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Canela
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi, my name is Rachel. My husband Anthony and I bought Canela from a "breeder" last Monday. We have had quite a few complications so far, but I just wanted to thank everybody for sharing experiences on this site. I found some of the threads through google, and was able to diagnose her extremely early on with puppy strangles. I hope to figure out how to post a new thread about it, to reopen the subject. I just want for other dog owners that google as hard and diligently as me to be able to see the signs!

***P.S. If you are in the Southern CA area, please do not buy a Dobie puppy from a guy named Genaro/Ganaro/whatever. The puppies are beautiful, and I love my new baby girl more than anything... but he seriously has NO SINGLE CLUE about what he's doing when it comes to breeding, tail docking/dew claw removal, feeding properly, ANYTHING. Just trying to make a few bucks, I'm sure. For more on this, continue reading... Genaro took Canela down to Tijuana at just under 8 weeks old to have her tail AMPUTATED (way late!) and her dew claws removed (also WAY late...) Regardless of whether either procedure is humane or not, it is definitely NOT appropriate or humane to do it at this late of age by surgical procedure. I got the puppy and she had severe buildup in each of her ears. She had been fed such cheap food, that she couldn't hardly even poop!!! When I called him about the ears to see if any of the other puppies had displayed any similar symptoms, he said no and that he'd never had this problem. He blamed it on the dirt in the back yard. Luckily for him, it was strangles. So, it could be possible that none of the other puppies are having the same issues. The vet in Tijuana sutured her tail and front paws with thick nylon string, like a child would use to make jewelry. They are already mostly open, some from her chewing the paws. Just... don't... buy a puppy from him. They're cute and cheap, but he's stupid.
 

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Welcome to you and Canela. Sorry you are experiencing problems, however, this is not uncommon with less than reputable breeders. I will correct one thing in your post.... these puppies are not cheap. I am willing to bet that by the time it is all said and done, that you could have purchased a puppy from a reputable breeder for less than what this puppy will cost you as you go through the process of making things right.

Good luck with little Canela, and please post pictures. We love pictures!
 

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Holier Than Now
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Hi, my name is Rachel. My husband Anthony and I bought Canela from a "breeder" last Monday. We have had quite a few complications so far, but I just wanted to thank everybody for sharing experiences on this site. I found some of the threads through google, and was able to diagnose her extremely early on with puppy strangles. I hope to figure out how to post a new thread about it, to reopen the subject. I just want for other dog owners that google as hard and diligently as me to be able to see the signs!

***P.S. If you are in the Southern CA area, please do not buy a Dobie puppy from a guy named Genaro/Ganaro/whatever. The puppies are beautiful, and I love my new baby girl more than anything... but he seriously has NO SINGLE CLUE about what he's doing when it comes to breeding, tail docking/dew claw removal, feeding properly, ANYTHING. Just trying to make a few bucks, I'm sure. For more on this, continue reading... Genaro took Canela down to Tijuana at just under 8 weeks old to have her tail AMPUTATED (way late!) and her dew claws removed (also WAY late...) Regardless of whether either procedure is humane or not, it is definitely NOT appropriate or humane to do it at this late of age by surgical procedure. I got the puppy and she had severe buildup in each of her ears. She had been fed such cheap food, that she couldn't hardly even poop!!! When I called him about the ears to see if any of the other puppies had displayed any similar symptoms, he said no and that he'd never had this problem. He blamed it on the dirt in the back yard. Luckily for him, it was strangles. So, it could be possible that none of the other puppies are having the same issues. The vet in Tijuana sutured her tail and front paws with thick nylon string, like a child would use to make jewelry. They are already mostly open, some from her chewing the paws. Just... don't... buy a puppy from him. They're cute and cheap, but he's stupid.
Welcome to DT.

What does your veterinarian say now, about this poor puppy?

Also, the following questions (since tone doesn't always come across well on the web) are meant to be food for thought, not an "attack," okay?

Why did you choose to reward this man's abusive treatment of this litter, by paying him money?

Have you attempted to report him to authorities, and if so, what has been the outcome?

You obviously feel strongly that this man should NOT be rewarded for his bad behavior--strongly enough to want to warn others away from also paying him money--so what did you say to yourself that made it alright in your mind, for you to reward him and give him incentive to continue these unethical, inhumane practices?
 

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Canela
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Discussion Starter #5
Replies all around!!!

We met Canela at 7 weeks. She hadn't had the tail or claws removed yet, he told us the process and everything seemed "fine." This is our first puppy that wasn't from family, and our first Doberman. I did research afterward on the docking and removal and at that point I was caught extremely off guard. We love her, nonetheless, and are willing to fight for her to get 100% better :)

I did not mean that doberman puppies are cheap.. cheap from him, they were. We bought Canela for only $450, and it would have been $550 if we had her ears done. I agree, too. I've already been to the vet twice and I don't plan for those visits to be my last.


My veterinarian was extremely impressed with my research and ability to catch the strangles early on. During the first visit, we had seen a much younger vet who just said that she had a double ear infection, but upon further research, I was not convinced.


When we met the puppies, none of them had anything docked or removed (I wasn't educated on proper procedure at the time, either.) My husband grew up with a doberman puppy and was just dying to have another one. We have a long story to go with how we ended up buying a puppy in our area that exact day, but I won't go into detail on that.

I haven't reported him, because I didn't think that he had done anything illegal, per se. I know that he is not an appropriate breeder, but more just a person who has two dobermans who he lets mate together, and sells the puppies... if that makes sense. Also, to be honest he's an extremely nice guy, mid 20's, Mexican, and knows enough to talk up his sire and dam.

I completely understand where all of you are coming from, and it was a mistake that couldn't be taken back once it was done. "No refunds."

Thanks for all the feedback, guys.
 

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Okay seriously, some of the people on this forum are super rude. Did it ever occur to you, that even though the breeder sucks, that the puppy still needed a good home? The puppies shouldn't have to suffer because of the stupid breeder.

RachelAstete: Thank you for still adopting the puppy and I hope that the puppy's issues are not too hard on you.
 

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That's awful! At least you've rescued Canela. I feel sorry for the other puppies in her litter. He doesn't seem like such a nice guy if that's what he's doing to the pups. I would report him to the authorities. They might not be able to do anything, but then again they might.
 

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I haven't reported him, because I didn't think that he had done anything illegal, per se. I know that he is not an appropriate breeder, but more just a person who has two dobermans who he lets mate together, and sells the puppies... if that makes sense. Also, to be honest he's an extremely nice guy, mid 20's, Mexican, and knows enough to talk up his sire and dam.

*snip*.
the way he's getting these puppies docked and removing the dew claws to me would classify as lack of appropriate medical care, and cruelty, you loose nothing by reporting him and a few minutes on the phone. It may be the only thing that stops him or at least makes him educate himself.


Okay seriously, some of the people on this forum are super rude. Did it ever occur to you, that even though the breeder sucks, that the puppy still needed a good home? The puppies shouldn't have to suffer because of the stupid breeder.

RachelAstete: Thank you for still adopting the puppy and I hope that the puppy's issues are not too hard on you.
She did NOT adopt/rescue this dog, She bought her, is she in a better home? Yes
But she only increased the odds that more "canela's" and siblings will be brought into the world, raised poorly, and put through dangerously incorrect and dangerous surgeries.
You're right no puppy should suffer, but now more likely will because she paid for this one and essentially sent him the message he is doing nothing wrong.

If you want to rescue adopt, don't pay for and therefore support a byb.

(And yes op I know yours was a mistake, it can be hard to walk away from a puppy in that state but unfortunately you didn't help her siblings or future relatives but encouraged them to exist. Please stick around, learn, and understand we come from a place of deep passion)

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Holier Than Now
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the way he's getting these puppies docked and removing the dew claws to me would classify as lack of appropriate medical care, and cruelty, you loose nothing by reporting him and a few minutes on the phone. It may be the only thing that stops him or at least makes him educate himself.




She did NOT adopt/rescue this dog, She bought her, is she in a better home? Yes
But she only increased the odds that more "canela's" and siblings will be brought into the world, raised poorly, and put through dangerously incorrect and dangerous surgeries.
You're right no puppy should suffer, but now more likely will because she paid for this one and essentially sent him the message he is doing nothing wrong.

If you want to rescue adopt, don't pay for and therefore support a byb.

(And yes op I know yours was a mistake, it can be hard to walk away from a puppy in that state but unfortunately you didn't help her siblings or future relatives but encouraged them to exist. Please stick around, learn, and understand we come from a place of deep passion)

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Wish I could thank this post a thousand times, and saved me the trouble of typing out corrections to the posts about "rudeness" and "rescuing" from a badly behaving human, who is abusing dogs.

Canela's mommy, thank you for replying, and for your honesty in your answers.

Please do stick around the forum.

As Maya Angelou said: When we know better, we do better.

Little Canela may indeed lead you to Doberman education that winds up inspiring you to someday help with real rescue--many working in rescue now started out the way you have.

You should start a picture thread for her in puppy corner :)
 

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Apologies for misusing the word "rescue." I really didn't mean to upset anyone who works with rescue animals. It was just off the cuff.

And to Canela's mom, stick around. This is a really good resource. I wish you'd found it sooner, but now is better than never. :)
 

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When you rescue, you make space for another dog to be saved.
When you buy from a horrible "breeder", you make room for more puppies to be bred.

Simple as that.

It really is a lose lose situation. This guy is a scum bag and definitely deserves to be reported! I'm glad you got your puppy but I worry about the future puppies he will breed and the poor mother dog that will probably end up at a rescue once she's unable to continue her job as a puppy machine.

I agree we need to see pics of your baby! Glad she made it to a responsible home!


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u mad?
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Thanks to the few of you who have been kind to me... I was beginning to think that I had stumbled upon some Mean Girls/Dobie Elitist forum, and was beginning to regret my decision... I think there are a bunch of bullies on this site who like to jump to conclusions waaaaay too fast. I'm a good dog mom, I don't deserve the interrogation.
This site is not for the thin-skinned but it's full of great information.
 

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endangered species
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No reason to become defensive.

I know when I first came here, Michael and I were not familiar with Dobermans (yeah, check out my first thread). Thankfully, more knowledgeable members were here to educate us. First, I had to sit back and listen, not letting my ego get into the way. If the conversation started going in a direction that I’m unfamiliar with and I can’t control, I just kick back and listen. And as I listen, I’m learning.

Life is a series of repeated experiences. Two weeks later, I might find myself in another conversation about Dobermans with a friend, something I never knew about before that first conversation. And because I sat back and listened the first time, I’m now able to contribute. By contributing to this new conversation, I earn respect, and I learn even more about the topic.

People often overreact because they think that members trying to help them are "mean girls" waiting to burn you. But the truth is, people respect you when you listen and show a willingness to learn. If you don’t know what you’re talking about, it’s okay to sit back and listen.

Everyone comes to the board with a clean slate and the actions they take while being here dictates if they will stay a contributing member or be somebody who stays in the past. And if they are somebody in the past, I'm not always convinced they ever wanted the help.

When you're ready to listen and need advice, we’ll be here. :)
 

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My husband and I still don't think that the guy has done anything illegal.
The fact that he's going to Tijuana to get the procedures done should concern anyone!!

And only an extra $100 to have the ears cropped? Yikes thank god you didn't opt to have yours cropped I bet they would turn out horrible. Probably done in Tijuana as well....with scissors. :(

I don't understand why you're getting defensive either. You recommended people don't buy from him, we agree. He's scum. What's the issue? Now if you were defending his breeding practices then you'd have some serious backlash.


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I think it's really easy to feel overwhelmed with so many people asking such direct questions. I think most people's first reaction when you feel like you have been backed into a corner is to put your back up.

At this point the damage is done, the dog has been purchased, and you're doing the right thing trying to reach out to potential buyers and stop them from going to this douche.

Anyways, that's just my two cents. I really hope you stick around!

Cheers!
 

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endangered species
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I absolutely agree. The power of indirect speech can go a long ways. For example if I need to say something unpleasant to someone I would use the "indirect speech" such as "I think next time it would be worth reconsidering the implications of buying from a BYB, as it hurts the breed", rather than a more direct accusatory tone. I know which one I would prefer.
 
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