Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums banner
1 - 11 of 11 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I hear people all the time say "3rd set and done". My puppy got her first set of shots at 6 weeks from the breeder. Vet isn't recognizing this set of shots and so at 8 weeks, he gave her the "1st set" which in my mind is the 2nd set. She had a reaction to the shot, got a golf ball-sized lump. "2nd set" from the Vet he gave her a Benadryl shot first, she was much better but still has a quarter-sized bump. The vet is saying that she needs two more sets of shots because Dobermans are supposedly more susceptible to Parvo, this would mean that 5 sets of shots (the last one at 20 weeks), this just seems ridiculous to me. Am I being unreasonable? I have been looking for a vet that does Immunization Titters because that to me seems to make the best sense but unfortunately I can seem to find one. I used this Vet because he has a show Doberman, and my old Vet of 18 years gave me a HUGE lecture about ear cropping that I didn't appreciate so I am not going back. I am just so frustrated and am needing some advice. I am in the KC Kansas area if anyone knows of a good Dobie Vet.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,569 Posts
I hear people all the time say "3rd set and done". My puppy got her first set of shots at 6 weeks from the breeder. Vet isn't recognizing this set of shots and so at 8 weeks, he gave her the "1st set" which in my mind is the 2nd set. She had a reaction to the shot, got a golf ball-sized lump. "2nd set" from the Vet he gave her a Benadryl shot first, she was much better but still has a quarter-sized bump. The vet is saying that she needs two more sets of shots because Dobermans are supposedly more susceptible to Parvo, this would mean that 5 sets of shots (the last one at 20 weeks), this just seems ridiculous to me. Am I being unreasonable? I have been looking for a vet that does Immunization Titters because that to me seems to make the best sense but unfortunately I can seem to find one. I used this Vet because he has a show Doberman, and my old Vet of 18 years gave me a HUGE lecture about ear cropping that I didn't appreciate so I am not going back. I am just so frustrated and am needing some advice. I am in the KC Kansas area if anyone knows of a good Dobie Vet.
When parvo first showed up and the first vaccines weren't as good as those we have now there were dogs who didn't get proper immunity to the parvo vaccine. It got to be enough of a problem that anyone who was vaccinating a black and tan dog--the worst were Dobes, black and tan Shepherds, Rottweilers--there were others but I can't remember them now--at any rate because the vaccines weren't being effective in a 3 vaccine cycle the various studies that were being done recommended to do a four vaccine series the last being given at 20 weeks.

You can do whatever you think is effective. The vaccines are better now, by far than they were back then but evidently from the reports that the vaccine manufactures get on vaccine failure there are still a group of dogs--mostly the same group of black and tan dogs (and I think most were in the working group) that seems to be higher for those dogs than you would expect.

But that's the background on the four shots. And many vets--if not most--don't accept an early vaccine because often the breeder hasn't actually weaned the puppies at six week--they may be eating food but still nursing some and that means the vaccines aren't effective because of the maternal antibodies still being in effect and that definitely means you don't want to take the chance of counting the first--at six weeks vaccine it's not just possible but even probable that the first vaccine wasn't effective.

I'm not sure that this establishes that Dobermans and a few other breeds are more susceptible to parvo but it does appear it's harder to get a positive vaccination for parvo on them and one more vaccination seems to help this.

Maybe the problem has been solved. I don't know but I've seen cases of parvo--who have come into our clinic with very sick and sometimes dying puppies--parvo is an ugly disease and it often leaves dog who have contracted it with permanent problems. And I remember friends who lost entire litters when parvo first appeared.

I've given a four vaccine series for my Dobermans since parvo showed up--I just think that it's a cheap protection--maybe they no longer need four vaccines but this is one place I'd rather do a little too much than not enough.

dobebug
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,858 Posts
I agree with Dobebug - I'd give 3 more vaccines if the first one was so early. As far as titers, you first need to do the puppy series of shots. Then one year after the last puppy shot, you do a booster. After the booster, you should be good for at least 3 years - at that point, you can do titers. I've found that at some point, my dogs need another booster. Rabies of course is a whole different deal. Many states require rabies by 4 months - I personally don't do rabies till 6 months, and won't do rabies within at least a month of any other shot/vaccine. The first rabies is a one year, then a year later its a 3 year (at least in my state)..... then by law has to be done every 3 years.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
77 Posts
We did four rounds of vaccines for Sherlock this winter per the recommendation of my vet, and our first one at the breeder was done at eight weeks. Better safe than sorry in my mind!

Also huge bummer to hear about your first vet's reaction to you cropping. I'd not be going back either.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,318 Posts
  • Like
Reactions: dobebug and melbrod

·
Got mutt?
Leo, Lily, and Simon
Joined
·
13,949 Posts
My vet took down the info that my breeder provided and entered it into Simon's record, but we are having to do some additional vaccines, since the one the breeder used didn't have Lepto, and my vet says they see a fair bit of it down here.
 
  • Like
Reactions: dobebug and melbrod

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
When parvo first showed up and the first vaccines weren't as good as those we have now there were dogs who didn't get proper immunity to the parvo vaccine. It got to be enough of a problem that anyone who was vaccinating a black and tan dog--the worst were Dobes, black and tan Shepherds, Rottweilers--there were others but I can't remember them now--at any rate because the vaccines weren't being effective in a 3 vaccine cycle the various studies that were being done recommended to do a four vaccine series the last being given at 20 weeks.

You can do whatever you think is effective. The vaccines are better now, by far than they were back then but evidently from the reports that the vaccine manufactures get on vaccine failure there are still a group of dogs--mostly the same group of black and tan dogs (and I think most were in the working group) that seems to be higher for those dogs than you would expect.

But that's the background on the four shots. And many vets--if not most--don't accept an early vaccine because often the breeder hasn't actually weaned the puppies at six week--they may be eating food but still nursing some and that means the vaccines aren't effective because of the maternal antibodies still being in effect and that definitely means you don't want to take the chance of counting the first--at six weeks vaccine it's not just possible but even probable that the first vaccine wasn't effective.

I'm not sure that this establishes that Dobermans and a few other breeds are more susceptible to parvo but it does appear it's harder to get a positive vaccination for parvo on them and one more vaccination seems to help this.

Maybe the problem has been solved. I don't know but I've seen cases of parvo--who have come into our clinic with very sick and sometimes dying puppies--parvo is an ugly disease and it often leaves dog who have contracted it with permanent problems. And I remember friends who lost entire litters when parvo first appeared.

I've given a four vaccine series for my Dobermans since parvo showed up--I just think that it's a cheap protection--maybe they no longer need four vaccines but this is one place I'd rather do a little too much than not enough.

dobebug
Thank you so much for that history and explanation, it is very helpful and now I understand. You mentioned black and tan dogs, it is interesting that the color would matter, and I have a red so that is something to consider. A series of 4 is definitely not the norm that I run into around where I live, but, I understand the reasoning and will consider allowing the Vet to give her another set at 20 weeks. Thanks!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I agree with Dobebug - I'd give 3 more vaccines if the first one was so early. As far as titers, you first need to do the puppy series of shots. Then one year after the last puppy shot, you do a booster. After the booster, you should be good for at least 3 years - at that point, you can do titers. I've found that at some point, my dogs need another booster. Rabies of course is a whole different deal. Many states require rabies by 4 months - I personally don't do rabies till 6 months, and won't do rabies within at least a month of any other shot/vaccine. The first rabies is a one year, then a year later its a 3 year (at least in my state)..... then by law has to be done every 3 years.
Thanks for the information.Good to know about the titers, I am familiar with them because my daughter having an auto-immune issue. Glad to understand better how it works in the dog world. And, I will definitely insist on waiting until 6 months for the rabies shot. Although, I might have an issue in puppy socialization classes...it is my understanding that in Kansas there is no specification of when a puppy must have the shot so legally we are good I believe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
We did four rounds of vaccines for Sherlock this winter per the recommendation of my vet, and our first one at the breeder was done at eight weeks. Better safe than sorry in my mind!

Also huge bummer to hear about your first vet's reaction to you cropping. I'd not be going back either.
Thank you. It makes me feel better knowing that there is a reason and others out there and not just my Vet making something up for profit. Yes, safe is definitely important to me too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I feel like I heard that was a particularly virulent strain of parvo going around down south? Or am I remembering incorrectly? Ah, wait - this? Parvo Virus - The New Strain - Middlebrook Animal Clinic - Knoxville, TN
We are in Kansas, and actually, my Vet said that in our area he has not seen a single case of Parvo in our area in about 15 years. This is why I don't understand his caution, but, I am going to be safe and stop worrying about it I guess. I was just worried that she was going to be over-vaccinated and that would cause problems in the future especially given she seems to be really sensitive to immunizations. Thank you so much for the information.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
My vet took down the info that my breeder provided and entered it into Simon's record, but we are having to do some additional vaccines, since the one the breeder used didn't have Lepto, and my vet says they see a fair bit of it down here.
Thanks for the information, I suppose that might be part of the issue. My Vet isn't very generous with words, probably because most people don't care to know. I unfortunately over dissect and question everything and I guess that comes from being my child's advocate through the years when she was sick. I just need to be more persistent to get more specific information out of him.
 
1 - 11 of 11 Posts
Top