Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums banner

1 - 20 of 37 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey gang. I'm happy i found this site and sad at the same time because i found it while researching my next step with my girl of 12 years (red doberman) Gypsy.

I need some advice from people familiar with the doberman. My girl had a huge lump under her 3rd mammary gland, it showed up litterally over night. The vet said it was inffected and he found an additional small lump in the 5th. She had the 3rd and 4th gland removed and part of the 5th. He had done test prior and it had not spread to her lungs or any vital organs. Surgery went well and she is doing fine.

Today i got the call from the vet and the tumors were cancerous. He stated that some stuff was showing on her lymph nodes, i was so shocked i can barely recal what was saud. She goes in on saturday to remove the stitches from the surgery and i will ask additional questions.

What i wanted to askof you guys is your thoughts.

Gypsy will be turning 12 in January and her only issues other than the diagnosis i got today is that her hips are going bad. If she turns qickly she can lose her footing but other than that she seems fine and active.

I never spayed because she had vomwilabran and she was miss diagnosed when i originally got her. In any evernt the vet says i can her go through Chemo, an additional surgery to spay (sp?) her or do nothing and see how she does.

My concern is that from everything i have read, she has done great to reach 12 and healthy. I'm afraid that putting her through Chemo will affect her adversely and dimish her quality of life. I'm torn and dreading the day i lose her. She has survived my ex wife and gf and been with me through so much.

Considering her age and the type of cancer (mammary) do you folks think that chemo would be worth it?

Thank you for anything you can provide, this is so tough. For a guy that prides himself in being so tough and macho i'm in tears at the moment :(

Joe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,895 Posts
I am so sorry to hear about Gypsy's situation. I have no advice. Do you trust and like your vet enough to discuss with him what he thinks? ....and then you can decide what you think.
This is when I wish they could talk. Playing God is difficult.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,977 Posts
It didn't happen to be a Doberman but I had an Australian Shepherd who at nearly 13 was diagnosed with lymphoma (another type of cancer). Most forms of lymphoma respond well to chemo and the dog can go into remission, sometimes for lengthy periods of time. Unfortunately it is also the case that the older the dog is the shorter the remission period and the more the dog is likely to have some problems to the chemo (dogs, typically don't have as much trouble with chemo or radiation as people but that's all sort of relative).

I made a decision at that point to not do chemo put to take palliative measures only (in this case he was put on a fairly high dose of prednisone) and make him happy for as long as he clearly felt well. I had him for another month. The pred gave him a new lease on life for that period of time--he acted like a puppy, played with the Dobermans, ate like a horse and when he got up one morning and didn't want his breakfast I checked his lymph nodes in his neck--they were huge and it was time--he went to work with me and didn't come home.

My choice is not the right one for everyone but it was the right one for me and this particular dog.

Good luck to you and Gypsy--this is always a hard choice but I swore after hanging on to one of my pets for too long (and knowing it was because I didn't want to let her go) I swore I'd never keep another beyond its time. I'd rather make the choice a little to early than a day too late.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Thank you guys for the responses. I have been giving the whole "end" some thought for the last few months considering she is 12 and as much as i wish she lived for ever, well that wont happen :(

She is my first dog and has been with me since she could fit in the palm of my hand. She has given me 12 long loving years and i want to make sure i do what is best for her.


Joe
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
7,405 Posts
I never wanted chemo for Priscilla.

She has osteosarcoma, so in her case she was amputated. I began researching artemisinin along with curcumin and various other additives, diet etc. and low and behold she is still healthy and happy 18 months after the amputation, and 20 months after the diagnosis.

Check out the yahoo group artemisinin_and_cancer. You may decide to try other options to keep her comfortable with a good quality of life.

You will know when it is time to say goodbye.
 

·
Super Moderator
GOT's Kal-Drogo The Horseman (Drogo),TKI,TKN, CGC, 7 years; RIP Baron, Miley, Dax, Lonesome, Baron 1
Joined
·
18,301 Posts
So very sorry for your girl's diagnosis. It it always hard to decide what is best but you came to the right place for lots of information and great people. My thoughts and prayers are with your sweet Gypsy.
 

·
Like a Ninja
Joined
·
3,916 Posts
I adopted a older beautiful Doberlady (Jade in my sig) she was 10 years old... She also had Mammary Cancer, that spread to her lungs.

I am not telling you this to scare you, but just to inform you, Jade came from a pretty bad situation, and I elected not to remove any of her tumors or get her spayed as it had already gotten to her lungs. I adopted her in mid February, and I lost her at the end of June. If it hadn't got to her lungs I would have spent ANY amount of money to get her healthy.

Hugs to your family and your girl Gypsy in which ever direction you choose to go,
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Again, thanks to all of you.

Jonesy'sMom, i had all her tumors removed and she is lucky in that the cancer had not spread to her lungs.

My biggest concern and i guess its something i will have to speak to the vet about is that she is 12 and how adversely the Chemo would affect her. As i said before she has lived along healthy 12 years, i would hate to make her sick with the chemo.

Joe
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,664 Posts
I'm sorry about your girls recent diagnosis, listen to your heart it will steer you in the right direction as to what way to treat her cancer. 5 years ago I lost my 9 year old weim to cancer, Chemo wasn't an option for him, so like Dobebug we treated with steroid shots, he was like a puppy for his last month, his last day he got up and didn't want to eat, spent the entire day sleeping, so we took him in later that night. He didn't suffer at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
EmilyB, thank you so much for the site to Artemisinin! This is something i will definetly discuss with my vet and get her started as soon as i can get my hands on it.

You guys are great. I'm sure I will have more questions and appreciate your patience and support.

Joe
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
7,405 Posts
You are very welcome. I just wanted to add for starters, carbs feed cancer so get her on a good grain free or raw diet. Get some anti-oxidants going. If you have any questions feel free to ask.

Sometimes it just helps to be actively doing something.

Best wishes.
 

·
terriorist entertainer
Joined
·
2,404 Posts
I just went through this with Zil last week. He had liver disease so chemo wasn't an option to treat the lymphoma. I increased the prednisolone he was already on and gave him tramadol as required ...thought I might have 2 more months or so with him but in reality it was less than a week. He was happy and engaged up until the morning he went...he laid down and passed gently under his own steam as we waited for the vet to arrive. It was relatively quick and peaceful and was as perfect a passing as I could have wished for. Letting go is hard...but love helps you through it.

I regret having put my previous boy through a major operation at almost 11 years of age....surgery went well...but he never regained core body temperature from the anaesthetic and passed 48 hrs later. Major surgery and other treatments can be really hard on an old dog...like us as we age...they just don't recover as quickly or as easily.

My thoughts are with you having to go through these difficult choices and times.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,972 Posts
I'm so sorry that you're going through this heartache. I know you'll make the right decision for your girl. I hope her last days are as happy with you as her first were.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,533 Posts
I had a Doberman bitch get mammary cancer. It was removed and she was spayed. Spaying helps eliminate the hormone fluctuation which then helps the cancer to not progress so quickly.

Two years later, it went to her brain. I had her put to sleep. But while we figured out what was going on she progressed to blindness etc. Its difficult to find the correct diagnosis sometimes.

So I had her put to sleep. She was going down hill fast.

Breast cancer's progression is usually breast, lung, bone/back then brain. She skipped the other parts and it just went to her brain.

She was 5 years old when this happened though. She made it to 7 years. You're dog is much older. Listen to your vet and weigh it to what is best.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
7,405 Posts
If mammary cancer progresses to the brain as well (as does osteosarcoma) I would suggest Artemix and/or Artemisinin. This is what Dr. Singh recommends.

Bone Cancer Dogs
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,778 Posts
I would not want to be making cancer decisions without at least a consult with a board-certified veterinary oncologist. My experience with a dog and chemo was that the chemo was barely noticed by the dog and it bought almost three years of good quality life before the lymphoma could no longer be kept at bay. While treatment is not always the correct choice (and sometimes not an economically feasable choice), when it is the right choice you want your dog to be under the care of someone whose specialty it is.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,533 Posts
I've been told that dogs do much better with chemo handling it then people. Also, some people handle chemo well as well. It all depends on the individual, the cancer and the stage its in.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
21,723 Posts
It didn't happen to be a Doberman but I had an Australian Shepherd who at nearly 13 was diagnosed with lymphoma (another type of cancer). Most forms of lymphoma respond well to chemo and the dog can go into remission, sometimes for lengthy periods of time. Unfortunately it is also the case that the older the dog is the shorter the remission period and the more the dog is likely to have some problems to the chemo (dogs, typically don't have as much trouble with chemo or radiation as people but that's all sort of relative).

I made a decision at that point to not do chemo put to take palliative measures only (in this case he was put on a fairly high dose of prednisone) and make him happy for as long as he clearly felt well. I had him for another month. The pred gave him a new lease on life for that period of time--he acted like a puppy, played with the Dobermans, ate like a horse and when he got up one morning and didn't want his breakfast I checked his lymph nodes in his neck--they were huge and it was time--he went to work with me and didn't come home.

My choice is not the right one for everyone but it was the right one for me and this particular dog.

Good luck to you and Gypsy--this is always a hard choice but I swore after hanging on to one of my pets for too long (and knowing it was because I didn't want to let her go) I swore I'd never keep another beyond its time. I'd rather make the choice a little to early than a day too late.
I'm very sorry to hear about your dog's diagnosis. Only you can decide what's best for your girl, in consult with a good vet. I, personally, would likely make the same decision as dobebug, given your dog's age. My thoughts are with you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Thanks all of you for your support. People that dont have pets i dont think really understand how tough this is. Gypsy seems fine and eating well. I'm the one that is depressed and even took the day from work today cause could not keep my mind on work stuff.

In any event i will be taking to the vet on saturday when i take her in to remove the stitches. I will be discussing the use of Arteminisin. None of her cancer has spread to any vital organ so hopefully that will keep it under control. I'm starting tot hink that her age of 12 it may be the best choice.


Joe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,449 Posts
If you are considering chemo, I'd speak with an oncologist about it. See what specific drugs would be given in what amounts. I treated a Vizsla for 14 months with lymphoma and she still had a fantastic quality of life. She was just over 8 when we started treating. Many dogs do just fine without side effects. BUT it's not the answer for every case either.

Here is Kiana 2 weeks before we said goodbye. As you can see, chemo didn't slow her down. The NOISE is the Vizsla

Kiana drag flirt - YouTube


By the way IF I treated I'd also ask what the prognosis might be.
 
1 - 20 of 37 Posts
Top