another question

well, I think that you need to figure out what you want first. Swift Run/Tammy and Cambria/The Whites are about as different as you can get in dobes - decide what you truly want, what you are looking for, what you are willing to pay, what your reasonable expectations about training/ability to train/desire to compete/train are, how well the dog will fit in with your other dogs, and again - what is most important to you - and then look for breeders that match that.

Just in the three breeders you mentioned, they have vastly different prices, health testing, titles and interests as well as ethics.

You can take a nice doberman from good lines and do lots of performance sports and do well, but you cannot take a high drive doberman and make it a couch potato or expect it to be happy just lounging around the house 24 hours a day 7 days a week, for instance.

Well, I personally wouldn't go looking at someone breeding by and large working dogs for the HOPE that you someday MAY be able to do schutzhund with the dog. Any average doberman is an active dog - heck, even the most couch potato ones I have met and owned are still more than willing to go out and hike, run - they just dont DEMAND it.

From what you wrote, no, a drivey over the top dog may not be what you want - ESPECIALLY not as a novice to the breed.

I'd make a list of what you realistically want from the dog. As a happy healthy pet that I wanted to be an upright citizen, a jogging companion, and a wonderful pet - personally I do not think you have to limit yourself to "working" breeders or those that label themselves that. There are plenty of wonderful breeders who health test, show their dogs in performance and conformation venues, and have longetivity in their lines that have a nice balance of working ability/drive and liveability.

Most dobes, I think, have the ability to do most sports out there to some degree, it's simply lack of owners ability, time, funds, or desire that limit them.

MeganUK said:

Thanks Kim. Yeah, an over the top working dog is not what i need. My GSD is just that! I was thinking that i would need to look at companion puppies from show breeders. I'll only be working 3 days a week so i will have a lot of extra time with the dogs, but it's spent running, horseback riding, fetch, dog park, basic obedience...nothing like schutzhund. I just want a well rounded, healthy, athletic dog with an outstanding personality. If i can get all that from a show breeder, i'll take it

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I see no reason why you can't get a well rounded reasonably healthy, athletic dog with brains and personality from a show breeder.

I sound like a broken record but all of my dogs start as conformation dogs--when they finish their championships (knock on wood, most of them do) they go on to performance stuff. My biggest would be couch potato is an American, Canadian and Int'l champion and a ROM dog (passed the WAE and has performance titles). He's got a CD, RE, AXJ, OA (some other agility titles in non AKC venues) and if you invite him to go tracking will be up and out to the car in a big hurry--put a tracking harness on and it makes no difference if there is torrential rain, snow, sleet or hail--for a dog that must be pushed out into a drizzle (he'll melt, you know?) he's ecstatic about the idea of going out and getting wet and muddy in the name of tracking. He'd have had more performance titles if we'd gotten around to starting him earlier but he didn't even get into the agility ring until he was six.

I've never done Schutzhund with my dogs mainly because when I was young enough and nimble enough there were no clubs anywhere near me--today--I don't even show my own dogs anymore because of my bad knees and someone else runs them in agility. We share the training. I have no doubt that if I had more time and energy to devote to it any of my dogs could do at least basic level Schutzhund (remember that only 1/3 is actual personal protection--the rest is essentially obedience and tracking). But I don't have enough time or engergy so we don't do Schutzhund.

I firmly believe that most Dobes can and will do anything you invest the time and energy to teach them.