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Good evening, and I recognize there are many, many posts such as this. My male Doberman, Leonidas, recently passed and am looking for a reputable breeder in the midwest. Both Leonidas and my female (Coraline) are European and want my next Doberman to be European as well. I have friends with American Dobermans and just prefer the Europeans.

I've been to dpca.org and am struggling to find what I am looking for!

Please help with a referal!
 

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Welcome to DT.

I'm sorry to hear of your loss. Have you checked out the United Doberman Club breeder's list? A lot of them are incorporating European lines, both show and working, into their breeding programs.
 

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Thanks for the replies. I went to United Doberman Clubs breeder list, but most either didnt have a website, the websites were down, or not updated in years.

I will check out Kansa Dobermans.

Not sure if it matters, but I dont have any interest in showing. A working dog Euro dog with excellent temperament is what I need. My dobies play an important role as household companions, watch dogs for my property, and hobby training - such as tracking and mushing (yes, mushing, dont laugh!)
 

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Leonidas passed from a blood clot that traveled to his heart. The ER said it was likely genetic. He came from Rainstorm Dobermans, and although he had a couple of health issues (throid and this bloodclot) he was a beautiful, amazing dog, despite coming from a BYB.

I've complied a list of breeders that have been recommended to me in the last 2 days:

Kansa
Aldercrest
Landgraf
Elite Haus
Von Schwartz
Von Siegruhm


Of course, all of these breeders are minimum 8 hour drive. It makes me uneasy to spend such money on never visiting the kennel or meeting any of the dogs.
 

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Leonidas passed from a blood clot that traveled to his heart. The ER said it was likely genetic. He came from Rainstorm Dobermans, and although he had a couple of health issues (throid and this bloodclot) he was a beautiful, amazing dog, despite coming from a BYB.

I've complied a list of breeders that have been recommended to me in the last 2 days:

Kansa
Aldercrest
Landgraf
Elite Haus
Von Schwartz
Von Siegruhm


Of course, all of these breeders are minimum 8 hour drive. It makes me uneasy to spend such money on never visiting the kennel or meeting any of the dogs.
Hi there Alexander....

To me there is no better excuse for a road trip than to check out Dobermans.
Do you have any idea how many miles and $$$ a good breeder spends on travel? LOL

My go to breeder is 300 miles south of me. I would easily travel 4 times that distance for the right dog.

Best to you in your search

John
Portland OR
 

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I know you say you're not interested in American show bred dogs, but maybe you just haven't seen many good examples? A nice American male has heavy bone and a regal expression and you will be able to find much more health testing and information on ancestors in an American show pedigree.

Since you're in the Midwest, if you're anywhere near Chicago, the doberman national specialty show is coming up and that would be a great place to see nice dogs and talk to breeders and exhibitors. There will be hundreds of people and dogs.
 

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I know you say you're not interested in American show bred dogs, but maybe you just haven't seen many good examples? A nice American male has heavy bone and a regal expression and you will be able to find much more health testing and information on ancestors in an American show pedigree.

Since you're in the Midwest, if you're anywhere near Chicago, the doberman national specialty show is coming up and that would be a great place to see nice dogs and talk to breeders and exhibitors. There will be hundreds of people and dogs.
What GK said^^^^
My youngest is lithe and muscular. At 4 yo I tried to keep him at first around 80 lb. Later around 85 lb. Currently I am happy if he is below 90.

When our vet (who is very familiar with the breed) initially saw him at 10 weeks, his comment was "Your boy has massive bone structure, make sure you raise him as a large breed pup".

My boy is from a well known show-line breeder.

Oh... and his "brother" (RIP) was from the same breeder. His 95-100 lb. belied his actual size. Even at his best weight and fitness, most people guessed his weight at 110 - 120.

Just sayin'... There is a lot of nonsense out there with respect to American vs Euro.

Oh BTW, out senior is best at below 70 lb. Same breeder!

John
Portland OR
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Hi there Alexander....

To me there is no better excuse for a road trip than to check out Dobermans.
Do you have any idea how many miles and $$$ a good breeder spends on travel? LOL

My go to breeder is 300 miles south of me. I would easily travel 4 times that distance for the right dog.

Best to you in your search

John
Portland OR
Funny you say that, I actually suggested to my wife (for our anniversary coming up) that we take a vacation and visit the kennel we choose. Unfortunately, taking such trips with 2 young children complicates things significantly!

I know you say you're not interested in American show bred dogs, but maybe you just haven't seen many good examples? A nice American male has heavy bone and a regal expression and you will be able to find much more health testing and information on ancestors in an American show pedigree.

Since you're in the Midwest, if you're anywhere near Chicago, the doberman national specialty show is coming up and that would be a great place to see nice dogs and talk to breeders and exhibitors. There will be hundreds of people and dogs.
Thats certainly possible, the American bred dogs ive met are all thin and do not look powerful. I really like the head and neck structure of Euros. Obviously looks arent everything.

What GK said^^^^
My youngest is lithe and muscular. At 4 yo I tried to keep him at first around 80 lb. Later around 85 lb. Currently I am happy if he is below 90.

When our vet (who is very familiar with the breed) initially saw him at 10 weeks, his comment was "Your boy has massive bone structure, make sure you raise him as a large breed pup".

My boy is from a well known show-line breeder.

Oh... and his "brother" (RIP) was from the same breeder. His 95-100 lb. belied his actual size. Even at his best weight and fitness, most people guessed his weight at 110 - 120.

Just sayin'... There is a lot of nonsense out there with respect to American vs Euro.

Oh BTW, out senior is best at below 70 lb. Same breeder!

John
Portland OR
Thanks John. I agree, and ive seen pictures (thought not in person) of very impressively built Americans. I dunno, there's just something about the build of the Euros I like. Probably because my pride and joy, Leonidas, had that build and I miss him dearly.

I was going to upload a picture of him but cant seem to figure it out.
 

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Funny you say that, I actually suggested to my wife (for our anniversary coming up) that we take a vacation and visit the kennel we choose. Unfortunately, taking such trips with 2 young children complicates things significantly!



Thats certainly possible, the American bred dogs ive met are all thin and do not look powerful. I really like the head and neck structure of Euros. Obviously looks arent everything.



Thanks John. I agree, and ive seen pictures (thought not in person) of very impressively built Americans. I dunno, there's just something about the build of the Euros I like. Probably because my pride and joy, Leonidas, had that build and I miss him dearly.

I was going to upload a picture of him but cant seem to figure it out.
I think maybe you just haven't seen many well bred American dobermans. Here's a very nice example of a mature male- GCH. Element rock star

photos courtesy of https://elementdobermans.com/our-boys/ozzy/



 

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Discussion Starter #16
Update:

I've been reading and researching for days. I currently found 2 breeders that are reasonably accessible and interest me. Kansa Dobermans is my top pic, but I havent had the chance to speak with them other than a brief email. Another of my choices is elitehaus dobermans.
https://www.elitehaus.net/litters

They are breeding these 2 dogs:
https://en.working-dog.com/dogs-details/6079980/Public-Enemy-No-1-Ali-Baba
https://en.working-dog.com/dogs-details/5186442/Gravin-Ice-di-Altobello

Without going into specifics, there are certain things that really interest me, and a few things that concern me. If anyone has the time or ability to read the pedigrees and give advice (this is my first time doing so) I would really appreciate the help.

Thanks!
 

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I believe (senior members correct me if I’m wrong) that many euro lines have cardio in them pretty bad. Personally, I would go for health and longevity over looks any day. As other members have said you can easily get that powerful stocky look in the american lines as well, especially the boys. Also, I would suggest a quick search on this site to learn more about the kennels you are looking at....

Here’s my Sully when he wasn’t even 2 years old
63B271DA-F2E4-4B03-A361-FE2555FCFE60 by Corinna Morris, on Flickr

And a headshot
1F2A58AD-2A64-49CE-9B9F-84AC17A9B212 by Corinna Morris, on Flickr
 

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Update:

I've been reading and researching for days. I currently found 2 breeders that are reasonably accessible and interest me. Kansa Dobermans is my top pic, but I havent had the chance to speak with them other than a brief email. Another of my choices is elitehaus dobermans.
https://www.elitehaus.net/litters

They are breeding these 2 dogs:
https://en.working-dog.com/dogs-details/6079980/Public-Enemy-No-1-Ali-Baba
https://en.working-dog.com/dogs-details/5186442/Gravin-Ice-di-Altobello

Without going into specifics, there are certain things that really interest me, and a few things that concern me. If anyone has the time or ability to read the pedigrees and give advice (this is my first time doing so) I would really appreciate the help.

Thanks!
I would pass on that other breeder you mention. There is no real heart health test information (you want to see holter/echo results) and they are breeding mostly untitled dogs with poor conformation. The IABCA "international champion" title is NOT worth any more than the paper its printed on when it comes to evaluating breeding stock. You can get that title on pretty much any doberman. Kansa would be your best choice out of those two.
 

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The IABCA "international champion" title is NOT worth any more than the paper its printed on when it comes to evaluating breeding stock. You can get that title on pretty much any doberman.
I know that one member here put one on their dog (who was already an AKC champion) just for some more ring experience before showing him as a special, and they said that the hardest part of the whole process was registering him with IABCA.
 
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