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Aloha all,

Riley is a one year old female and a wonderful dog. I take her across the street to the park daily for runs and playtime with the neighborhood dogs. She always has had a dogtra collar on "just in case" and 90% of the time when used, it is just used on vibrate as a reminder to listen.

She has always got along with the neighborhood dogs until about two weeks ago when toys started being brought into the equation. A neighbor brought down a frisbee to through for their dog and Riley would go after it and bully any other dog that tried to participate. I started giving her a little vibration every time she went after the ball and that seemed to stop her bad behavior although I could see she really wanted to "own" the toy.

Yesterday, while in the park with two jack russells from down the street, their owner started throwing a ball and riley would attempt to get it. The JR, three times growled and nipped at Riley when she attempted to take the ball and we thought, good, she's being taught a lesson. A while later the throwing started up again but this time when the JR got the ball, Riley outright attacked. Hackles, fangs, JR on his back the whole show. I had to grab her by the scruff and throw her off. She went after him again one other time before it was back to the house and in the kennel for a good while. Today the behavior started again but the electronic collar kept her from going to far.

This is very new behavior and I'm not quite sure how to handle it. I am hoping you all can provide some insight.

Regards,

Mark
 

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Could you not take Riley, her very own ball & frisbee to the dog park or play with these toys, at home:
- and keep her away from the other dogs, for now
So you be the dogs playmate (step-up & assume the role)...problem solved.
- it appears, your not having effective e-collar results / damaging training aid, in the hands of the inexperience
 

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I may be inexperienced but that's why I'm coming to the group. Not sure how playing at home and keeping her away from other dogs is going to solve this problem. Can you elaborate? I'm looking for advise on how to get through this. I understand that if she never sees another dog, we won't have this problem.
 

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First, this is NOT coming from an "I don't like e-collars" place... I do like them, used properly.

Corrections which intervene in dog-to-dog interactions (or people-to-dog interactions, for that matter) often result in the corrected dog holding the other party responsible for the correction. This can cause the corrected dog to shift to proactive behavior: "I will get you before you get me!" Collar use such as you are practicing is almost guaranteed to result in aggression.

First, she must not be allowed to play in an environment which includes both toys and other dogs... this is the other problem, and why most dog parks prohibit toys and food.

Second, I would not allow any interaction (even toy-less) with these particular JRT's until this is fixed, and possibly not ever. Bitch fights are much more likely to result in long-term hard feelings, and I would expect her to not be safe around these dogs at present. It is possible that this will even generalize into animosity towards all JRT's, so be careful.

Third, I would suggest you get some knowledgable steerage with regard to e-collar use. This should never have happened, and would not have happened had you had a better idea of what you were doing. I would look here for a trainer: IACP Home and I would be careful to explain that you need to undo something which has been done. I would NOT, under any circumstances, hire anyone with a Sit Means Sit franchise. You need someone who has some finesse and some understanding of this kind of behavior. If you post your location, I may be able to find someone to recommend for you.
 

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Mmctaq has some good points. Your girl is also a year old- an age where she might be starting to push a little as she leaves puppyhood. Toys are very high reward items for some dogs too, and both your Dobe and the Jack Russell are getting fairly possessive over them, from what you said. I would definitely work with a trainer on this one, two possessive dogs who want the same toy is a bad combo.

Keeping your dog away from other dogs isn't a permanent solution, it's just a temporary one until you get a handle on this behavior. Right now, your girl's showing pretty clear indications that she's going to go after another dog in certain situations. I think the recommendation of not allowing her to play with other dogs is a good one until you get to a trainer. Maybe have a look at the NILIF program in the meantime- I incorporated that into my dog-aggressive boy's training program with some good results. People have mentioned the Control Unleashed book too, although I haven't read that. Again though, getting a trainer is going to be key for your girl.
 

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Re........A while later the throwing started up again but this time when the JR got the ball, Riley outright attacked. Hackles, fangs, JR on his back the whole show.........
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Mark, it seems to me that you want & like to (or intend) to go back to the dog park...so how do I fix Riley's aggressive problem?
I think this is too dangerous (DP's) at the moment and lucky you were strong enough to pull off your girl...in the heat of battle, stemming from jealously over the JR's toy.

If the training of your 9 month old girl is not yet rock solid and she is not totally focused on your verbal commands...even like "come"...controlling her off-leash movements in a dog park, running around willy-nilly, may be futile, at best.

The situation or atmosphere at your nearby dog park (DP) is not allowing her to stay out of trouble.
Only going back their after she is clearly more obedient...would be a step, in the right direction.
You have had a big red flag with the Dobe/JR's...consider your self very lucky, that no one ended up injured or worse.
 

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I am not fond of dog parks and even less fond of ecollars. Some dogs will become aggressive by using them even used correctly. This is not what I'd do with my dogs.
I think that the dog maybe confused and is blaming the other dogs for the correction which is common. I think I would skip the dog park and get her to an obedience class that has structured play. These parks seem to cause more problems than they resolve. Play at home,
 

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Hi Mark,

While it's unfortunate that your bitch has gotten into a full blown altercation with the JRT's at the dog park, she did, and that means that you now have personal experience with dog park problems.

There are many threads on this situation and you should spend some time reading them.

I, for one, use dog parks rarely and then only when there are no other dogs present. Even if your bitch hadn't jumped the JRT over the frisbee I'll tell you that typically if a problem starts at a dog park and a Doberman is present the Doberman will be blamed for the problem.

Dobes are NOT good candidates for dog park activities. If you think she must play with other dogs (and actually, for dogs after young puppyhood that's an overrated activity) find compatible dogs and take the play to someones yard rather than the dog park and leave all toys out of the play time.

You have a bitch who is approaching adulthood and I suspect that she will become more likely to become less and less cooperative about sharing space (much less toys) with other dogs.

And I agree with some of the information that other posters have put up about the proper use of electronic collars--you need some help with this from a professional who really understands how they work in conjunction with the dogs drives.

Good luck and stay out of the dog parks with your bitch. (Just my opinion)
 

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I am not fond of dog parks and even less fond of ecollars. Some dogs will become aggressive by using them even used correctly. This is not what I'd do with my dogs.
I think that the dog maybe confused and is blaming the other dogs for the correction which is common. I think I would skip the dog park and get her to an obedience class that has structured play. These parks seem to cause more problems than they resolve. Play at home,
I disagree that proper use of an e-collar will result in aggression. If unwanted consequences result, the training has been faulty.

Lots of people consider obedience classes to be social hour, and they are not. Unless you are in a class for baby puppies, play is not appropriate in a class setting... obedience class is for obedience training.
 

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I wanted to specifically address the resource guarding issue. You want to take care of this and while you are working on it you need to manage her environment so she doesn't have the chance to "practice" the bad behavior.

I highly, highly recommend Jean Donaldson's book, "Mine! A Practical Guide to Resource Guarding in Dogs." It's a short, step-by-step book on how to work on the issue. I got a lot out of it.
 

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I like dog parks but know they can come with problems. I watched when I went and who was there. When Kyrah was very young she played well with alot of dogs. As she got older she was picky about who she played with. Then it was one or two besides Cujo. We went to the park in the begining when she was young about 3-4 times a week regardless if there were other dogs there or not. This was not the only form of exercise for her it was an extra form. As she was appraoching a yr we went once a week and met with a certain group.

Kyrah has always listened overall very well. She does have an e-collar that my trainer taught me to use. But I only taught the recall with it and that is the only thing she thinks its for.

When she reached almost 1 1/2yrs there was only one dog there she would play with. Their first disagreement was over a toy which they had done fine with before. They stopped getting along so well and I believe they were trying to see who was top dog. They were close in age and even tho he was a male I still think that was the issue. One weekend they came close to getting into a fight and the next also. We never left on a bad note. Myself and the other owner walked around until they were both doing their own thing and everyone was fine. I decided at that time we would take a break from meeting our friends at the park. Besides I am her primary playmate and there are many other things we did on other days that I could easily fill this one hour a week with. After a month or so we went back to the park and she does fine. We go around once or twice a month. She does not play with other dogs and if she does its very very rarely. I believe the last one was a boston terrier she picked out and that was probably over 6 months ago. She does meet and greet but stays by my side for the most part. Even when we see her old playmate they greet and go about their business. When we go to the park my dogs just follow me around while I walk. I take them only so they can do some sniffing, peeing/pooping, and greeting. Now when I have little Dexter, my grandpup, he will play with some of the other dogs. I now prefer that Kyrah plays with just the two dogs that are closest to her, Cujo & Dexter. She can go from fine to kill mode in a split second. When she gets this way I make her sit or down stay until she is calm. If I release her before that she is still focused on what she was when I put her there. If there is a situation that I think something could happen I avoid it.

I dont think there is an aggession problem. I believe your dog is maturing and you will need to learn to read her better. Step in before she can make the decision of how to react. Tell her she cannot fetch the ball or toy its not hers. Put her in situations that will have positive outcomes and avoid situations that you may not be able to control. I guess I am trying to say you need to have better control over your dog.
 

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Thanks everyone for all the great thoughts. It looks like we have a lot of work to do and I appreciate the insight on the changes taking place. My other dog is a lab and I guess that during Riley's puppy period I was looking at her as a lab in a dobe's skin. I guess that's not the case. Not bad, just learning something. She's a wonderful dog and I guess I just need to work on me just as much as her at this point. Again, thanks for all the suggestions and comments.

Mark
 

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Thanks everyone for all the great thoughts. It looks like we have a lot of work to do and I appreciate the insight on the changes taking place. My other dog is a lab and I guess that during Riley's puppy period I was looking at her as a lab in a dobe's skin. I guess that's not the case. Not bad, just learning something. She's a wonderful dog and I guess I just need to work on me just as much as her at this point. Again, thanks for all the suggestions and comments.
Mark
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AMEN...you finally got it / and I tip my hat to you...ThkU for understanding. (my talking point in bold)
- my initial post did not solve your problem / internet you, had to see the shortfall
- now I can expand more again...to show you a different world of training & modified dog behavior

People have asked me why & how / I can train a dog so quick & good ??
- I tell them, that I am smarter than a dog...LOL..and it brings on a belly laugh, when they get my dry humor

You are now at a wonderful place, in your own mind...to make & shape a most awesome dobe.
- her is my secret explained, in layman terms...documented with many Amy pics.
http://www.dobermantalk.com/general-training-obedience/60146-teaching-your-dobe-catch.html

Learn to train your smart dobe, with love & play...and be, set for life !!
You become the leader-of-the-pack. (sorry...if this is an old school term)
- and remember / 20 minutes of mental stimulation thru. play = a 60 minute walk / with much less learning (most times)
(+ added change benifits, that is harder to quantify)
 
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