|Topic Review (Newest First)|
|09-19-2017 06:44 PM|
I couldn't agree more, Meadowcat. Jada is 5 yrs old and we have been through much together and I have seen her react in many different situations. Her patience with children. My 3 yrs old grandchild falling on her accidently. Another poking Jada in the |
eye and Jada did not growl, but did jump up quickly to get away. The child was knocked
away and someone in the room took it as an aggressive act, I think because she expected it from a Doberman. I feel I know my dog and she did know what she had done after the fact it startled her. I have never seen her act that intense. Maybe the postman hesitated, came up the stairs, backed up and went down and then started up again.
I won't know. My trust in her has not wavered. Training - yes, more of it.
It came to a stop this past year and ahalf because of my therapy. She is amazing, and should have had a better trainer. I have seen her on a down command, when another dog broke and came over and jumped her. She would not break, but kept eyes steadfastly on me. Hopefully, it is not too late to take up where we left off.
|09-19-2017 05:04 PM|
What you have here is very simply a case of redirected aggression, which happens simply when arousal levels are so high that the dog can no longer make choices and the object of the frustration is not reachable. This is a pretty good write up here: Redirected Dog Aggression Explained in Simple Terms | David Reinecker |
It's much more common in a situation like breaking up a dog fight - you step in, and you get bitten by one of the dogs, who never intended to bite you. It's certainly NOT ideal that your dog bit you, but it's also not something that, to me, is an automatic judgement about the dog's temperament. HOWEVER! I would personally want to work on self-control issues with her - I'd start doing some games like "it's yer choice" and other similar games to help her with self-control, because I'd want her to have a better self control switch...ideally, she shouldn't really get that overaroused with someone coming up the sidewalk (just MY opinion, of course, but even a stranger approaching the house, to me, isn't cause for arousal levels high enough to cause a dog to redirect to a bite). That's just my two cents, of course - other people may feel differently. My dogs may bark or be watchful at people approaching but I wouldn't want arousal levels sky high.
|09-19-2017 04:39 PM|
Originally Posted by jeitzen View Post
And I wouldn't dismiss, ignore nor necessarily excuse the behavior but it does happen and I at least have some idea of how and why it happens.
I'm not very forgiving of bites--and you can find me recommending euthanasia where a dog has bitten a family member--several times on these forums in fact. But I will look at all the circumstances involved in the bite and make my judgment call from the available information.
|09-19-2017 04:25 PM|
Originally Posted by alan j. View Post
I've had a couple of other dogs who were drivey enough that they might have nailed me in exasperation at being restrained but both of hem were also thoroughly trained enough that yelling "NO--HEEL!" and getting out of the area worked since both the aggressor dog and my dog were on leash and we managed to get far enough away they pretty quickly cooled to below threshold.
Most of these bites if the dog is on leash happen because you are trying restrain them and there is a dog response to restraint which will cause them do one of two things--either pull back against the direction of the restraint or if they are amped enough they'll swing their head and bite.
I saw later in this thread that someone really disagreed with my take on this--that your own dog should never bite you. In general I agree with that but I think there are some unusual circumstances where my dog biting me might be forgivable.
On the other hand, except for the puppy who bit me when he was engaged in a three dog fight--none of my dogs have bitten me. I've tripped over them and fallen on them--I've walked on them in the dead of night when I didn't turn lights on and the dog was sleeping someplace none of the dogs ever slept. And I've sat on some of them when they thought they'd have a nice nap in a chair or couch they weren't allowed on and even though it surprised the heck out of them and me they didn't bite.
|09-19-2017 01:18 PM|
I use to walk off-leash at night with former Amy, down the center of the roadway since there were no sidewalks / the area was very-very low on traffic, so Amy was safe (being 100% reliable on recall). |
- all of a sudden 2 little yappy Yorkies, came running towards us
- and the owner thought this was funny / she was proud of the pair of barkers / growling & advancing
- looked to me like they wanted to bite my feet or those of my doberman
So I yell at the lady:
Get your darn little dogs off the road, or I might mistake one for a football & kick it back to your front lawn
or if one bites my big girl, your little dogs will be on the loosing end of a fight.
- I never seen a senior lady, run so fast...LOL...to get her dogs, back home & under control
- never had future problems with these dogs either, on our walks
|09-19-2017 01:11 PM|
I'm sure you were feeling a little smug after that!! |
Well not really - I was more like P.O.ed ! ( We Were Shelling corn ) AND I MISSED a beautiful Kodak Moment -- LOL
I did give her a big hug and patted her and told how good a girl she was -
The bad part was after I got cleaned up and sat down and had a couple of beers - I just could not quit laughing - even woke up in the middle of the night lmao . I know - I'm not right lol
|09-19-2017 11:32 AM|
Originally Posted by ECIN View Post
|09-19-2017 11:10 AM|
I hate that little dog! |
Now that's funny !
My B-I-L and his wife had one of them wiener dogs - They keep saying they were going to bring it over here one day - I keep telling them NOT to - As in our dogs had never been around a little dog -
Well one day - and I wasn't here - She brought it over - Wife about had the big one - She let it down -- Ali was laying on the floor and all that dog did was run around Ali - bark and snip at her - well Ali had - had enough and took her size 11 paw and pinned it down on the floor and wife said she just looked around at her - as in I took care of that deal - Wife had Ali to let it go - S-I-L jumped up picked up her dog and left - lmao AND they never brought it back over -
|09-19-2017 10:33 AM|
Originally Posted by Beaumont67 View Post
I kind of have the opposite problem with Zuko. We were on a walk last night after work and he was charged at by a little white dog, off-leash in its own yard. Kept going after Zuko, meanwhile he's pretty much cowering behind me on his prong collar, not doing a damn thing, meanwhile I try to step between the two and the owner is getting mad at me for 'kicking' her dog (nudge), we keep walking and it follows us to the next yard and the owner is just yelling her head off for it to come back. A friend of ours has a German Shephard that got charged at once by a little Chihuahua and ended up killing it. I asked my hubby to ask him for a favor, take their GS for a nice stroll down that block....
I hate that little dog! And also wish Zuko would try to defend himself...
|09-19-2017 10:19 AM|
Sorry Cressrb - But woke up early this morning still -- lol at your post - |
When Kasia was still here - If I ignored her - she would take her pincher teeth and grab the hair on my arm and pull it out - dang that would hurt - just her way of talking
|09-19-2017 12:21 AM|
^^ Great story of Jada staying with hurt mommy...last year. |
But a bite in the a*s from ones very own dog, should be of some concern / its not an option, to excuse IMO.
- Kelly has gone into red-zone before, but her teeth will never lead to harming family human skin...ever
- my pups get indoctrinated to my "soft bite/muzzle control" lessons https://www.dobermantalk.com/general-...attention.html
- once she was going berserk at back door, as I had called an electrician friend (she never met before)
- before opening the door, I said Love-Love and bend down & kissed her k9 tooth fang
- she knows Dad can block her or touch her any time I want, and give out my direction, even when she would sooner not ignore a non-threat...its not her option though
Just saying !!
Our Kelly can get jacked up too, when a stranger comes to the door sometimes / even frosting at the mouth (bubbles of saliva) & high decibel barking with K9 fangs exposed & lots of jaw chomping.
- once the G-Witness pair parked their car across the road and walked up our driveway, in their Sunday suits
- I'm usually pretty respectful to them, but this time I said:
- tell your Religion Flock, this property is off limits to your kind
- rather stupid to walk up a long rural driveway / if my dog is outside, its off-leash...so stay away
|09-18-2017 10:35 PM|
I have given you one side of Jada and I feel I should leave you with the other side of her. |
Summer before last I had a terrible fall in our back yard. I could not move for the pain. Not realizing at the time I had broken huge piece out of my shoulder socket so my arm had nothing to anchor when I tried standing up. I was just dangling. Jada was with me
and immediately assessed the situation. I lay on the ground until my husbad came home from work - probably only an hour, but Jada had stretched out beside me, touching me, laying very still the whole time. And this from the busy body that is always chasing or barking at something she sees. Rich had to call ER. Jada would not leave her position close to me nor was she about to let strangers come near. She had to be pulled away and put up. If this had been my Staffy Bull, she would have been jumping on my chest in joy that was on her level, or bringing my a ball to drop on my head. I am totally devoted to this breed - the Doberman. My regret is not discovering them when I was younger.
|09-18-2017 09:19 PM|
|alan j.|| |
Originally Posted by dobebug View Post
|09-18-2017 09:09 PM|
Yeah, poor mailman. He was a new one. He was just ready to hand me the pkg when I yelled, 'Ouch' 'You dumb dog' and shut the door quickly to get a handle on it. |
I thnk I was supposed to sign for something, but the pkg was left nicely in front of my door and no sign of the P.M.
|09-18-2017 08:42 PM|
Originally Posted by Cressrb View Post
I know - I'm new on here - But have to wonder if Big girl was just protecting HER house and HER best friend - The way you wrote - He was just not walking up to say hi - he was in a hurry - Nothing -- Nothing - get's our dogs jacked up than somebody running or walking very fast -
We have a pretty - full glass storm door - always like to have it open - When Kadin was a pup - He would just stand there and look out - I took pictures of him there every week - History you know - to see how much he had grown - Boy - that stopped as he got bigger ! I thought one time - when a sells man come to the door - I thought he was going threw it ! Just like you and your Girl - The door is shut - maybe for good - If somebody comes to it - I go out back door and come around to see what's going on - lol
Hope the South Side gets well quick !
|09-18-2017 07:47 PM|
Yes, that is what I see in Jada. I really have never seen anything like her. But, I trust her with my life and I know it was not a vicious act against me. I am nursing a sore |
bum. I thought she had drawn blood, but all I have is a big bruise. Actually, I have
been laughing about it, altho Jada is in her dog house right now to cool it.
But yes, you said it, her attitude came through loud and clear - 'Outta my way, I got this'.
|09-18-2017 07:42 PM|
Yeah, it happens with dogs who are high prey drive or fight drive types according to the IPO/Ring etc group. |
It's basically a "get outta' my way" message from the dog.
According to the folk I know who dabble in Ring (more than IPO) if you jack a dog up enough everything they are doing is so focused that they resort to misplaced actions--misplaced aggression may get a dog to chew and claw his way up the least to bite you. Just as a dog who has high fight drive may when raging at another dog bite you when she can't bite the other dog.
I think a lot of people in working sports would regard this as appropriate (or at least acceptable) behavior.
My very first dog was like that--hard as nails with a lot of drive--he nailed a German Shepherd breeder in the face when she tried to slap him when he was having a fit on a bench up in Canada and she thought she'd be able to shut him up. The fit he was having was at some teenagers who had worked a terrier up into a lather of his own and they were "showing their friends how tough their terrier was--how he wanted to fight the Doberman". His breeder/co-owner arrived in time to keep the dog from pulling the bench chain out of the bench--the GSD breeder said that she should have known better--turned out she did Schutzhund with her Shepherds and had to be careful about what she was doing with them when she wanted to "turn them off". (All this with blood running down her cheek--she also said that it was only a warning--he wasn't upset with her at all).
That was about 50 years ago--good thing too--today she'd have been suing the pants off of everyone who had anything to do with my dog. Back in the bad old days when you couldn't crate a dog on a bench--I really don't miss benched shows...
|09-18-2017 07:14 PM|
Never had this happen before....
Ok, my dog is not vicious, but she is keen and her prey drive is strong.
Today I could hear her at the front door raging. The door was open, the
glass storm door was locked.
I hurried to see what the commotion was and a new mailman was coming up the stairs with a pkg in a very halting and fearful manner. Jada was out of
control, so I got in front of her to intercede between postman and her.
Repriminded her, pushed her back with my leg - she was still hot to trot and
when I turned my back she bit my rear!!
I think it surprised her as much as it did me and she backed up, but she
still would have gone thru that door if she could.
Has anyone ever had that happen?