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Autumn
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Discussion Starter #1
My husband and I just got our first little pup, Ares, the breeder cropped his tail but was against the ears. We heard it could could have benefits for hearing and infections, but are still on the fence.
We have to get his second set of shots soon and was wondering if anyone could tell me if they did or didn't crop and if there was or wasn't a health improvement.
:thanx:

 

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Cropping is a very personal choice. Dobermanns are beautiful with natural and cropped ears.

A cropped ear can focus sounds better than a floppy ear. I have not noticed a difference in ear health either way. A responsible owner checks their dog on a regular basis and cleans the ears whether cropped or not.

More importantly - Do you have experience taping cropped ears? Or, do you have someone that is experienced and knowledgeable that can help you?

Are you prepared for taping for 4, 5, 6 months, even a year (depending on the style of crop and puppy's ear cartilage)?

Taping can be a lot of work. It is much better to leave your puppy natural, than cropped and not standing.
 

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Got mutt?
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Since you've bought from someone who didn't crop, I'd just leave the ears natural. The actual surgery is the tip of the ice burg, so to speak. The procedure generally runs between $400 to $600, and you need to find a vet who is experienced with Doberman crops for the best results. After the ears heal, you have to commit to posting them until they stand, and that generally takes three to four months or longer (sometimes LOTS longer). Unless your dog has underlying issues like allergies, then a drop ear is generally no more "unhealthy" than a cropped or naturally erect ear.

The biggest worry with buying a pup from a breeder who skimps by not cropping is the fact that they usually skimp in other places, like titling and health testing their breeding dogs. This link tells you about the health issues in the breed, if you aren't already aware of them. DPCA | The Doberman | Health Probably the most important thing for you to know about health right now is your pup's vWD status. If your breeder can't tell you, you need to get a test done through one of two companies, VetGen or Vetnostics.

PS: Ears are cropped, but tails are docked. :)
 

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Autumn
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Discussion Starter #4
KittenRed, as I stated, this is our first doberman of our own, so all of the taping and cropping is so new to us. And since our friends and family with dobermans said there were health benefits I wanted to see if everyone else was saying it before I made a fool of myself to the vet! haha

Rosemary,t he breeder didn't crop the mother's ears, so I think she was just as uncomfortable.
We did get an extensive health check sheet from her vet, and we will be going to our own vet soon as well-but thank you very much for all the information!

We do love his little floppy ears too, so we will take all of this into account.
thank you very much guys!
 

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Got mutt?
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Like I said, it's very important to know your pup's vWD status, whether you decide to crop or not. The test through VetGEn and Vetnostics are DNA tests, and are something you can do yourself. The results will be one of three options: Clear, no copies of the gene, so not vWD bleeding issues; Carrier, one copy of the gene, and again, no vWD bleeding concerns; or Affected, two copies of the gene, and at risk for bleeding problems (excessive bleeding, easily bruised, etc.). The test the vet does "in-house", the ELISSA, is not accurate when determining vWD status.

By the way, ears on a Dobe are generally cropped between 7 and 9 weeks, with most croppers refusing to do them past 12 weeks.
 

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If you crop, you will be on your own with the after care and postings. I doubt the breeder will help you out.

For future reference, reputable breeders who crop will be with you every step of the way, and they take care of the crop and most of the healing process.

IMO I would leave your puppy natural, a crop/flop would be fine but leaving them natural looks much better :)
 

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Ok I was in your same situation and I decided to crop because I basically wanted to... And it is a pain in the butt but if u don't mind a little challenge then u should do it if u want to... I think that I was kind of lucky because the way my puppy's ears set made them easy to stand but the posting process is annoying as hell but it has been worth it for me... I also got lucky and got a pretty decent crop for less than 200$ but I researched a lot so... If u want to do it then u should ... Just know it's going to be annoying but not as hard as everyone makes it seem .... What state are u in?
KittenRed, as I stated, this is our first doberman of our own, so all of the taping and cropping is so new to us. And since our friends and family with dobermans said there were health benefits I wanted to see if everyone else was saying it before I made a fool of myself to the vet! haha

Rosemary,t he breeder didn't crop the mother's ears, so I think she was just as uncomfortable.
We did get an extensive health check sheet from her vet, and we will be going to our own vet soon as well-but thank you very much for all the information!

We do love his little floppy ears too, so we will take all of this into account.
thank you very much guys!




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Autumn
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Discussion Starter #8
Rosemary, I was reading all of that and am definitely checking the papers and getting him tested ASAP!

DogsR4Life, this was her second litter of flood bloods, and I don't think hers was a show dog, so I don't think she went with the look everyone knows now.

RomansPapa, you are lucky! We're in Washington State.
 

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Holier Than Now
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There aren't any known medical benefits to cropping--it's purely a cosmetic procedure.

If you choose to do the crop, it will benefit you to ask for vet recommendations here--cropping is an art that isn't taught in "regular vet school" and many vets who claim to be expert in this, are in fact not.
 

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Love the Nub
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Ears were cropped historically for functional purposes. Ears | Doberman Pinscher Club of America

IMO, I would leave them natural for a few reasons. One being that, as DogsR4Life said, you'll be on your own. You won't have that breeder support and help. If you don't go to a very experienced vet in Doberman crops, your pup is likely to wind up with a bad crop.

If you do decide to go through with it, then please don't hesitate to post threads asking questions along the way. The majority of vets will advise you and show you how to post, but there are many who, even though they may be excellent vets in general, won't post correctly and you're likely to end up with pockets or a flop n' crop.

In the future if you plan to add a Doberman again, reputable breeders send their pups home cropped and will be there to help you along the way.
 

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There aren't any known medical benefits to cropping--it's purely a cosmetic procedure.

If you choose to do the crop, it will benefit you to ask for vet recommendations here--cropping is an art that isn't taught in "regular vet school" and many vets who claim to be expert in this, are in fact not.
I will add to this the theory of erect ears focusing sound better is also bunk.
The only dog with erect ears in my house is the only dog that ever gets ear infections.
 

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OP - just going to make good points from other members very clear;

Signs point to this puppy not being from a reputable or responsible breeder who did health testing, so I would be more concerned about future health issues common in the breed than a cosmetic procedure. The health info you were provided from the breeders's vet won't really have anything regarding these conditions, as many can't be tested for until a dog is older. The health issues I would be concerned about are genetic, which is why it would be more important to have health test results on the dam and sire, not a vet check on your puppy.
 

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Alpha
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She's 8 weeks so if you are going to do it I'd do it quick. As others mentioned it's too bad the breeder didn't look after this for you as reputable breeders will do. It's strange they'd be against it when it's a cropped and docked breed. They normally get them done at 7 weeks and most of the healing is done by the time you get them.
Good luck.
 

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_______
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Your puppy is a cutie pie. Too bad the breeder didn't have the ears done before sending him home tho.

That said as the voice of dissent on here risking a *grease fire*, and a potential lone voice for health benefits *in my experience & those of our vet who sees a ton of dobermans* having had 2 flop & one cropped myself, have dealt w/frequent & vicious ear infections on our flopped girl and in *total* the flopped dogs I've had win the ear infection tally.

Which coincidentally(!):rolleyesww: with our flop girl subsided when the boy we added began helping her air her ears out by flipping them over grooming on a regular basis.

Besides that, should an UP ear become infected it is readily apparent right away, and not say at 2am.

However!!!
If you're not going to line up a well known great experienced cropper, one used by show people(dobe, boxer, dane) you're wasting your money.

If you don't find someone *beforehand* to help demonstrate to you in person the finer points of posting correctly and think you might get wobbly about being diligent taking care that they stand again it's a waste.

All that can be done but you've not a lot of time to line your ducks in a row.
You could try contacting someone in your local Dane, boxer, doberman club
that could steer you to a good cropper and names of people who are willing to help you get proper posting.
You'll also be stuck w/the stitches & cup stage, something a good breeder would have already done beforehand.

A good teacher and patience and diligence makes the entire process easier than one would think reading the horror threads about posting, but you need someone who knows what they're doing willing to take the time out to show you and can help if you get stuck.

And you have to do it correctly, like religion.

I'd never posted ears in my life but had 2 people(one the breeder-we videotaped her instructions which I never had to use) & a savvy cropping vet who made it easy helping me until I felt confident. It doesn't have to be a nightmare.

ps. There is also no shortage of health links out there that go into detail about the pros cons of a flopped/cropped ear. Flopped, IMO (and others not on this thread), are moisture traps & yeast factories.

But don't crop your puppy if you aren't going to do it without a steely resolve to get it right hell or high water.
 

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None of the above are peer reviewed studies or even reference them, the last one says nothing about dog specific ear shape and so all can be considered hearsay and prove nothing.

One proper study I have read showed the dogs temperament had more effect on it's propensity to pick up on unusual and/or interesting sounds than ear shape.
 

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None of the above are peer reviewed studies or even reference them, the last one says nothing about dog specific ear shape and so all can be considered hearsay and prove nothing.

One proper study I have read showed the dogs temperament had more effect on it's propensity to pick up on unusual and/or interesting sounds than ear shape.
Have you ever cupped your hands up to your ears?
Do you notice a difference?

That would, essentially, be the same thing as a cropped or naturally upright ear versus a flop ear.

Again, the whole in nature debate - no natural animal species has a flop ear. Why would that be?
 
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