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Aurelius ‘Rue the Day’ Di Altobello (8-mos) fills my heart with absolute joy every day (with a dash of ‘ugh, I think this pup is trying to outsmart me at every turn!’ Lol).

I was so happy to get one of the two males in an eleven count litter. Aurelius was the last to be born and I fell in love with him and the white patch on his chest makes him a stand out. Q: I believe the white patch is unique to American dobermans and allowed by AKC. My boy comes predominantly from Euro lines. 1) In order to compete in shows/competitions, does the dobe need to be solely one line or the other; or is a mix allowed.

We are debating keeping Aurelius intact. He unfortunately had puppy cellulitis (completely unexpected) by breeder and our family.
Q: I understand that once a sire and dam breed puppies with cellulitis they should no longer be bred in future. However, does this preclude us from breeding Aurelius responsibly in the future?

And here’s my final question - and I may embarrass myself for asking this (please give me pass I’m new to much of this) - Q: Is it normal to have some of the same ancestors on both the side of the dam and sire? (ie Maxim Di Altobello is on both dam and sire side). This is probably what you want in a line but I don’t know!!! Shy face.

This group is amazing! Thank you!!!
 

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Aurelius ‘Rue the Day’ Di Altobello (8-mos) fills my heart with absolute joy every day (with a dash of ‘ugh, I think this pup is trying to outsmart me at every turn!’ Lol).

I was so happy to get one of the two males in an eleven count litter. Aurelius was the last to be born and I fell in love with him and the white patch on his chest makes him a stand out. Q: I believe the white patch is unique to American dobermans and allowed by AKC. My boy comes predominantly from Euro lines. 1) In order to compete in shows/competitions, does the dobe need to be solely one line or the other; or is a mix allowed.

We are debating keeping Aurelius intact. He unfortunately had puppy cellulitis (completely unexpected) by breeder and our family.
Q: I understand that once a sire and dam breed puppies with cellulitis they should no longer be bred in future. However, does this preclude us from breeding Aurelius responsibly in the future?

And here’s my final question - and I may embarrass myself for asking this (please give me pass I’m new to much of this) - Q: Is it normal to have some of the same ancestors on both the side of the dam and sire? (ie Maxim Di Altobello is on both dam and sire side). This is probably what you want in a line but I don’t know!!! Shy face.

This group is amazing! Thank you!!!
My 4.5 month Euro pup has a very narrow vertical white patch (zipper) on her chest.
She is not AKC. The AKC standard allows a 1/2 inch square white patch on the chest if I remember correctly when I looked it up.
 

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Aurelius ‘Rue the Day’ Di Altobello (8-mos) fills my heart with absolute joy every day (with a dash of ‘ugh, I think this pup is trying to outsmart me at every turn!’ Lol).

I was so happy to get one of the two males in an eleven count litter. Aurelius was the last to be born and I fell in love with him and the white patch on his chest makes him a stand out. Q: I believe the white patch is unique to American dobermans and allowed by AKC. My boy comes predominantly from Euro lines. 1) In order to compete in shows/competitions, does the dobe need to be solely one line or the other; or is a mix allowed.
All that's required is he is purebred. Understand, though, that the Eastern Euro dogs don't tend to do well in Conformation here, as they tend to be oversized and extreme. Have you studied the Standards from both the DPCA and FCI?

We are debating keeping Aurelius intact. He unfortunately had puppy cellulitis (completely unexpected) by breeder and our family.
Q: I understand that once a sire and dam breed puppies with cellulitis they should no longer be bred in future. However, does this preclude us from breeding Aurelius responsibly in the future?

And here’s my final question - and I may embarrass myself for asking this (please give me pass I’m new to much of this) - Q: Is it normal to have some of the same ancestors on both the side of the dam and sire? (ie Maxim Di Altobello is on both dam and sire side). This is probably what you want in a line but I don’t know!!! Shy face.
I would find a mentor local to you who can help you understand the pedigree and help you further. I would encourage you NOT to breed, as Altobello's health testing is scattered at best, and not a good starting point. Instead, get to know the breed, title your current dog, and learn a LOT more before you consider breeding.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
All that's required is he is purebred. Understand, though, that the Eastern Euro dogs don't tend to do well in Conformation here, as they tend to be oversized and extreme. Have you studied the Standards from both the DPCA and FCI?



I would find a mentor local to you who can help you understand the pedigree and help you further. I would encourage you NOT to breed, as Altobello's health testing is scattered at best, and not a good starting point. Instead, get to know the breed, title your current dog, and learn a LOT more before you consider breeding.
Aurelius ‘Rue the Day’ Di Altobello (8-mos) fills my heart with absolute joy every day (with a dash of ‘ugh, I think this pup is trying to outsmart me at every turn!’ Lol).

I was so happy to get one of the two males in an eleven count litter. Aurelius was the last to be born and I fell in love with him and the white patch on his chest makes him a stand out. Q: I believe the white patch is unique to American dobermans and allowed by AKC. My boy comes predominantly from Euro lines. 1) In order to compete in shows/competitions, does the dobe need to be solely one line or the other; or is a mix allowed.

We are debating keeping Aurelius intact. He unfortunately had puppy cellulitis (completely unexpected) by breeder and our family.
Q: I understand that once a sire and dam breed puppies with cellulitis they should no longer be bred in future. However, does this preclude us from breeding Aurelius responsibly in the future?

And here’s my final question - and I may embarrass myself for asking this (please give me pass I’m new to much of this) - Q: Is it normal to have some of the same ancestors on both the side of the dam and sire? (ie Maxim Di Altobello is on both dam and sire side). This is probably what you want in a line but I don’t know!!! Shy face.

This group is amazing! Thank you!!!
I concur! After I posted this I thought it a bit premature to consider breeding my boy. There is SO much to learn and I would not want to be a back yard breeder. I’m finding the Altobello lineage to be exactly as you said - scattered as to health data. A lot is missing. I find this all very fascinating and want to learn as much as possible so I do my best for Aurelius and the breed :)
 

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In that case: love your boy, and learn from him. Title him in as many work-focused venues as interest you, as it isn't likely you'll do well in Conformation unless he truly fits the DPCA Standard. Make a point to learn both Standards, and learn how to critique the dog standing in front of you, to see both good and bad. This will benefit you in the future, should you decide to get a dog from an exceptional breeder with a specific focus in mind.
 

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I would recommend you consider joining your local DPCA chapter club. You sound enthusiastic about the breed and someone who wants to be involved. If you have a good club near you you can connect with people active in the breed and find others who can help you learn more, find things you might be interested in, and get more involved. You might also look into the UDC as well. Getting more involved in the Doberman "world" and being active is a good way to connect with others.
 

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I concur! After I posted this I thought it a bit premature to consider breeding my boy. There is SO much to learn and I would not want to be a back yard breeder. I’m finding the Altobello lineage to be exactly as you said - scattered as to health data. A lot is missing. I find this all very fascinating and want to learn as much as possible so I do my best for Aurelius and the breed :)
You can certainly compete in all kinds of dog events, and I'd encourage you to check several of them out. It is good to keep your boy intact till he is mature - age 2ish, but breeding is something that should be considered after many many years of studying the breed. Only the best should be bred.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
My 4.5 month Euro pup has a very narrow vertical white patch (zipper) on her chest.
She is not AKC. The AKC standard allows a 1/2 inch square white patch on the chest if I remember correctly when I looked it up.
The white adds to my boy’s quirky personality! Plus makes him easier to spot at night! Did you choose your pup or did your pup choose you! Was he the only one in litter with the white?
 

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All that's required is he is purebred. Understand, though, that the Eastern Euro dogs don't tend to do well in Conformation here, as they tend to be oversized and extreme. Have you studied the Standards from both the DPCA and FCI?



I would find a mentor local to you who can help you understand the pedigree and help you further. I would encourage you NOT to breed, as Altobello's health testing is scattered at best, and not a good starting point. Instead, get to know the breed, title your current dog, and learn a LOT more before you consider breeding.
This site is ADDICTIVE!! I start one thread and before you know it, my Saturday is half-over and I score very poorly in the working group for humans today as my housework (none) will attest. What’s the best way to find a mentor? We are on the coast and there isn’t a large dobe population. I’m guessing by joining a club (even if it’s a drive) will introduce me to folks and potential mentors?
 

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When researching Aurelius’ lineage, I was unable to pull up several dobes. Is it because the database was limited? Or...? there are so many different databases. I was on one for Europe, but I do believe the boy has American roots. My hands are nearly numb from being on this site all day, but I see that a lot of you have been members for years!! Where do you think I’ll have the best results? (I know you all get asked that all the time). Aurelius’ mom was Kona’s Azja Di Altobello and dad is Mahler Von Shotcahler Di Altobello. Thank you!!!
 

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When researching Aurelius’ lineage, I was unable to pull up several dobes. Is it because the database was limited? Or...? there are so many different databases. I was on one for Europe, but I do believe the boy has American roots. My hands are nearly numb from being on this site all day, but I see that a lot of you have been members for years!! Where do you think I’ll have the best results? (I know you all get asked that all the time). Aurelius’ mom was Kona’s Azja Di Altobello and dad is Mahler Von Shotcahler Di Altobello. Thank you!!!
OH!!! And how do they collect the data such as DOD? Or cause?
 

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Did you order a certified AKC pedigree when you registered him? If so, it will tell you which country any imported ancestors were from. (If you didn't, you can still order one.) That said, going from the names of his sire and dam, he has European show lines behind him, as Altobello is a kennel in Serbia.

As far as databases, pretty much all of them rely on owners inputting information about the dogs themselves.
 

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This site is ADDICTIVE!! I start one thread and before you know it, my Saturday is half-over and I score very poorly in the working group for humans today as my housework (none) will attest. What’s the best way to find a mentor? We are on the coast and there isn’t a large dobe population. I’m guessing by joining a club (even if it’s a drive) will introduce me to folks and potential mentors?
Yes, join a club. The DPCA website has a section specifically for chapter clubs.

When researching Aurelius’ lineage, I was unable to pull up several dobes. Is it because the database was limited? Or...? there are so many different databases. I was on one for Europe, but I do believe the boy has American roots. My hands are nearly numb from being on this site all day, but I see that a lot of you have been members for years!! Where do you think I’ll have the best results? (I know you all get asked that all the time). Aurelius’ mom was Kona’s Azja Di Altobello and dad is Mahler Von Shotcahler Di Altobello. Thank you!!!
Altobello is Serbian. Did you purchase this dog from a breeder here? They should have provided a pedigree. Either way, Altobello dogs don't have American origins, and you'd only get as far as the user-updated databases can go. I know there's a European dog database like our dobequest but I've never used it.

OH!!! And how do they collect the data such as DOD? Or cause?
As mentioned, this is entirely up to the owners and breeders to update their dogs. That's the major fault - there usually isn't much oversight, and people can choose to update as much or as little as they want. Heck, I forgot about my dog's Dobequest page until her recent cardio diagnosis, which caused a firestorm over my lack of updates...and since I just dropped my membership to the DPCA, I'll have to rely on others to do the updates for me.
 
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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Yes, join a club. The DPCA website has a section specifically for chapter clubs.



Altobello is Serbian. Did you purchase this dog from a breeder here? They should have provided a pedigree. Either way, Altobello dogs don't have American origins, and you'd only get as far as the user-updated databases can go. I know there's a European dog database like our dobequest but I've never used it.
SO- yes. Here’s the abridged version. Purchased Aurelius from local breeder who owned both sire and dam and kept puppy for herself. Positive sign. This was her first go round breeding dobes, but had spent years prior breeding Great Danes. She acquired the dam thru a ‘custody battle’ with her ex and later purchased the sire. Longer version: I’d started on AKC trying to find a reputable breeder. (Ended up forfeiting substantial deposit on breeder back East- just had a BAD feeling.) I’d then found a breeder in Oregon who claimed extreme diligence in trying to refine her line, drew from champion lines and was featured in law enforcement magazines as well as achievements in various titles/championships of her own. I reached out multiple times-no response. It was completely coincidental and a pleasant surprise -at time- that ultimately, Aurelius’ dad was whelped by this very same breeder. Small world! Both sire and dam have Maxim Di Altobello in their lineage about 3-4 generations back? I confirmed with my breeder Altobello was the Serbian group. I’m thinking there must be American on mom’s side as AKC and elsewhere state that the white patch is unique to American dobes and not seen in Euros.

As mentioned, this is entirely up to the owners and breeders to update their dogs. That's the major fault - there usually isn't much oversight, and people can choose to update as much or as little as they want. Heck, I forgot about my dog's Dobequest page until her recent cardio diagnosis, which caused a firestorm over my lack of updates...and since I just dropped my membership to the DPCA, I'll have to rely on others to do the updates for me.
I was wondering if the data was all self report. Is that the same with OFA?
 

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For OFA, owners send in either x-rays or vet reports, depending on what is being tested. Passing evaluations are posted on the website, and anyone can look them up. I believe that the owner has the option of not having a passing test posted, though.
 

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Aurelius ‘Rue the Day’ Di Altobello (8-mos) fills my heart with absolute joy every day (with a dash of ‘ugh, I think this pup is trying to outsmart me at every turn!’ Lol).

I was so happy to get one of the two males in an eleven count litter. Aurelius was the last to be born and I fell in love with him and the white patch on his chest makes him a stand out. Q: I believe the white patch is unique to American dobermans and allowed by AKC. My boy comes predominantly from Euro lines. 1) In order to compete in shows/competitions, does the dobe need to be solely one line or the other; or is a mix allowed.

We are debating keeping Aurelius intact. He unfortunately had puppy cellulitis (completely unexpected) by breeder and our family.
Q: I understand that once a sire and dam breed puppies with cellulitis they should no longer be bred in future. However, does this preclude us from breeding Aurelius responsibly in the future?

And here’s my final question - and I may embarrass myself for asking this (please give me pass I’m new to much of this) - Q: Is it normal to have some of the same ancestors on both the side of the dam and sire? (ie Maxim Di Altobello is on both dam and sire side). This is probably what you want in a line but I don’t know!!! Shy face.

This group is amazing! Thank you!!!
PLEASE don't breed that dog!! He's either a Dobermann, or a Doberman Pinscher. He's not both. Sounds like he is a diluted Pinscher and will make a great family dog, but not one to carry correct conformation and breed standards for either.
 

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PLEASE don't breed that dog!! He's either a Dobermann, or a Doberman Pinscher. He's not both. Sounds like he is a diluted Pinscher and will make a great family dog, but not one to carry correct conformation and breed standards for either.
AGREED- He’s amazing and truly a great family pup! In hind site, I should have phrased the question about breeding from an empirical standpoint, in general terms re: breeding a puppy who had puppy cellulitis, as opposed to my Aurelius specifically. I’m truly after knowledge and connecting with those who have the same appreciation for the breed.

As to his lineage- it’s yet another quest that I’m super curious to fully understand- kinda like Ancestry for humans! Rest assured, the last thing I’d want to do is hurt the progress that’s been made by breeders who ‘live and breathe’ to refine the breed by passing along puppies that were simply the product of an easy pairing without the same due diligence as reputable breeders. That’s an insult to all they do. I’m years from being at that level- if I ever go down that road!! Doesn’t mean I can’t immerse myself in all that you have to offer- join clubs, attend events, continue to learn all I can, teach my boy all I can, make friendships and ensure Aurelius shines!
 

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I’m appreciative of all of you and I’m trying to respond/answer your questions but I may be doing something wrong as the flow of post seems off😜 Fainfenix- I responded to you however it signaled the reply was being reviewed by moderator!
 

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I’m appreciative of all of you and I’m trying to respond/answer your questions but I may be doing something wrong as the flow of post seems off😜 Fainfenix- I responded to you however it signaled the reply was being reviewed by moderator!
I'm not sure why the moderator signal happened. We do check out the first few posts that people make to make sure they're real and not spam, but you've got several posts already. Maybe that post was made before a bunch of the other ones you wrote??

Have you tried the quote function?
Click on "Quote" underneath any post you want to respond to (you can do multiple quotes on your reply.) Then when you go down to the post reply box, click on "Insert Quotes" and chose which ones you want displayed in your post. If you decide you don't want to respond to one of those on the list, you can put it in the garbage. What you have left will display, and you can respond under each quote to answer it directly.
 
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