Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums banner
1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi there-
My wife and I just got a first doberman. We got him from a rescue and picked him up yesterday. It has been a long process in trying to find the right doberman for us from a rescue. We have a female cavalier king charles who is a year and a half old and needed to introduce her to our new family member. We saw multiple dogs from the rescue. Some aggressive towards her and some overly submissive towards my dog and me. It was to the point where some dogs would lay on their stomach lower their head when I walked up to it. It bothered me as it appeared to be fear of men.

About a week ago, we were notified from the rescue that she had a 5 month red male. Not sure how she came to the conclusion he was five months. He is tall but doesn't have to much weight on him. We met him last week and introduced him to our cavalier Saturday. During the introduction, our cavalier seemed to be putting him in his place. She is far from aggressive. However, if our dobie got a little to rough she would warn him with a growl. Our dobie would turn his head and walk away. We figured he would be a good match and he is a handsome young boy. The other nice thing about him is he is potty trained, create trained, ears cropped tail docked, dewclaws removed and neutered.

We brought him home and named him Buddy. Everything is going well for the most part. He did like to jump on people however, we quickly rectified the situation by using the Caesar Milan method of using our hand to mimic a dog bite with a firm NO. He has not tried to jump since.

Saturday night they were both playing together and chasing each other around the yard and were enjoying each others company. We left them both together unattended for about 30 minutes on Sunday while going to pick up a few thing from the grocery store. When we came home they were both sleeping on the patio. I got him a bone from the store because I was told he was possibly teething. I gave him the bone and he loved it. I also gave my cavalier a bone but she was more interested in his. I'm assuming because his was much bigger. They both licked the bone and chewed it a bit but after a few minutes he snapped at her and growled. I again used a firm NO! and used my hand as a biting motion. He immediately layed on his stomach and lowered his head and gave me the puppy look. I told him " bad boy" and took the bone from both of them. My wife and I both have pulled his food from him while he was eating an he showed no aggression.

So now, after the long post here are my questions.

1) One thing I noticed he was doing is jumping over my other dog and is trying to stand over her. Is he trying to be the alpa male? I think that why he snapped at her? He also has a bunch of toys but is more interested in the ones my cavalier has and would take them from her when she had them.

Would you consider him snapping at my cavalier as food aggressive or an isolated incident trying to show dominance? When we have fed them both he does not snap or growl at my cavalier when eating if she is next to him. We have since been feeding them separately.

2) Is there any way to determine how old he actually is?

3) He has a bald spot on the tip of his tail and he keeps chewing it. Is this common? His skin is dry and he has what looks like dandruff but his coat is shinny. Maybe a crappy diet?

I am very surprised on how fast he has learned. We taught him to sit and he learned it with in the first day. He still has to think about what to do but after a few commands he will sit. He also learned the come command after a bit. I am signing him up for obedience classes today and hopefully we will start next week. I have been taking him on two 30 minute walks a day with my cavalier he has learned its easier not to pull. After walking him, he will be much calmer and doesn't bother my cavalier.

Sorry for the long post. I am very happy with Buddy but want to make sure I train him to be a good boy. I have been reading may posts on this forum and they have been very helpful. I also got a book on doberman and dog training to help me understand as much as I can. Thanks again.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,230 Posts
GOOD ON YA FOR GETTING A RESCUE!! Now to your questions...
1. The jumping over and standing over the little one is what I would describe as normal play. That being said, just keep an eye on them. Dober puppies are extremely energetic and play quite rough. Don't leave them out alone together right now, crate the pup when you can't keep a watchful eye. The "I want what you have, even though I have the exact same thing" is also totally normal, but can get ugly. High value chewies and bones CAN lead to resource guarding. We usually give them separately or watch carefully.

2. Does your pup have any baby "needle teeth" left?

3. Could be a docking nueroma(I think that's what its called) but someone here will know better than me.

Again, THANK YOU for rescuing. What rescue?
 

·
u mad?
Joined
·
6,476 Posts
Welcome to DT and thank you for adopting :]

A lot of people here, including me, will suggest a more positive way of training as the whole "dominance theory" set of mind is rather outdated. My thought is that your dogs have only known each other for a few days, I would not be leaving them alone unattended. That does not seem safe to me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,748 Posts
I rescued a red boy at about 4 months and he had a pretty rough coat. I have been giving him salmon oil on his food. He is now a year old and his coat looks great. At a year and the only dog, I wouldn't leave Oliver out when he's alone. Please crate him when you are gone, they can get into a lot of trouble unattended.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Thanks for the fast replies. I left for the gym this morning and put both dogs in their own crates. I set the crates side by side so they can see each other. Buddy whined for a minute or so but eventually fell a sleep. Now that Im home, they are both next to each other happy in the yard beside me. Its almost like they bonded. They did the same thing yesterday after we took both of them for a walk. I will continue to do this and hopefully they will become better friends. Also here's a pic.

Dog Mammal Vertebrate Dog breed Canidae
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,681 Posts
Okay, I think puppies need to chew and I would put him in a crate to chew his stuff. I would have corrected your older dog for bothering him when he was chewing on something, not the puppy for snapping. He was telling her to leave him alone, she was the rude one and should not be allowed to walk over and try to take (or share) his bone. To stop that from happening in the future just separate them while they chew on stuff. I would not be grabbing him in the ceasar neck grab, he hasn't done anything to deserve it, you must teach him what you want first. Be a little more gentle with the pup, if he is turning over on his back that is showing you how submissive he is. No yelling, no grabbing, just gently show him what you want. I think you need to get to an obedience class asap so you can learn how to teach him. I have a doberman and smaller dogs so I understand you are worried but you don't need to be as it sounds like they have a good relationship already. Keep her away from his food dish too and the same with him and hers. Remember the key is manners from both and good luck. He sounds like a very sweet guy, you lucked out. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
158 Posts
Thank you for rescuing !
I would say give them some time adapting to each other and to establish a hierarchy. There is nothing bad about it, it is normal. I would not intervene to much in this process, but supervise it carefully so nothing escalates and nobody gets hurt.
It is not unusual that rescues are food jealous towards other dogs, but thats something different than food aggressive. I would consider it normal for now. I always supervise feeding time carefully. My experience with treats like bones is that first they fight for the bone (as long as it is considered a new resource) and after a while they share it.
I second Patchworkrobot - the dominance theory is actually outdated, you should consider other nice and easy to learn methods. For example with a jumping dog you can just turn around and "punish" him with no attention. Works nicely. And be carefully with suppressing your dogs aggression (not meant negatively), especially in the process of establishing a hierarchy. You don´t want a dog that redirects his aggession somewhere it doesn´t belong.
Again thank you for rescuing, rescues are wonderful dogs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thank you all very much. I will do all the above mentioned techniques until we start our obedience classes. I just got back from signing him up but the class doesn't start until the first week of November. I've also been doing a lot more reading since I have today and tomorrow off from work. I've been using the more gentle techniques and it seems to be working well.
I am obviously a novice at dog training and it was super easy to train our cavalier because she is very wall manured. I grew up around dogs and my parents used the more aggressive approach so I figured it would work but they haven't had a puppy for almost 12 years lol. Thanks again. I just love him to death though. He is really warming up to us and shows a lot of affection.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
99 Posts
Hi Daniel,

I'm have alot of the same questions as you and have been gradually seeking out answers.

I have a 3 year old jack russell boy and 5 month old dobe girl. She plays really rough with him and it scares him a little. She jumps over him and paws at him and sometimes he'll correct and other times he'll just get overwhelmed and disappear.

I found it helped to give the little guy a safe place where he knows she doesn't go. For us, he's allowed upstairs and she isn't...so whenever he needs a break, he scurries upstairs to go take a nap. Its important he can feel safe and like he can get away whenever he needs.

It takes a really long time for them to grow used to eachother. Particularly when u're old dog is used to being number one. Give them time with as little interference as possible - let them work it out, but stay close so no accidents happen and no one gets hurt.

Leave toys and chews out of the equation for now, they'll play with eachother when they wanna interact and be playful. Leave chews as crate treats for both until u're 100% confident with their relationship.

Other than that, just watch and enjoy their relationship develop :)

6 weeks on and my 2 still aren't great. She loves him, but he's still unsure - but at least interacts with her now which he wasn't doing before. It'll take time. Don't force them, just let them work it out.

He's a beautiful dobe.

Hope it all works out ok.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I have a 3 year old jack russell boy and 5 month old dobe girl. She plays really rough with him and it scares him a little. She jumps over him and paws at him and sometimes he'll correct and other times he'll just get overwhelmed and disappear.
He is doing the same exact thing and she is acting the same way. Im going to try to let her upstairs and leave her food and water dish on the landing. She wont drink water unless i stand in front of buddy so hopefully this will help. Thanks for the response.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
716 Posts
@Danielp59
@DeeHaleem

I think you might want to read the other thread titled
*** Is Von Ryan breeding killers***
It's far off from what your talking about but I think the issues with Doberman and other dogs which are notiably different sizes is a very serious topic.

I have worked with my Kira since she came home all 8 weeks of her, so naturally this is easier for a new baby to learn.
We've all had our faces in her face. Also taught her to be gentle with taking cheese from my mouth (Ya I did say my mouth)
I could eat her bone out of her mouth if I wanted to, and the rest of the family could as well.
This was very (and is very important) with all dogs, the non food aggression.

I would make sure to work on this with the new pup ASAP...

The tail chewing thing... I would think someone on "Doberman Talk" or at PetCo. knows about a cream you can apply like the "stop bitting" stuff girls put on their nails, which will taste pretty grose to him!!!

******** And by the way *********
He is absoultly the most beautiful little red boy ever!
I can't believe he's a rescue!
He looks just like my girl!
The nose... I love the big red nose!

:huepfenicon111:
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,560 Posts
Much too early to leave them unsupervised together. Also, the pup is young and probably not trustworthy in the house yet. You don't want to give him the opportunity to destroy stuff! Crates are a good thing.

My two dogs are the best of friends, and I still do not allow them to chew high value things like bones while they are together. It's very easy for dogs to get possessive over stuff like that. Guarding from other dogs is also different than guarding from people, which is why you may not see him reacting to you at the food bowl.

I highly recommend a couple of books for you: Pat Miller's "The Power of Positive Dog Training;" "Culture Clash" by Jean Donaldson, and Turid Rugaas's book "On Talking Terms with Dogs: Calming Signals." I suggest you check out the "recommended reading" thread here on DT. To nip the resource guarding in the bud, pick up a copy of Jean Donaldson's book, "Mine! A Practical Guide to Resource Guarding in Dogs." It's cheap (around $10 on Amazon.com) and it's very easy to follow, with a step-by-step proecess for you.
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top