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Hi my name is Kenny. I am constantly looking for advice from Doberman owners on ear posting. I am a first time Doberman owner. First time owning a dog I’ve needed to post the ears up for so this is all new to me. My Doberman is about to hit 10 months and his ears are inconsistent. His left ear stands up and his right ear won’t. Sometimes even his left won’t either. He had a incident when he was 5 months old and we had to leave his ears down for almost 2 months to heal. After we restarted posting we have been very consistent and his left ear is back to making progress but his right ear is being stubborn. I’m running out of hope because he is getting older and I don’t know if they’ll ever stand. Everyone keeps saying don’t give up and I’m trying not to but I’m running out of hope. Please if you have advice feel free to share. Thank you
 

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Hi my name is Kenny. I am constantly looking for advice from Doberman owners on ear posting. I am a first time Doberman owner. First time owning a dog I’ve needed to post the ears up for so this is all new to me. My Doberman is about to hit 10 months and his ears are inconsistent. His left ear stands up and his right ear won’t. Sometimes even his left won’t either. He had a incident when he was 5 months old and we had to leave his ears down for almost 2 months to heal. After we restarted posting we have been very consistent and his left ear is back to making progress but his right ear is being stubborn. I’m running out of hope because he is getting older and I don’t know if they’ll ever stand. Everyone keeps saying don’t give up and I’m trying not to but I’m running out of hope. Please if you have advice feel free to share. Thank you
OK Kenny--since the puppy already had a setback with his ears not being posted for two months it just means it's going to take longer to get them to properly stand.

Absolutely don't give up hope. One of my show prospect males had a long show crow and although one ear stood at about 5 months with no problems the other stood but wilted the longer it was not posted. That dog went to shows with his ear posted--we took it down shortly before he went in the ring and put it back up as soon as he was finished showing---he was over 18 months before that ear stood properly and had over half of his championship points.

I can't get more specific than keep posting because I don't know how you are posting and what the ear that isn't standing is doing so that it doesn't stand. Take pictures--with the ears posted from the side, from the front and do the same thing with them unposted and I'll see if I can see what exactly the problem is. But it may be simply that they need to be posted longer.

How old was the puppy when he had to be left unposted--2 months is a really long time for ears to be unposted the younger he was when this happened (and what exactly happened?

Bottom line is 10 weeks is really too soon to give up.

dobebug (aka Bug Russell)
 

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Right now his ears are currently posted so I will send a picture of them. The incident happened when he was around 5 months. It happened on June 5 and we started posting them again on July 20 but anyway he was in his cage one day and he was shaking his head furiously and nonstop. His cage wasn’t the biggest yet because he was still being potty trained and crate trained. Whenever he would shake his ears his ears would his the wall of the cage and the impacts of the hits over and over eventually busted some of his ear glands leaving his ear extremely infected. I wanted to try and but a gauge over all of it and keep posting to not lose progress but it was to bad of an injury to heal while in the post. So that’s what happened
 

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Discussion Starter #4
When I restarted posting I used the zip
tie method. But it seemed to do know effect so I went back to the backer rod method which i have been doing for a month now. I wrap the ear with cloth tape against the backer rod and I secure it with duct tape at the bottom so it doesn’t pop out from him constantly shaking it. If you have any solutions on how to help with the shaking as well feel free to share. As you can see his left ear is doing ok, the pictures with the lime green stuff in his ear is when we did the zip tie method. His ears look like that without the post one up one down and the last one is how his ears look when the incident happened and why we had to leave them down for over a month
135871
1A5F225D-A9F3-4179-85A1-6C886A197D44.jpeg
CA253882-14BA-4C66-B981-92D88AE36A58.jpeg
822DCEBF-68E0-49F9-B188-BC043C1710AE.jpeg
17234F2E-1F6F-43C5-80C6-9DB235E03154.jpeg
 

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Sorry, Ken--my ability to check my outgoing posts for error is terrible. That last comment where I said 10 weeks is too to give up should have read "10 months" is too soon to give up.

Here's a tip for future reference--when a puppy continuously shakes, paws at or otherwise tries to get his posts out it usually means that the post didn't go all the way down into the bottom of the ear canal. Tapering the bottom of the post material, back taping it, and putting in a little (very small) piece of cotton at the very bottom of the post helps to prevent that from happening. When a post is not all the way down in the ear canal (you can't damage the ear drum because in dogs the canal makes a right turn before it gets to the ear canal). Also twist it a little while you are putting the post in the ear helps to get it fully into the canal.

With any kind of infection particularly when it was caused by a trauma the best thing you can do is bite the bullet and leave the ears unposted until they are fully healed. Unfortunate but sometimes stuff happens...

dobebug
 

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Sorry, Ken--my ability to check my outgoing posts for error is terrible. That last comment where I said 10 weeks is too to give up should have read "10 months" is too soon to give up.

Here's a tip for future reference--when a puppy continuously shakes, paws at or otherwise tries to get his posts out it usually means that the post didn't go all the way down into the bottom of the ear canal. Tapering the bottom of the post material, back taping it, and putting in a little (very small) piece of cotton at the very bottom of the post helps to prevent that from happening. When a post is not all the way down in the ear canal (you can't damage the ear drum because in dogs the canal makes a right turn before it gets to the ear canal). Also twist it a little while you are putting the post in the ear helps to get it fully into the canal.

With any kind of infection particularly when it was caused by a trauma the best thing you can do is bite the bullet and leave the ears unposted until they are fully healed. Unfortunate but sometimes stuff happens...

dobebug
No worry I knew what you meant. I will keep that in mind the next time I post his ears. I’m nervous when doing them because I don’t want to stick it too deep and then hurt the dog but that makes more since. Whenever I add the cotton ball or such at the end it usually makes it harder to be snug in his ear so I started just doing the backer rod alone. When the incident happened my mom is a nurse and she was telling me the wounds are too deep and they won’t heal unless we give them the proper time without posting and I wanted to fine a way to help them heal without stopping cause I knew the risk but it was a tough call and I’m gonna put my dogs health before anything. What tape do you recommend to be best though because medical tape is too tight and pulls his hair and other tape like paper tape is too lose and doesn’t keep it tight enough on the ear.
 

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When I restarted posting I used the zip
tie method. But it seemed to do know effect so I went back to the backer rod method which i have been doing for a month now. I wrap the ear with cloth tape against the backer rod and I secure it with duct tape at the bottom so it doesn’t pop out from him constantly shaking it. If you have any solutions on how to help with the shaking as well feel free to share. As you can see his left ear is doing ok, the pictures with the lime green stuff in his ear is when we did the zip tie method. His ears look like that without the post one up one down and the last one is how his ears look when the incident happened and why we had to leave them down for over a month View attachment 135871 View attachment 135867 View attachment 135868 View attachment 135869 View attachment 135870
That's a long crop--I'm not surprised that the zip tie method didn't work well on it--the zip tie method works best when the base of the ear is cropped so that it narrows the entrance to the canal substantially--that is done by taking a 'v' section out of the base, suturing that and making the bell much narrower as well.

The base of your crop is one that is really hard to get the post in and far enough down to keep it from wiggling in the puppy's ear--so I'm not surprised that he was trying to shake it out. He did make a mess of himself.

So--some suggestions--if you have not been backtaping the post when doing the backer rod method you should do that--it does help keep the post immovable. So you would tape the backer rod as you've be doing and then after it's taped take more tape (the cloth tape--like J & & Zonas or J & J Sport tape) and tape the post again with the sticky side out.

On the brighter side of things the picture of what his ear was doing before is an ear that doesn't drop from the head so you should with persistence be able to get it to stand.

I am presently working on a young dog (older than your boy--he's closer to 18 months now I think) and the base of his ear was cropped much like your puppy's ear. Very open base. The European crops (in the countries where they still can crop) are more like that and I've started posting his ear like the Euro crops are done. We'd call it a half post but it's not quite that--but because it's so difficult to get a post all the way down and solidly in the ear the way I am posting the puppy I'm dealing with now is to place the post right above the little raised knob in the ear instead of in the canal. Start the tape on the back taped post--tape forward toward the front of the ear and pull the ear up while holding the post in place--wrap the tape around the little fold at the base and when you get to the back of the ear, push the edge of the bell toward the front of the ear--this will narrow the opening when you stick the tape to the place where you started it. This means that you are taping up, around, and back down. You'll be taping either clockwise on the left ear I think. You're just taping the one ear? That's probably what I'd do. I put two or three short lengths of tape each one slightly higher than the one before to hold the base in place. Don't pull the tape tight--use your fingers to push the bell forward to narrow that gap. Then, in case of this particular ear problem I'd fully tape the ear up the post--laying the tape on not pulling it and when you are through you can scrunch the tape onto the ear and post by squeezing it with your hand.

If this is all as clear as mud--ask questions--it's a little different than what you've been doing but it should be less irritating since the post is no longer in the ear canal. In this type of posting the all important part is those first wraps.

Sometime in that European model they will before they start posting they will take a piece of the tape (has to be at least 1" wide--1-1/2" is better and fold the tape over the cropped edge from opposite where that bump (which is where you are going to place the post) so that it acts as a stiffener (you are folding it across the ear edge) it should go up the edge about to where your thumb is. Then go ahead with the actual post.

I would not use duct tape anywhere it might come in contact with the skin--it has caused to horrible reactions when used that way. But if you aren't trying to get a post to stay in that very shallow open ear canal you shouldn't have to use it. That Euro type post may work better for your puppy.

Kenny--what is that green stuff?--if it's sticky you could probably use that instead of tape as a stiffener for that ear edge and then post the ear.

I hope this help--let me know--I'll follow your thread so you can ask questions and post pictures--it really helps to see exactly what is happening with the ear both posted and unposted. So thanks for posting the pictures.

dobebug
 

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I'm just one of those people who will say to keep on posting. It takes time. Sometimes a lot of time. I posted my one guy until he was about 17 months old. He also had one that just wasn't cooperating but eventually we got there. It was the longest I've ever posted, and I've raised quite a number of puppies and had lots of posting experience.
 

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No worry I knew what you meant. I will keep that in mind the next time I post his ears. I’m nervous when doing them because I don’t want to stick it too deep and then hurt the dog but that makes more since. Whenever I add the cotton ball or such at the end it usually makes it harder to be snug in his ear so I started just doing the backer rod alone. When the incident happened my mom is a nurse and she was telling me the wounds are too deep and they won’t heal unless we give them the proper time without posting and I wanted to fine a way to help them heal without stopping cause I knew the risk but it was a tough call and I’m gonna put my dogs health before anything. What tape do you recommend to be best though because medical tape is too tight and pulls his hair and other tape like paper tape is too lose and doesn’t keep it tight enough on the ear.
The best tape to use is Johnson & Johnson Zonas or Johnson & Johnson Sport tape. If your mom is a nurse and if there is a medical supply house where ever you live you might be able to get the Zonas tape there--you can get it on line easily--Amazon carries it, I think Walmart carries it as a catalog item. The Johnson & Johnson Sport tape (used to be called Coach tape) is exactly the same tape except they relabled for the sports market instead of the medical market. Walmart used to carry the Coach tape in their stores then they started carrying a line of their own labeled stuff--did not work as well but very recently the Walmart in my neck of the woods (Portland, Oregon) has started carrying the J & J Sports tape. I don't like the paper tapes at all--they don't want to conform to the ear shape and the adhesive is weird.

If you end up ordering the J & J Zonas tape order some "UniSolve"--this is an adhesive softener and will help remove tapes without pulling the hair. Posting ears is going to pull some hair out but it grows back.

Find the sticky in the ear posting section by greenkouki--the posting section is very good and you can use almost all of his direction if you decide to try the Euro post method and he also has a really good video about removed taped posts painlessly.

Good luck--tell us how it goes.

dobebug
 

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How long are you leaving his ears unposted? I'm assuming everything is healed up now? If so, you really don't want to leave them unposted any longer than it takes to clean them, let them dry, and then you need to repost them right up again.

I would recommend you find an experienced Doberman person near you to help show you in person how to post, if you haven't done that. A couple of "hands-on" lessons can be really, really helpful to see what you might be doing wrong. I'd go to the DPCA website and click on the "chapter club" link and contact the club closest to you. www.dpca.org. Chapter clubs have people that are really active in Dobermans, and I know my club has had quite a few people contact us for help. We're always willing to help a new person learn how to do this.

This is also another vote to just be persistent. My girl has one ear that took longer than the other, and it was close to a year old for her ear to be finished.
 

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Eek! You aren’t using duct tape directly on his ear, are you??? That will pull hair and skin off.
 

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Yep, keep posting. I've had dogs take over a year to get one ear to stand. The type of post Dobebug is talking about should work. I'll see if i can find my pictures of it so you can see what she is talking about. I think somewhere there is a thread about how to do it. I'm bad at finding them. Also google the great dane lady - she had great pictures on how to do it. I use zip ties, but they are the much bigger 2 foot long ones that I cut to fit - and then round the edges so they are not sharp. I reuse them so I don't have to cut new ones every time. You might actually want to post both ears so that you can brace them.
This is what they look like - I'm sorry that I don't have any pictures of what they look like to make and put in.
IMG_1855 by Mary Jo Ansel, on Flickr
IMG_1853 by Mary Jo Ansel, on Flickr
 

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Yep, keep posting. I've had dogs take over a year to get one ear to stand. The type of post Dobebug is talking about should work. I'll see if i can find my pictures of it so you can see what she is talking about. I think somewhere there is a thread about how to do it. I'm bad at finding them. Also google the great dane lady - she had great pictures on how to do it. I use zip ties, but they are the much bigger 2 foot long ones that I cut to fit - and then round the edges so they are not sharp. I reuse them so I don't have to cut new ones every time. You might actually want to post both ears so that you can brace them.
This is what they look like - I'm sorry that I don't have any pictures of what they look like to make and put in.
IMG_1855 by Mary Jo Ansel, on Flickr
IMG_1853 by Mary Jo Ansel, on Flickr
Oh ok thank you for this info. Is that a a popsicle or zip tie or something. It looks really sturdy and I might use this method.
 

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Eek! You aren’t using duct tape directly on his ear, are you??? That will pull hair and skin off.
[/QUOTE
Yes but this didn’t last for long we did this method for around 3 weeks but his hair has grown back so all good.
 

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How long are you leaving his ears unposted? I'm assuming everything is healed up now? If so, you really don't want to leave them unposted any longer than it takes to clean them, let them dry, and then you need to repost them right up again.

I would recommend you find an experienced Doberman person near you to help show you in person how to post, if you haven't done that. A couple of "hands-on" lessons can be really, really helpful to see what you might be doing wrong. I'd go to the DPCA website and click on the "chapter club" link and contact the club closest to you. www.dpca.org. Chapter clubs have people that are really active in Dobermans, and I know my club has had quite a few people contact us for help. We're always willing to help a new person learn how to do this.

This is also another vote to just be persistent. My girl has one ear that took longer than the other, and it was close to a year old for her ear to be finished.
Because of progress being lost we don’t leave his ears down at all. I take his old ones down clean them and then repost.
 

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The best tape to use is Johnson & Johnson Zonas or Johnson & Johnson Sport tape. If your mom is a nurse and if there is a medical supply house where ever you live you might be able to get the Zonas tape there--you can get it on line easily--Amazon carries it, I think Walmart carries it as a catalog item. The Johnson & Johnson Sport tape (used to be called Coach tape) is exactly the same tape except they relabled for the sports market instead of the medical market. Walmart used to carry the Coach tape in their stores then they started carrying a line of their own labeled stuff--did not work as well but very recently the Walmart in my neck of the woods (Portland, Oregon) has started carrying the J & J Sports tape. I don't like the paper tapes at all--they don't want to conform to the ear shape and the adhesive is weird.

If you end up ordering the J & J Zonas tape order some "UniSolve"--this is an adhesive softener and will help remove tapes without pulling the hair. Posting ears is going to pull some hair out but it grows back.

Find the sticky in the ear posting section by greenkouki--the posting section is very good and you can use almost all of his direction if you decide to try the Euro post method and he also has a really good video about removed taped posts painlessly.

Good luck--tell us how it goes.

dobebug
Yes my mother brings medical tape home but I’m nervous to use that on his skin because it is very strong.
 

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Kenny,

Use the tape your mother brings home. All tapes have adhesives and some tapes are more adhesive than others but there are products to help loosen tapes so they don't pull out so much hair and don't damage the skin. The best of them (in my opinion) is Smith and Nephew's UniSolve. The company is in Florida and here is an 800 phone number for customer assistance 1 800 876-1261. It can be ordered from many places (Amazon, Walmart) on line. But if you have to pay shipping it makes the Uni-Solve rather expensive.

Also to help remove almost any sort of adhesive used on tapes you can soften it up with oil--almost any kind of oil, mineral oil, baby oil, cooking oil (like Wesson oil) It's messier to use and takes more clean up (you need to remove the oil before trying to repost with something like Dawn dishwashing detergent and water. If use that and work it under the edges of the tape with your finger tips or a Q-tip that will loosen the adhesive.

The bottom line is to NOT just pull the tape to get it off--that will be painful and can damage skin but medical tapes like the Johnson & Johnson Zonas tape and a variety of 3M tapes used on people whose skin is more easily damaged than a dogs skin can be safely used if you take appropriate time to loosen the tape before you pull it off.


Good luck.

dobebug
 

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Oh ok thank you for this info. Is that a a popsicle or zip tie or something. It looks really sturdy and I might use this method.
It's a zip tie, but like 2' long ones that are used for some larger applications - they are much heavier duty than an average zip tie. I think I got the ones I have at a home depot or Lowes many years ago. I cut them to fit and round off the edges - then I reuse them for as long as I can..... which is why I have not had to buy them for many years - haha.
 
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Discussion Starter #19
It's a zip tie, but like 2' long ones that are used for some larger applications - they are much heavier duty than an average zip tie. I think I got the ones I have at a home depot or Lowes many years ago. I cut them to fit and round off the edges - then I reuse them for as long as I can..... which is why I have not had to buy them for many years - haha.
How did you get your dog not to shake the post out though because mine will not give up until they are out
 

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Yes my mother brings medical tape home but I’m nervous to use that on his skin because it is very strong.
Kenny,

Use the tape your mother brings home. All tapes have adhesives and some tapes are more adhesive than others but there are products to help loosen tapes so they don't pull out so much hair and don't damage the skin. The best of them (in my opinion) is Smith and Nephew's UniSolve. The company is in Florida and here is an 800 phone number for customer assistance 1 800 876-1261. It can be ordered from many places (Amazon, Walmart) on line. But if you have to pay shipping it makes the Uni-Solve rather expensive.

Also to help remove almost any sort of adhesive used on tapes you can soften it up with oil--almost any kind of oil, mineral oil, baby oil, cooking oil (like Wesson oil) It's messier to use and takes more clean up (you need to remove the oil before trying to repost with something like Dawn dishwashing detergent and water. If use that and work it under the edges of the tape with your finger tips or a Q-tip that will loosen the adhesive.

The bottom line is to NOT just pull the tape to get it off--that will be painful and can damage skin but medical tapes like the Johnson & Johnson Zonas tape and a variety of 3M tapes used on people whose skin is more easily damaged than a dogs skin can be safely used if you take appropriate time to loosen the tape before you pull it off.


Good luck.

dobebug
How do I get him to stop shaking the post out though? I try sticking it all the in his ear and using different methods but he always tries his hardest to get them out.
 
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