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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys, my name is Brittany. I have been on a long and exhausting quest for a new EUROPEAN doberman. Im looking for the total dobie. When I say that I mean I want maily working but I also want the body composition as well.

My fiance' has owned 2 American dobies in the past and now we as a family are wanting to step it up and get a Euro. Reason being is better temperment and body composition, as most of you know. Back to the roots I say! :0)

I have been researching and know what I want and Im having a horrible time finding it and Im willing to wait for it. So far I have visited many breeder websites and I always come back to doberman talk to see what yall say about that particular breeder. Usually nothing good. I have also talked to several breeders over the phone and asked them to explain why they get the reviews that yall give them. Most of them have explained and I understand that there are some hipocrits out there and I have to take it as a grain of salt. I know that pedigree is very important as well as health checks. Any other advice is welcome but please dont bash breeders without proof.

As far as what Im looking for: Male, red or black (red preferrably), working more so than show but both is a plus, NO Z FACTOR, Completely healthy not even a carrier is ok, money is not an issue but reasonable for the dog, location is not an issue as there is only one breeder close by.

Thank you for any help! Brittany location Texarkana, TX
 

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Sea Hag
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we as a family are wanting to step it up and get a Euro. Reason being is better temperment and body composition, as most of you know.
How freaking insulting to everyone with a good quality American doberman!

You're free to prefer european dobermans all you want, everyone gets to pick their poison. But it's just plain rude to criticize an entire genepool in the process of saying what you want. There are both good and bad dogs worldwide, no one region has a monopoly on either.
 

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Strong Ears
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Hello Brittany. Don't think you're going to get alot of responses from people here in the U.S. that are going to agree with you. I thought like you for a short time too, but after doing research I believe U.S. Dobermans are still the best.

I'm not very familiar with any of the European bloodlines, but I believe that Kansadobe is. He is very knowledgeable and he will be very honest with you. He is into both showing and working. He can point you in the right direction. He might even have a litter in the works with what you are looking for.

He is an old family friend and I don't agree with him on absolutely everything Doberman. But if I was looking for a Dobe just to work, I would definitely inquire with him.
 

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My fiance' has owned 2 American dobies in the past and now we as a family are wanting to step it up and get a Euro. Reason being is better temperment and body composition, as most of you know. Back to the roots I say! :0)
Not to harp on what's already been harped on, but let me elaborate a little here.

What about European Dobes makes you think they have better temperament? You never really told us what temperament you were looking for. You also say you want a European Doberman. Does this mean you want to import? If you do want to import, do good research here and you might come to find that severely less health testing is done in Eastern Europe and in Europe in general on the breed than is done here.

It is completely fine to say that you like the conformational style of a European-bred Doberman from working lines, but you must understand that working lines from Dobermans, especially the European ones you're asking about, come with very high drive. In order to get one of these puppies from a reputable working-line Doberman breeder, you will need to esteem to a higher standard of dog training and competence and prove this to your breeder.

You also said you know what you want. In order for us to help you, please elaborate on what you want, and we'll see what fits.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Im not here to argue or fight with anyone and everyone is entitled to their opinion. I appriciate the people who are trying to help. I am not judging anyone I just know what I want in a Dobermann. I love all animals but its my money and Im going to spend it how I want. If you have negative feedback please do not respond. I mean no harm to any American dobermann owners. Like I said we have owned to American dobermanns in the past and loved them as our own. Im looking for a companion/my protector/ and possibly work and show later.
 

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Sea Hag
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Im not here to argue or fight with anyone and everyone is entitled to their opinion. I appriciate the people who are trying to help. I am not judging anyone I just know what I want in a Dobermann. I love all animals but its my money and Im going to spend it how I want. If you have negative feedback please do not respond. I mean no harm to any American dobermann owners. Like I said we have owned to American dobermanns in the past and loved them as our own. Im looking for a companion/my protector/ and possibly work and show later.
When you come to this board and are totally RUDE with your first post, of course you're going to get negative feedback.

Again, everyone is free to have their own preferences about what style of doberman they want. It's no skin off anyone else's butt what kind of dog you buy. But you don't get to make nasty comments in the process.

I *could* elaborate about the BUTT UGLY euro doberman I saw someone trying to show this past weekend...but I won't. I know one dog doesn't represent an entire genepool, and while it might not be a genepool I prefer, I can see there are some very correct dogs produced within that breeding population.
 

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joie de vivre
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I decided just to go with half a Dobe so I bought from US show lines. That's why I have 2...since they're 1/2 Dobes I figure together I have one 'total' Dobe. If I'm doing the math right, that is. :)

I'd check with Kansadobe and Incredible. They both work and show their dogs, although I believe Kansa breeds to Euro show lines and I think Incredible breeds to Euro working lines. I could be wrong and someone, please, correct me if I am.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Please elaborate how I was being rude. Maybe you took what I said out of context? I dunno but Im here posting what I want in a dog and asking for your help.
 

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I agree with Murreydobe that was pretty darn nasty!! That said I think it depends on what you want to do with your Doberman.

There are euro working/show lines, euro show lines, and working lines. I think based on what you plan on doing will maybe narrow it down a bit.

If you are looking for good conformation and the ability to get some working titles I would look at the following:

Incredible Dobermans
Kansa Dobermans
Bel'Lavoro Dobermans
Cara Kennels

Those are just a few off the top of my head, I'm sure there is more that I am missing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Look I am new to this board and I dont understand the highlight stuff. All I wanted was some help and yall are taking it to major offense. You should learn how to talk to people instead of judging by what I said. I didnt mean to offend anyone Im just trying to tell you what I want instead of wasting your time. Im sorry that I offened yall. I wont post anymore and yall can carry that attitude with you. I wont tolerate it and way to welcome someone to doberman talk thanks for putting a sour taste in my mouth.
 

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Ok, Ok, settle down...sheesh. The best way to put out a fire, even an unintentional fire, is to smother it and move on. OP, can we get back to the reason this thread was opened? A few folks have asked you some questions that might help us help you in your search.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Import vs American

This is why I want a European....

The Doberman was originally bred as a guardian and personal protector. “The breed standard describes the desirable characteristic hallmarks of an ideal temperament. Namely it is PROUD, NOBLE, ENERGETIC, WATCHFUL, DETERMINED, ALERT, FEARLESS, LOYAL AND OBEDIENT. Descriptive words that should give anyone a pretty clear picture of how our Dobermans should look and behave at any given time. As judges we must appreciate and REWARD sound temperament when found and just as importantly RECOGNIZE and PENALIZE faulty temperament in our rings. A judge that overlooks shyness, fearfulness, unprovoked or inappropriate aggression, avoidance, or cowering in a Doberman fails not only in their responsibility to the breed, but the society we all live in. The more shy and fearful a dog is, the more likely to be easily stressed by things in its environment, and the more unpredictable and dangerous its behavior.

Correct temperament determines the ability of a Doberman to perform the function for which it was bred. If we expect to preserve and protect this breed as a functional entity in this modern world, it's important to understand and appreciate the purpose of that function. It is function that determines the purebred dog's most important characteristic—breed type. No function, no Type—no Type, no breed. “

The Dobermann was, indeed, bred to work. Europe still recognizes this. European bred dog will, in general, perform better than the American bred one in protection and tracking fields. This is due to the ZTP requirement for breeding in most European countries. America has bred down the working edge of the dog and it HAS become more of a pet/companion dog. They are still good watchdogs and will bark at strangers, etc., but they won’t make as good of Schutzhund or protection dog as their European counterpart. By the way a protection dog does not mean the dog that attacks. In fact a dog with unprovoked aggression is not good material for Schutzhund or IPO training and won’t be able to pass the ZTP requirement. A truly proper temperament will have the mind (intelligence) to be stable around children and non-threatening strangers, but will also be protective when danger arises. They are truly what a doberman should look like. The Doberman originated in Europe and they are still breeding closest to the original standard of anywhere in the world, so we have gone back to the roots. These European Dobermans have Substance of Bone and Muscle Mass to balance the bone structure. Truly a picture of "Regal Authority", a Look at Me and Respect Me look that can't be replicated by any other breed. The Doberman Pinscher was originally produced in Germany as a personal protector for individuals and families, and for police and military work. Throughout Europe, this is still the case. Here the Doberman, or Dobermann as it is spelled, is viewed as a dog primarily for protection work and is breed with the intention of maintaining the traits needed in a protection dog, usually termed 'workability'.

In fact, before a Doberman's offspring can be registered in Europe, one of its parents must hold a Schutzhund title. Schutzhund is German for 'protection dog' and refers to a system for testing dogs of working breeds for workability. It has also grown into a popular sport in Europe and somewhat throughout the United Stated, although the American Kennel Club (AKC) does not allow its affiliates to sanction Schutzhund trials.
 

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Also, talk to Terri Clary in Texas from Dobermans de Tejas. I don't think she is having any litters but certainly might be able to help.

My male is from her and I am very happy with him and how she has been as a breeder.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I should have said this in the first post but forgot....Im not looking to import just looking for the euro bloodline in the states.
 
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