people buy from brokers/mills/bybs.

This, a million gazillion times over.
 

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Snuggle Monster
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I would personally ask the friend to start the refund process, and go find a breeder whose program is worthy of support.
This, Vicky. Try to explain to your friend that buying a puppy from a broker like this one does not "save" a puppy from a terrible fate; it supports this horrible, heartbreaking cycle and condemns dozens of other puppies to a life of misery. For every puppy that is "saved," dozens of other dogs will be bred and they will not all find homes as good as yours.

I would do everything you can to abort the purchase, immediately.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
This, Vicky. Try to explain to your friend that buying a puppy from a broker like this one does not "save" a puppy from a terrible fate; it supports this horrible, heartbreaking cycle and condemns dozens of other puppies to a life of misery. For every puppy that is "saved," dozens of other dogs will be bred and they will not all find homes as good as yours.

I would do everything you can to abort the purchase, immediately.
So I've been wrestling on the phone with them for about the past hour and a half to try and cancel. They are refusing to since it already has been paid in full with a signed contract. So at this point it's either lose the full 4k or hope for the best? Really not sure where to go with this one ....

I don't care if it's not the championship bloodlines or anything like that, I ultimately care about having a stable, healthy dog ... Stable especially since its father was 95 - 100lbs, the dog could literally grow to be less than 5 pounds lighter than myself. I've done all the research so a socialized dog I can handle, a dog this size with a not so pleasant temperament will be a little bit of a task (a scary one) for myself.
 

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I'd take the 4k hit, that was an expensive and very heartfelt gift but nobody should buy a dog as a gift...what if you didn't even want a dog right now, ya know?

Every penny given to these people will only encourage the brokers and the breeders to rake in the profit and churn out the poorly bred dogs.
It's an unfortunate lesson in gifting, dogs, and breeding/breeders that your friend will learn.

IF you do end up with this dog, invest in pet insurance immediately! it's the only safety net you will have on the potential costs that could be associated with this dog.
 

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So I've been wrestling on the phone with them for about the past hour and a half to try and cancel. They are refusing to since it already has been paid in full with a signed contract. So at this point it's either lose the full 4k or hope for the best? Really not sure where to go with this one ....

I don't care if it's not the championship bloodlines or anything like that, I ultimately care about having a stable, healthy dog ... Stable especially since its father was 95 - 100lbs, the dog could literally grow to be less than 5 pounds lighter than myself. I've done all the research so a socialized dog I can handle, a dog this size with a not so pleasant temperament will be a little bit of a task (a scary one) for myself.
Dont give up just yet. Keep demanding the money back. They are playing hardball because they are scammers. Get an attorney if you need one.
 

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Snuggle Monster
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Is this the site? About Us

If yes, call them back and FIGHT. Their website says "our puppies are from the best breeding lines and, of course, each puppy will go through a triple-check health screening."

Demand to know which lines this puppy is from. If YOU don't consider those the "best" lines, I would say it voids the contract. Same goes for health screening. Unless their health screening meets YOUR standards, they have not held up their end of the agreement. Unless they can prove that their lines truly are the "best" -- and that would have to be judged by an impartial third party, like a conformation judge, they did not keep their promise.
 

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I'm sorry you are in this situation. It's really unfortunate. I totally agree with RFR's advice above. (and all the other posters who posted while I was typing this! LOL)

A few other comments:

I don't care if it's not the championship bloodlines or anything like that, I ultimately care about having a stable, healthy dog ...
Read this thread to help you understand why it's so important to go with reputable/ethical breeders who title their dogs.

http://www.dobermantalk.com/breeding-breeders/98378-i-dont-want-show-dog-i-just-want-pet.html


I've done all the research so a socialized dog I can handle, a dog this size with a not so pleasant temperament will be a little bit of a task (a scary one) for myself.
You are so right. And doberman puppies are not an easy breed to have as puppies (even when well bred) for a newbie dog owner. They can very challenging.

As you probably know from your research, socialization begins when the puppy is a baby at the breeders home - in terms of how the puppy is raised (inside in the home, hearing all kinds of noises (dishwashers, vacuums, voices), meeting different people, being exposed to different textures, and all the other things a quality breeder does with it's puppies before they go to their homes, vs living in a cage or outdoor in a kennel, like these poor puppies probably have...

Also, temperament starts with genetics. We have heard many many sad stories about puppies from BYB or puppy mill breeders who sadly have less than desirable genetics/temperament. No matter how much socialization you personally do with a pup, sometimes the pup's deck is simply stacked against their favor and they may never recover from that.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I'd take the 4k hit, that was an expensive and very heartfelt gift but nobody should buy a dog as a gift...what if you didn't even want a dog right now, ya know?

Every penny given to these people will only encourage the brokers and the breeders to rake in the profit and churn out the poorly bred dogs.
It's an unfortunate lesson in gifting, dogs, and breeding/breeders that your friend will learn.

IF you do end up with this dog, invest in pet insurance immediately! it's the only safety net you will have on the potential costs that could be associated with this dog.
I guess he will take up disputing the charge with AMEX. I had been asking for a dog so I was totally up to it and extremely EXTREMELY excited.

I definitely never want to support the abuse of dogs, I just feel so sad to cancel, worried that I'm leaving a puppy in a really bad situation, but I also don't want to be handing over money to a puppymill, if that is the case. UGH this is the WORST.
 

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Is this the site? About Us

If yes, call them back and FIGHT. Their website says "our puppies are from the best breeding lines and, of course, each puppy will go through a triple-check health screening."

Demand to know which lines this puppy is from. If YOU don't consider those the "best" lines, I would say it voids the contract. Same goes for health screening. Unless their health screening meets YOUR standards, they have not held up their end of the agreement. Unless they can prove that their lines truly are the "best" -- and that would have to be judged by an impartial third party, like a conformation judge, they did not keep their promise.
That is exactly the site. I have tried to request information but it's literally like a run around. First, I had to be added to the puppy's account, did that. Then I asked about breeder info. They said they cannot provide breeder info, but I can speak on the phone with the breeder via a conference call while they stay on mute. Which already seems shady, but I assume as a middle man you do have to worry about the breeder cutting the price slightly and doing a side deal with potential buyers.

However, the puppy does come up to date on shots. It does get one last vet check before it is shipped. It comes with pedigree papers, AKC papers, and health check papers. He doesn't ship until the 10th of December. So I will sleep on it a few more nights.
 

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Snuggle Monster
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I also don't want to be handing over money to a puppymill, if that is the case. UGH this is the WORST.
It's not an "if," unfortunately. That IS the case.

It's hard, to break the cycle -- and it does suck -- but good on you. Think of your actions as hammering away at this puppymill. You are tearing down that wall, one brick at a time.

And, in regards to vet checks, being up to date on shots comes nowhere NEAR what is required for this breed.
 

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However, the puppy does come up to date on shots. It does get one last vet check before it is shipped. It comes with pedigree papers, AKC papers, and health check papers. He doesn't ship until the 10th of December. So I will sleep on it a few more nights.
This is meaningless when it comes to buying a doberman puppy. I would not bother thinking about it.

Selling doberman puppies through a broker like this is a violation of the Doberman Pinscher Club of America's ethics.

"11. No Doberman shall be sold to persons directly or indirectly involved with any puppy broker, puppy mill, pet shops selling dogs, litter lot sales or any other wholesale distributor whose business is involved in like activities. No Doberman shall be supplied for raffles, lotteries, or laboratory experiments."

The DPCA | Code of Ethics
 

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Feed Me
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You never know what you're going to get from a puppy mill/BYB, I personally think a doberman for your first dog ever is biting off a lot, let alone one of unknown temperment and health history.

Are you familiar with the amount of mental and physical stimulation the breed requires? You indicated you've done some research, I just hope that you've identified resources to help you with training/exercising/health/behavior if and when these issues arise. Point being: you'd rather return the dog now than get into a worst case scenario of a dog dying of dcm at 3 years of age, or having to be surrendered due to behavior issues/aggression or you can't control the dog and you give it up for adoption, each is a possibility without knowing the dogs history. Or, the dog could be completely fine and then your worst case is you contributed to a puppy mill. None of these are risks one wants to take on a (hopefully) 10-12 year commitment.
 

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That is exactly the site. I have tried to request information but it's literally like a run around. First, I had to be added to the puppy's account, did that. Then I asked about breeder info. They said they cannot provide breeder info, but I can speak on the phone with the breeder via a conference call while they stay on mute. Which already seems shady, but I assume as a middle man you do have to worry about the breeder cutting the price slightly and doing a side deal with potential buyers.

However, the puppy does come up to date on shots. It does get one last vet check before it is shipped. It comes with pedigree papers, AKC papers, and health check papers. He doesn't ship until the 10th of December. So I will sleep on it a few more nights.
Don't do it. I've been there. DH took me to a BYB with the kids in tow to meet a beautiful fawn boy. I felt terrible for the pup, he had ear mites, what looked like puppy staph and the guy was so clueless he couldn't remember exactly how old the pup was. We left empty handed. IT WAS HARD. But it was the right thing.

Few weeks later, met a breeder I connected with 45 mins away from my house. Visited her a few times. She had a litter on the ground but didn't tell me right away that a pup was available. Then one day she told me that she had one pup left and he could be ours if we wanted.

He's a good puppy, rock solid with the kids, very smart, everything we wanted. On top of this, my breeder is there for me all times of day and night, has been a voice of reason and sanity. She listens to me vent and gives me nothing but encouragement. All this is priceless when you're a first time dobe owner. Please take this into consideration when making your decision.

If you want a dobe puppy, ppl here will help you find the right breeder for you. This should not be an impulse purchase.
 
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