Doberman puppy will not stop biting my older dog. - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums
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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-10-2020, 11:08 PM Thread Starter
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Doberman puppy will not stop biting my older dog.

I've had my 10-week old male Doberman puppy for the past two weeks. I slowly introduced him to my 4.5-year old female Boxer. After a few days of aloofness from my Boxer, they started playing. They played pretty rough, and I was quick to separate them because I didn't want the 12-pound puppy to get hurt by the 75-pound Boxer. Since we first let them play, they have a hard time ignoring each other. If they're both out together, there's a 99% chance they're "playing," or whatever that means now. For most of the past two weeks, the puppy showed signs of being submissive. My Boxer would push him over and stand on top of him when he was getting annoying, and he would lay there.

Now, over the past week, the rough playing has turned into puppy-bites. At first, they were nips, but now he is grabbing onto the scruff around her neck or onto her jowls. He has drawn blood quite a few times, and the bites are getting more and more substantial. My Boxer hasn't really reacted to his biting (and I don't think she will, it's not her personality), but I'm really not happy to see it and I want to put an end to it. I don't want him to think this is okay.

Over the past two days, they've decided they don't want to share anything. When one dog picks up a toy, the other one takes it away, and they go back and forth until the puppy gets rough, bites, and I separate them.

After I separate them I've tried a hard and loud "no bite," while laying the puppy on his side until he calms down. This hasn't worked. The moment he gets up it's right back to more of the same. I've tried sending him for time-out in his play pen. He'll whine and jump at the grates endlessly. When I eventually let him out, it's more of the same. He probably doesn't even realize why he's in there in the first place because the whining starts the moment I close the door to the play pen.

Some have suggested that regular naps might help, but I don't think it will make a difference. He's like this from the moment he wakes up in the morning until the moment he sleeps at night. Of course, it is worse when he is cranky and tired, but it's pretty constant throughout the day.

I understand that he is a 10-week old puppy, and I'm happy to put up with his bites when he bites me, but watching my older dog get bit by him is too much. She's an amazing dog, and it truly makes me sad. I'm hoping he will outgrow this phase if nothing else, but does this mean I have to keep them separated for several months?

Any suggestions on what to do here?

I don't want to list out every issue I'm trying to work on with him here, but in case they're relevant, I'll briefly mention that he has a food fixation the moment he hears food. He dives into the food storage containers head first. When I open his play pen he runs full speed straight to my other dog's elevated food bowl and jumps up hoping there is food in it. And he's even done this while she was eating. It's hard to break his focus. It's not aggression, but fixation.
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by bluesuitcase View Post
I've had my 10-week old male Doberman puppy for the past two weeks. I slowly introduced him to my 4.5-year old female Boxer. After a few days of aloofness from my Boxer, they started playing. They played pretty rough, and I was quick to separate them because I didn't want the 12-pound puppy to get hurt by the 75-pound Boxer. Since we first let them play, they have a hard time ignoring each other. If they're both out together, there's a 99% chance they're "playing," or whatever that means now. For most of the past two weeks, the puppy showed signs of being submissive. My Boxer would push him over and stand on top of him when he was getting annoying, and he would lay there.

Now, over the past week, the rough playing has turned into puppy-bites. At first, they were nips, but now he is grabbing onto the scruff around her neck or onto her jowls. He has drawn blood quite a few times, and the bites are getting more and more substantial. My Boxer hasn't really reacted to his biting (and I don't think she will, it's not her personality), but I'm really not happy to see it and I want to put an end to it. I don't want him to think this is okay.

Over the past two days, they've decided they don't want to share anything. When one dog picks up a toy, the other one takes it away, and they go back and forth until the puppy gets rough, bites, and I separate them.

After I separate them I've tried a hard and loud "no bite," while laying the puppy on his side until he calms down. This hasn't worked. The moment he gets up it's right back to more of the same. I've tried sending him for time-out in his play pen. He'll whine and jump at the grates endlessly. When I eventually let him out, it's more of the same. He probably doesn't even realize why he's in there in the first place because the whining starts the moment I close the door to the play pen.

Some have suggested that regular naps might help, but I don't think it will make a difference. He's like this from the moment he wakes up in the morning until the moment he sleeps at night. Of course, it is worse when he is cranky and tired, but it's pretty constant throughout the day.

I understand that he is a 10-week old puppy, and I'm happy to put up with his bites when he bites me, but watching my older dog get bit by him is too much. She's an amazing dog, and it truly makes me sad. I'm hoping he will outgrow this phase if nothing else, but does this mean I have to keep them separated for several months?

Any suggestions on what to do here?

I don't want to list out every issue I'm trying to work on with him here, but in case they're relevant, I'll briefly mention that he has a food fixation the moment he hears food. He dives into the food storage containers head first. When I open his play pen he runs full speed straight to my other dog's elevated food bowl and jumps up hoping there is food in it. And he's even done this while she was eating. It's hard to break his focus. It's not aggression, but fixation.
Congrats on your new puppy!
Just like our human children we have to teach them from the very beginning what is acceptable and what is not acceptable behavior.
IMO For any puppy of this age we must always be teaching proper behavior. In order to do this (when outside of pen or crate) my suggestion is to place puppy onto a 6 foot leash. The puppy should always be with you on this leash in order for you to witness proper behavior and well as negative behavior. By allowing yourself to be so close (within 6 feet) this give you the opportunity to notice proper behavior in the moment and reward that behavior or notice negative behavior and issue your displeasure in that behavior.
Puppies just like our human babies are so excited......everything is new ......and no litter mates now so picking on your older dog can be quite exciting also.
I purchase a nice 1 inch leather leash and a martingale collar .........and would tuck my end of the leash into my jeans pocket.
My Hoss as a puppy was basically at my hip always........now no worries they will learn to follow you.........and you will not have to do this forever .......but just know that teaching “yes” takes time BUT undoing negative behavior will take ALOT more time.
The only time puppy should have free run time in crate or pen...or outside separated from your older dog.
As puppy matures ........things will improve.
Also when training your dog NEVER let then win.....that reinforces the negative behavior......like when you crate and pup whines ....if you get tired from the whining ....and let pup out....POOF pup won! Turn crate into a fun place........try traditional Kong.....wet your dog food ...stuff the Kong with this food and freeze the Kong. When pup is placed in crate .....let pup settle for a few moments...(when not whining ) then give pup the frozen Kong. This will give all of you some moments of quiet.
I understand ....shoot when Hoss was a pup ...it was exhausting for me also. Like having a newborn baby in the house. Some days I was just so tired from interruptions in sleep I just wanted QUIET..........but as time went by .....things got better. Having pup at my hip allowed me to train in short spurts all the time.....so looking forward to more of your stories and pictures of this little smarty pants !!! LOL .......so hang in there .......and take control of that pup! LOL
As far as feeding time ......find a way to slow down that desire to attack the food dish. Pup wants as much as he can get......so there are toys that you can place kibble in that they roll around or mats ....to slow them down..........some use cup cake tins......
Be creative......and never let the puppy out smart you .....anticipate the pups behavior and overcome! After all we are Humans!!!
Now go take control of that pup!!!
Seriously ....would love to hear more from you ...this is a great forum with lots of experience......

Hoss

Last edited by LadyDi; 04-11-2020 at 07:32 AM.
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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 09:24 AM
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I have some thoughts but I want to make sure I understand the situation fully before suggesting anything.

What's his daily routine since you brought him home? Just describe a typical day in the life of your puppy.



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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 02:10 PM
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I'm going to start at the back end of your puppy issues with one of the easier things. About the food and his reaction to it and trying to get your Boxer's food while she's eating it.

When you are going to feed the dog or dogs, crate the puppy or put him in the pen so he isn't diving into the food container or bugging the Boxer. It's not too early to teach an easy thing like a 'sit' and 'stay'. Make sure he's on leash and the Boxer is not around as a distraction. Take a few kibble and hold one close to his nose and raising it slowing until he sits--when he does this quickly give him the piece of kibble and say "GOOD SIT!" Be really happy about it. Repeat for four or five kibbles. Do this four or five times a day. Eventually he'll get this down pat and you can let him out of the crate or the pen and pick a place--have him sit and with him sitting give him his dish of food.

Don't keep repeating the commands and start out with the command AFTER he has already sat.

Do not feed him and your Boxer together. Feed him in his pen or crate and her where ever she normally eats but don't turn the puppy loose until she's finished eating and the pan is gone--ditto for the puppy.

You need to set this up so he always succeeds--every time he dives into the food bag or into the Boxer's food bowl he's won--and he won't quit trying until you make it impossible for him to do it wrong.

Doberman puppies are very rough--and he will not 'get' your no bite command and catching him and laying him down on his side will not stop him from mauling your Boxer. Bottom line is that most Dobe puppies aren't suited to play with adult dogs because they are so rough.

When my Aussie was alive he took a lot of mauling from the various Dobe puppies he helped raise. They would grab his mane and drag him around. Occasionally a puppy would bite him hard enough to make it through all the hair and the Aussie would bite them back--at that point I'd bring every one except the Dobe puppy inside and leave him outside alone (or with me) to cool his jets.

Or I'd do the opposite and bring the puppy in and I don't let puppies bite me--as soon as he bit me he went in the crate for a time out or I walked into another room and shut the door in his face and left him for a few minutes. If he continued to try to bite me in play or for attention he got crated for a few minutes--most of the time he ended up asleep because it finally settled him down enough that he was just over the top and really needed a nap.

But just as I never allowed puppies to play with children because until they were fully trained not to try to play with kids as if they were other puppies (and that's what it's really all about) I didn't let puppies play with most of my older dogs--the older male Dobes weren't nearly as tolerant as the Aussie was about being bitten by a puppy.

Puppies learn best from their dam's and their litter mates not to bite too hard--that's because their dam's will punish them for it (usually without killing the puppy) and litter mates will refuse to play with a puppy that is too rough.

The only way I've ever known to successfully stop this is to remove the puppy from the situation. Eventually they grow up and learn some things from you (like not biting too hard) or they get old enough to abandon some of this behavior that is all part of puppy behavior.

It's unfortunately all part of puppyhood --which is also all about learn what not to do as well as what to do. For the record--I also don't let my puppies play with other dogs on leash. I don't want them to grow up thinking every time they see another dog it's play time. My dogs pretty much all start out intended for the conformation ring and there is nothing more irritating at a big crowded dog show to have a puppy who is trying to engage in play with every dog it sees.

Good luck--it's frustrating for you but he's not going to 'get' what it is you don't want him to do the way you are trying to teach him. It just isn't how dogs brains work--dogs are the ultimate pragmatists--if they do something once and it's dangerous of very irritating they will keep trying to do it because they did it once and it was fun for them. You either need to make sure he doesn't get to do this kind of stuff at all or correct it as soon as it happens and don't let it happen again. Much easier in the long run than trying to fade a behavior that always gets a puppy in trouble later in their life.

Lotsa luck...

dobebug
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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 05:59 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyDi View Post
Congrats on your new puppy!
Just like our human children we have to teach them from the very beginning what is acceptable and what is not acceptable behavior.
IMO For any puppy of this age we must always be teaching proper behavior. In order to do this (when outside of pen or crate) my suggestion is to place puppy onto a 6 foot leash. The puppy should always be with you on this leash in order for you to witness proper behavior and well as negative behavior. By allowing yourself to be so close (within 6 feet) this give you the opportunity to notice proper behavior in the moment and reward that behavior or notice negative behavior and issue your displeasure in that behavior.
Puppies just like our human babies are so excited......everything is new ......and no litter mates now so picking on your older dog can be quite exciting also.
I purchase a nice 1 inch leather leash and a martingale collar .........and would tuck my end of the leash into my jeans pocket.
My Hoss as a puppy was basically at my hip always........now no worries they will learn to follow you.........and you will not have to do this forever .......but just know that teaching “yes” takes time BUT undoing negative behavior will take ALOT more time.
The only time puppy should have free run time in crate or pen...or outside separated from your older dog.
As puppy matures ........things will improve.
Also when training your dog NEVER let then win.....that reinforces the negative behavior......like when you crate and pup whines ....if you get tired from the whining ....and let pup out....POOF pup won! Turn crate into a fun place........try traditional Kong.....wet your dog food ...stuff the Kong with this food and freeze the Kong. When pup is placed in crate .....let pup settle for a few moments...(when not whining ) then give pup the frozen Kong. This will give all of you some moments of quiet.
I understand ....shoot when Hoss was a pup ...it was exhausting for me also. Like having a newborn baby in the house. Some days I was just so tired from interruptions in sleep I just wanted QUIET..........but as time went by .....things got better. Having pup at my hip allowed me to train in short spurts all the time.....so looking forward to more of your stories and pictures of this little smarty pants !!! LOL .......so hang in there .......and take control of that pup! LOL
As far as feeding time ......find a way to slow down that desire to attack the food dish. Pup wants as much as he can get......so there are toys that you can place kibble in that they roll around or mats ....to slow them down..........some use cup cake tins......
Be creative......and never let the puppy out smart you .....anticipate the pups behavior and overcome! After all we are Humans!!!
Now go take control of that pup!!!
Seriously ....would love to hear more from you ...this is a great forum with lots of experience......
Thank you for the suggestions. I will check out the martingale collar. I guess I'm afraid that keeping him on leash when he plays with my Boxer will cause them to get tangled up given how rough the play usually is. Should this not be a concern? Generally, though, I am within 6 feet when they are playing.

I think I should start using his crate for time-outs as you suggested, but how do I balance putting him in there for time-outs with not making him think its a bad place?

For feeding, I split his food between a slow-feeder bowl and a puzzle toy. More puzzle toys are on the way too, hopefully this stimulates him a bit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brw1982 View Post
I have some thoughts but I want to make sure I understand the situation fully before suggesting anything.

What's his daily routine since you brought him home? Just describe a typical day in the life of your puppy.
The first week there wasn't really a routine except for set feeding times. I feed him at 11:30 a.m., 3:30 p.m., and 6:00 p.m.

I take him outside pretty frequently throughout the day. Knock on wood, he has never had an accident in his crate, he hasn't really pooped in the house in a while, and he only pees in the house a few times a day, usually on a training pad. However, he can't hold it in, or doesn't know to yet. He only goes outside because I catch him before the act and carry him outside. Otherwise, he goes where he is standing.

I'm getting better at making him nap when he starts to get cranky, but I don't think I'm doing this at the same times every day. The only real schedule I'm strictly following is feeding. I try not to put him down for the night until 1 a.m., hoping that he'll make it until 7 a.m., but it's hit or miss. A few days ago he didn't get up until after 9:00 a.m. Yesterday he started whining at 2:30 a.m., I brought him outside, and I caved and let him sleep on my bed. He woke me up and I brought him out again at 5:00 a.m. Then playing/sleeping on and off. He usually sleeps about 1.5 hours for every hour of play.

The only time he is in his crate is when he is sleeping at night. I keep the crate next to my bed. During the day, I have a play-pen set up to keep him separated from my other dog. There is a blanket, toys, and a training pad inside. However, he doesn't like being in the play-pen unattended. If someone isn't in there with him, he'll whine and jump at the gate for what seems like an eternity. I've read everywhere to leave him until he stops doing it and then go over to him. But he never stops doing it. He spends a lot of time outside of the play-pen whether it be sitting on my lap or annoying my other dog.

I hope that paints a mostly complete picture. I'm sure I left some stuff out or made a few mistakes, but that's generally what his day is like.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dobebug View Post
I'm going to start at the back end of your puppy issues with one of the easier things. About the food and his reaction to it and trying to get your Boxer's food while she's eating it.

When you are going to feed the dog or dogs, crate the puppy or put him in the pen so he isn't diving into the food container or bugging the Boxer. It's not too early to teach an easy thing like a 'sit' and 'stay'. Make sure he's on leash and the Boxer is not around as a distraction. Take a few kibble and hold one close to his nose and raising it slowing until he sits--when he does this quickly give him the piece of kibble and say "GOOD SIT!" Be really happy about it. Repeat for four or five kibbles. Do this four or five times a day. Eventually he'll get this down pat and you can let him out of the crate or the pen and pick a place--have him sit and with him sitting give him his dish of food.

Don't keep repeating the commands and start out with the command AFTER he has already sat.

Do not feed him and your Boxer together. Feed him in his pen or crate and her where ever she normally eats but don't turn the puppy loose until she's finished eating and the pan is gone--ditto for the puppy.

You need to set this up so he always succeeds--every time he dives into the food bag or into the Boxer's food bowl he's won--and he won't quit trying until you make it impossible for him to do it wrong.

Doberman puppies are very rough--and he will not 'get' your no bite command and catching him and laying him down on his side will not stop him from mauling your Boxer. Bottom line is that most Dobe puppies aren't suited to play with adult dogs because they are so rough.

When my Aussie was alive he took a lot of mauling from the various Dobe puppies he helped raise. They would grab his mane and drag him around. Occasionally a puppy would bite him hard enough to make it through all the hair and the Aussie would bite them back--at that point I'd bring every one except the Dobe puppy inside and leave him outside alone (or with me) to cool his jets.

Or I'd do the opposite and bring the puppy in and I don't let puppies bite me--as soon as he bit me he went in the crate for a time out or I walked into another room and shut the door in his face and left him for a few minutes. If he continued to try to bite me in play or for attention he got crated for a few minutes--most of the time he ended up asleep because it finally settled him down enough that he was just over the top and really needed a nap.

But just as I never allowed puppies to play with children because until they were fully trained not to try to play with kids as if they were other puppies (and that's what it's really all about) I didn't let puppies play with most of my older dogs--the older male Dobes weren't nearly as tolerant as the Aussie was about being bitten by a puppy.

Puppies learn best from their dam's and their litter mates not to bite too hard--that's because their dam's will punish them for it (usually without killing the puppy) and litter mates will refuse to play with a puppy that is too rough.

The only way I've ever known to successfully stop this is to remove the puppy from the situation. Eventually they grow up and learn some things from you (like not biting too hard) or they get old enough to abandon some of this behavior that is all part of puppy behavior.

It's unfortunately all part of puppyhood --which is also all about learn what not to do as well as what to do. For the record--I also don't let my puppies play with other dogs on leash. I don't want them to grow up thinking every time they see another dog it's play time. My dogs pretty much all start out intended for the conformation ring and there is nothing more irritating at a big crowded dog show to have a puppy who is trying to engage in play with every dog it sees.

Good luck--it's frustrating for you but he's not going to 'get' what it is you don't want him to do the way you are trying to teach him. It just isn't how dogs brains work--dogs are the ultimate pragmatists--if they do something once and it's dangerous of very irritating they will keep trying to do it because they did it once and it was fun for them. You either need to make sure he doesn't get to do this kind of stuff at all or correct it as soon as it happens and don't let it happen again. Much easier in the long run than trying to fade a behavior that always gets a puppy in trouble later in their life.

Lotsa luck...

dobebug
Ever since he dove into the food container I began keeping him in the pen during feeding time. The moment he hears the food container he goes berserk in the play-pen, barking and jumping at the gate trying to get out. If someone is around, I'll have them take him out while I prepare the food. On one occasion he heard the food container being opened as he was going outside, and as soon as he came back in he ran straight for my other dog's food bowl (he was on-leash and didn't get to the bowl).

He is actually pretty good with "Sit," "Stay," and "Okay" when his food is in front of him (his bowls are inside of his play-pen, separate from my other dog). He's learned very quickly, and we are working on it every day (the one good thing about his food fixation is that he is easily motivated). But this only works when the food is in front of him. Otherwise, he is fixated and going crazy at the sound of the food.

And thank you for your other suggestions. I tried the remove him from the situation technique with his biting but didn't really think I was getting anywhere so I abandoned it and went back to what worked for my other dog. But I'll give it another go and keep at it. Crazy me for hoping the pups would get along perfectly from day 1 lol!

Thanks for everyone's suggestions!!
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesuitcase View Post
The first week there wasn't really a routine except for set feeding times. I feed him at 11:30 a.m., 3:30 p.m., and 6:00 p.m.
That feeding schedule probably isn't the best for a young puppy. That stretch between the evening feeding and his breakfast is too long in my opinion and it might contribute to what you are calling his food fixation. He's waiting almost 18 hours between his last meal and his breakfast. Generally I try to keep the intervals between meals pretty even--like 6:00am, 12:00noon and 6:00pm. And I don't try to keep puppies from eating fast--I don't use slow feed bowls or puzzle toys--I really don't want to make young puppies have to work for their food nor slow their eating speed down. In wild canids eating fast is a survival trait and pups that eat fast survive--slow pokes often don't

Quote:
I take him outside pretty frequently throughout the day. Knock on wood, he has never had an accident in his crate, he hasn't really pooped in the house in a while, and he only pees in the house a few times a day, usually on a training pad. However, he can't hold it in, or doesn't know to yet. He only goes outside because I catch him before the act and carry him outside. Otherwise, he goes where he is standing.
As far as house training goes--for pups his age I'd take him out the minute he wakes up, feed him then (a lot earlier you are feeding him) and take him out again after his breakfast. I'd be taking him out after every time he plays hard, after every nap and before and after every meal. My puppies will at 10 weeks sleep through an 8 hour night and usually play for a little while after every meal and then nap for a couple of hours. Some puppies need to go out every 20 minutes at 10 weeks. Some can manage 2 hours. They are all different but I really think you are shooting yourself in the foot by using pee pads--the message you really want to get across is not that he should use the pee pad if you didn't take him out but that he should never ever pee in the house. Trust me when I tell you that a Doberman puppy in another four to 6 weeks will pee enough that it looks like a lake and pee pads don't contain it.
But it worth remembering that every puppy is different and some get it faster than others.


Quote:
I'm getting better at making him nap when he starts to get cranky, but I don't think I'm doing this at the same times every day. The only real schedule I'm strictly following is feeding. I try not to put him down for the night until 1 a.m., hoping that he'll make it until 7 a.m., but it's hit or miss. A few days ago he didn't get up until after 9:00 a.m. Yesterday he started whining at 2:30 a.m., I brought him outside, and I caved and let him sleep on my bed. He woke me up and I brought him out again at 5:00 a.m. Then playing/sleeping on and off. He usually sleeps about 1.5 hours for every hour of play.
Well, if you don't intent for him to sleep on your bed as an adult and this was the point that Lady Di was making--every time you "cave" like letting him sleep on the bed because you didn't want to have to get up again with him or listen to him fuss in the crate just sets you back for being able to put him to bed in his crate and expect him to stay there and sleep. My puppies go out a last time at around `10:00pm but I get up at 6:00am and take them out and feed them, take them out again and then get on with what ever my routine is--at one time I was working a late shift and once the puppy got up at 6 and got fed and pottied before and after the food he went back into his crate for a nap and I went back to bed until around 10:00am. But if you figure out a schedule and stick to it it's easier to get the puppy to stick to a schedule.

Quote:
The only time he is in his crate is when he is sleeping at night. I keep the crate next to my bed. During the day, I have a play-pen set up to keep him separated from my other dog. There is a blanket, toys, and a training pad inside. However, he doesn't like being in the play-pen unattended. If someone isn't in there with him, he'll whine and jump at the gate for what seems like an eternity. I've read everywhere to leave him until he stops doing it and then go over to him. But he never stops doing it. He spends a lot of time outside of the play-pen whether it be sitting on my lap or annoying my other dog.

I hope that paints a mostly complete picture. I'm sure I left some stuff out or made a few mistakes, but that's generally what his day is like.
I would probably be using a second crate that could be set up where you spend your time--the play pen doesn't sound like it's working well for him.

I would not let him play with your Boxer--I would not keep him on leash--I don't want my dogs to think they will get to play with other dog when on leash. I'd only let him play with the Boxer when you are there to stop the play immediately when he gets too rough. Crate him--for a few minutes--then put him in the pen but don't let him go back to mauling your Boxer.


Quote:
Ever since he dove into the food container I began keeping him in the pen during feeding time. The moment he hears the food container he goes berserk in the play-pen, barking and jumping at the gate trying to get out. If someone is around, I'll have them take him out while I prepare the food. On one occasion he heard the food container being opened as he was going outside, and as soon as he came back in he ran straight for my other dog's food bowl (he was on-leash and didn't get to the bowl).

He is actually pretty good with "Sit," "Stay," and "Okay" when his food is in front of him (his bowls are inside of his play-pen, separate from my other dog). He's learned very quickly, and we are working on it every day (the one good thing about his food fixation is that he is easily motivated). But this only works when the food is in front of him. Otherwise, he is fixated and going crazy at the sound of the food.

And thank you for your other suggestions. I tried the remove him from the situation technique with his biting but didn't really think I was getting anywhere so I abandoned it and went back to what worked for my other dog. But I'll give it another go and keep at it. Crazy me for hoping the pups would get along perfectly from day 1 lol!

Thanks for everyone's suggestions!!
Crate him while you are preparing food for him and the Boxer instead of putting him the pen. Bring him out and put him in the pen only when his food is ready--cut down on his opportunities to get wild about waiting for the food.

I'm stopping here because DT decided to send this and before it's either erases everything or sends it again I'd like you to see what I've said herel

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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 09:00 PM
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The first week there wasn't really a routine except for set feeding times. I feed him at 11:30 a.m., 3:30 p.m., and 6:00 p.m.

I take him outside pretty frequently throughout the day. Knock on wood, he has never had an accident in his crate, he hasn't really pooped in the house in a while, and he only pees in the house a few times a day, usually on a training pad. However, he can't hold it in, or doesn't know to yet. He only goes outside because I catch him before the act and carry him outside. Otherwise, he goes where he is standing.

I'm getting better at making him nap when he starts to get cranky, but I don't think I'm doing this at the same times every day. The only real schedule I'm strictly following is feeding. I try not to put him down for the night until 1 a.m., hoping that he'll make it until 7 a.m., but it's hit or miss. A few days ago he didn't get up until after 9:00 a.m. Yesterday he started whining at 2:30 a.m., I brought him outside, and I caved and let him sleep on my bed. He woke me up and I brought him out again at 5:00 a.m. Then playing/sleeping on and off. He usually sleeps about 1.5 hours for every hour of play.

The only time he is in his crate is when he is sleeping at night. I keep the crate next to my bed. During the day, I have a play-pen set up to keep him separated from my other dog. There is a blanket, toys, and a training pad inside. However, he doesn't like being in the play-pen unattended. If someone isn't in there with him, he'll whine and jump at the gate for what seems like an eternity. I've read everywhere to leave him until he stops doing it and then go over to him. But he never stops doing it. He spends a lot of time outside of the play-pen whether it be sitting on my lap or annoying my other dog.

I hope that paints a mostly complete picture. I'm sure I left some stuff out or made a few mistakes, but that's generally what his day is like.

Thanks for providing a rundown of his daily life!

So, I'll just make my own life easier and say that I totally agree with dobebug! On the feeding schedule, the house/potty training, using a second crate, and only allowing supervised play with your Boxer (and off-lead) - all of it.



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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2020, 09:37 PM Thread Starter
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That feeding schedule probably isn't the best for a young puppy. That stretch between the evening feeding and his breakfast is too long in my opinion and it might contribute to what you are calling his food fixation. He's waiting almost 18 hours between his last meal and his breakfast. Generally I try to keep the intervals between meals pretty even--like 6:00am, 12:00noon and 6:00pm. And I don't try to keep puppies from eating fast--I don't use slow feed bowls or puzzle toys--I really don't want to make young puppies have to work for their food nor slow their eating speed down. In wild canids eating fast is a survival trait and pups that eat fast survive--slow pokes often don't



As far as house training goes--for pups his age I'd take him out the minute he wakes up, feed him then (a lot earlier you are feeding him) and take him out again after his breakfast. I'd be taking him out after every time he plays hard, after every nap and before and after every meal. My puppies will at 10 weeks sleep through an 8 hour night and usually play for a little while after every meal and then nap for a couple of hours. Some puppies need to go out every 20 minutes at 10 weeks. Some can manage 2 hours. They are all different but I really think you are shooting yourself in the foot by using pee pads--the message you really want to get across is not that he should use the pee pad if you didn't take him out but that he should never ever pee in the house. Trust me when I tell you that a Doberman puppy in another four to 6 weeks will pee enough that it looks like a lake and pee pads don't contain it.
But it worth remembering that every puppy is different and some get it faster than others.




Well, if you don't intent for him to sleep on your bed as an adult and this was the point that Lady Di was making--every time you "cave" like letting him sleep on the bed because you didn't want to have to get up again with him or listen to him fuss in the crate just sets you back for being able to put him to bed in his crate and expect him to stay there and sleep. My puppies go out a last time at around `10:00pm but I get up at 6:00am and take them out and feed them, take them out again and then get on with what ever my routine is--at one time I was working a late shift and once the puppy got up at 6 and got fed and pottied before and after the food he went back into his crate for a nap and I went back to bed until around 10:00am. But if you figure out a schedule and stick to it it's easier to get the puppy to stick to a schedule.



I would probably be using a second crate that could be set up where you spend your time--the play pen doesn't sound like it's working well for him.

I would not let him play with your Boxer--I would not keep him on leash--I don't want my dogs to think they will get to play with other dog when on leash. I'd only let him play with the Boxer when you are there to stop the play immediately when he gets too rough. Crate him--for a few minutes--then put him in the pen but don't let him go back to mauling your Boxer.




Crate him while you are preparing food for him and the Boxer instead of putting him the pen. Bring him out and put him in the pen only when his food is ready--cut down on his opportunities to get wild about waiting for the food.

I'm stopping here because DT decided to send this and before it's either erases everything or sends it again I'd like you to see what I've said herel

dobebug
Thanks so much for all the information! I will adjust his feeding schedule accordingly. My reason behind using the puzzle toy during feeding time was to get his brain working without the need to give him treats or extra food outside of feeding time, but I get what you're saying. Would you recommend that I keep puzzle toys completely separate from feeding time?

I've been trying to remove the training pads altogether but my family doesn't agree because I can't be there to watch him all the time. Others in my household aren't great at taking him out as frequently as I do (I take him out more often than necessary; he doesn't go every time I take him out). As a result, he's had a few accidents on the carpet under the supervision of others. Additionally, at this point, he only uses the training pad about 50% of the time when he does go inside. The other 50% is randomly where ever he is standing when he has to go.

I have a second crate that I can set up, but I'll probably set it up in the play-pen. Perhaps I'm just not thinking here, but I don't know how I could keep the two dogs separated without the play-pen. The play-pen allows me to keep them separated without confining the pup to a crate. Were you suggesting that I keep the play-pen but put a crate in it, or that I get rid of the play-pen and use only a crate?

Thanks again for your suggestions. I have a lot of work to do!

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Originally Posted by brw1982 View Post
Thanks for providing a rundown of his daily life!

So, I'll just make my own life easier and say that I totally agree with dobebug! On the feeding schedule, the house/potty training, using a second crate, and only allowing supervised play with your Boxer (and off-lead) - all of it.
Thank you!
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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-12-2020, 09:49 AM
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I'm just going to say if you want to be successful with potty training, you REALLY need to get everyone on board with supervision and a schedule. You're going to have a LOT of problems trying to train a puppy if you have people letting him out to wander around unsupervised.


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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-12-2020, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by bluesuitcase View Post

I've been trying to remove the training pads altogether but my family doesn't agree because I can't be there to watch him all the time. Others in my household aren't great at taking him out as frequently as I do (I take him out more often than necessary; he doesn't go every time I take him out). As a result, he's had a few accidents on the carpet under the supervision of others.
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I'm just going to say if you want to be successful with potty training, you REALLY need to get everyone on board with supervision and a schedule. You're going to have a LOT of problems trying to train a puppy if you have people letting him out to wander around unsupervised.
I interpreted the above as that OP's family doesn't watch the pup as closely as he does, so they don't see the warning signs and take the puppy out when he needs to go, which means they would rather have a pee pad inside than deal with cleaning up the mess??

But I guess I'll say this just in case the story is more like MC's version--when you're potty training a puppy, you should take him out on a leash so you can make sure he has actually gone, and so you can praise him when he produces. Make his potty time separate from playtime too--no playing until business is done.

If he doesn't go when you go out and you're pretty sure he really needs to, you can put him in his crate for 5 or 10 minutes and then try again. He's unlikely to pee in the crate if it is only big enough for him to sleep in with no extra space for him to squat, because pups tend not to want to go on their beds. The rule is still no playtime outside until his business is taken care of.
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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-12-2020, 04:34 PM
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Thanks so much for all the information! I will adjust his feeding schedule accordingly. My reason behind using the puzzle toy during feeding time was to get his brain working without the need to give him treats or extra food outside of feeding time, but I get what you're saying. Would you recommend that I keep puzzle toys completely separate from feeding time?
Rather than at 10 weeks making him work for his food via solving the puzzle, I would measure out how much food he gets a day in the three meals. Then I'd measure out some of it which will be used for treats, training, etc--set that amount aside. Divide the remainder into three equal amounts and that will be for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Then you can give him the puzzle toy with some of the extra food sometime other that at a meal. The appetites of young puppies is generally good enough that he'll still be interested in the food but it should give him the idea that you aren't going to starve him at his meals and he can get extras other times as well.

Quote:
I've been trying to remove the training pads altogether but my family doesn't agree because I can't be there to watch him all the time. Others in my household aren't great at taking him out as frequently as I do (I take him out more often than necessary; he doesn't go every time I take him out). As a result, he's had a few accidents on the carpet under the supervision of others. Additionally, at this point, he only uses the training pad about 50% of the time when he does go inside. The other 50% is randomly where ever he is standing when he has to go.
Your family needs a training pad--a reminder that it will take a whole lot longer to teach the puppy proper bathroom habits if they don't buy into the routine and make sure the puppy is take out on a schedule and/or is never allowed on the carpet to have "accidents" when you aren't there to take him out and they aren't bothering to watch it. Those REALLY are not the puppy's accidents--they are the failure on the part of the person who is supposed to be watching the puppy.

Quote:
I have a second crate that I can set up, but I'll probably set it up in the play-pen. Perhaps I'm just not thinking here, but I don't know how I could keep the two dogs separated without the play-pen. The play-pen allows me to keep them separated without confining the pup to a crate. Were you suggesting that I keep the play-pen but put a crate in it, or that I get rid of the play-pen and use only a crate?
You can set the crate up in the play pen--but my suggestions was specifically to crate the puppy (and I wouldn't do it in the crate in your bedroom where he spends his nights) so that he doesn't pull his wild hare act in the play pen while waiting for food (impatiently) and throwing a hissy fit because the
Boxer isn't in the pen with him.

And I definitely wouldn't use that arrangement to keep him crated a lot. I don't use a play pen in this house because the arrangement of the kitchen and "dining room" is set up so that I can keep a crate in the kitchen very close to the slider that goes into the back yard. The space between the "dining room" and the living room has a sliding gate that separates the two areas. When I'm in the kitchen there is almost always someone in the crate with the door open--just as often a cat as a dog. It's a wire crate and if I put a puppy in it while I'm doing stuff in the kitchen like cooking--and I put him in the crate he can still see what is going on and isn't so inclined to get all excited and rowdy because he can see everything that is going on.

So whatever works for you and the puppy. That's what I'd do and have done over a lot of years. It's a system that seem to go a long toward teaching wound up puppies to quiet down and they'll still get attention and be involved on what's going on.

And I'll add--I'd REALLY curtail his involvement with your Boxer--what is going on is very much like what goes on when people get two puppies of much the same age at the same time and the puppies then end up more bonded to each other than the owners.

Quote:
Thanks again for your suggestions. I have a lot of work to do!
Yeah, well there is no doubt that puppies are a lot of work--it's like having another kid in the house--toddler age--into everything and don't know the rules. But at least it doesn't take 18 years to civilize a puppy.

I'm going to throw in one more thing (since I seem to be on a roll) About feeding again. There will come a time--and sooner than you might expect where the puppy with start not eating one of the meals--or maybe only eating part of all the meals--and occasionally eating all of everything and getting so roly poly that your vet says--that puppy is too fat--don't feed so much.

Generally sometime between 4 and 6 months the puppy starts to leave food at the middle meal. Usually that one because it's the one with the shortest time span for him to get hungry. At that point I eliminate the middle meal and simply divide the total of food for the day into two parts and start feeding only two meals a day--adjusting the amount the puppy gets as he grows. And that's about when I start feeding adult food too if the puppy has been eating puppy food or large breed puppy food. Just one more thing to keep in mind.

The lawns call me--I'm tired of them but they aren't going to get better without mowing and I haven't had any volunteers--but I'll take Joey, my borrowed puppy out to help--he thinks he's helping anyway.

Happy Easter to you and the puppy...

dobebug
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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-12-2020, 08:14 PM Thread Starter
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I'm just going to say if you want to be successful with potty training, you REALLY need to get everyone on board with supervision and a schedule. You're going to have a LOT of problems trying to train a puppy if you have people letting him out to wander around unsupervised.
Understood, I will try to get them fully on board. Thanks!

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I interpreted the above as that OP's family doesn't watch the pup as closely as he does, so they don't see the warning signs and take the puppy out when he needs to go, which means they would rather have a pee pad inside than deal with cleaning up the mess??

But I guess I'll say this just in case the story is more like MC's version--when you're potty training a puppy, you should take him out on a leash so you can make sure he has actually gone, and so you can praise him when he produces. Make his potty time separate from playtime too--no playing until business is done.

If he doesn't go when you go out and you're pretty sure he really needs to, you can put him in his crate for 5 or 10 minutes and then try again. He's unlikely to pee in the crate if it is only big enough for him to sleep in with no extra space for him to squat, because pups tend not to want to go on their beds. The rule is still no playtime outside until his business is taken care of.
You're spot on. Today was a pretty good day. He only went in the house once today so far. I began using the crate a lot more and closing the door. There were only a few times where we went outside and he didn't go. Thanks for the suggestions!

Quote:
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Rather than at 10 weeks making him work for his food via solving the puzzle, I would measure out how much food he gets a day in the three meals. Then I'd measure out some of it which will be used for treats, training, etc--set that amount aside. Divide the remainder into three equal amounts and that will be for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Then you can give him the puzzle toy with some of the extra food sometime other that at a meal. The appetites of young puppies is generally good enough that he'll still be interested in the food but it should give him the idea that you aren't going to starve him at his meals and he can get extras other times as well.



Your family needs a training pad--a reminder that it will take a whole lot longer to teach the puppy proper bathroom habits if they don't buy into the routine and make sure the puppy is take out on a schedule and/or is never allowed on the carpet to have "accidents" when you aren't there to take him out and they aren't bothering to watch it. Those REALLY are not the puppy's accidents--they are the failure on the part of the person who is supposed to be watching the puppy.



You can set the crate up in the play pen--but my suggestions was specifically to crate the puppy (and I wouldn't do it in the crate in your bedroom where he spends his nights) so that he doesn't pull his wild hare act in the play pen while waiting for food (impatiently) and throwing a hissy fit because the
Boxer isn't in the pen with him.

And I definitely wouldn't use that arrangement to keep him crated a lot. I don't use a play pen in this house because the arrangement of the kitchen and "dining room" is set up so that I can keep a crate in the kitchen very close to the slider that goes into the back yard. The space between the "dining room" and the living room has a sliding gate that separates the two areas. When I'm in the kitchen there is almost always someone in the crate with the door open--just as often a cat as a dog. It's a wire crate and if I put a puppy in it while I'm doing stuff in the kitchen like cooking--and I put him in the crate he can still see what is going on and isn't so inclined to get all excited and rowdy because he can see everything that is going on.

So whatever works for you and the puppy. That's what I'd do and have done over a lot of years. It's a system that seem to go a long toward teaching wound up puppies to quiet down and they'll still get attention and be involved on what's going on.

And I'll add--I'd REALLY curtail his involvement with your Boxer--what is going on is very much like what goes on when people get two puppies of much the same age at the same time and the puppies then end up more bonded to each other than the owners.



Yeah, well there is no doubt that puppies are a lot of work--it's like having another kid in the house--toddler age--into everything and don't know the rules. But at least it doesn't take 18 years to civilize a puppy.

I'm going to throw in one more thing (since I seem to be on a roll) About feeding again. There will come a time--and sooner than you might expect where the puppy with start not eating one of the meals--or maybe only eating part of all the meals--and occasionally eating all of everything and getting so roly poly that your vet says--that puppy is too fat--don't feed so much.

Generally sometime between 4 and 6 months the puppy starts to leave food at the middle meal. Usually that one because it's the one with the shortest time span for him to get hungry. At that point I eliminate the middle meal and simply divide the total of food for the day into two parts and start feeding only two meals a day--adjusting the amount the puppy gets as he grows. And that's about when I start feeding adult food too if the puppy has been eating puppy food or large breed puppy food. Just one more thing to keep in mind.

The lawns call me--I'm tired of them but they aren't going to get better without mowing and I haven't had any volunteers--but I'll take Joey, my borrowed puppy out to help--he thinks he's helping anyway.

Happy Easter to you and the puppy...

dobebug
I started with the second crate in the living room today, and it was a huge help. He caught on pretty quickly that biting gets him sent to the crate, and it's also reduced the number of times he went in the house. I find it odd that he goes in willingly even for punishment, but if it works it works. He falls asleep half the time. I also used it when feeding my other dog and his temper tantrum wasn't nearly as bad as it was before. Thank you for all of your suggestions and happy Easter to you and yours too!!
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-12-2020, 10:00 PM
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Glad things are improving!

Lots of times when they are getting super bitey or "throwing tantrum" and you put them in their crate and they fall asleep like that they were actually just overtired and wound up, kind of like toddlers, and really just needed a nap!

Keep up the good work!
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-13-2020, 01:24 PM
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Understood, I will try to get them fully on board. Thanks!



You're spot on. Today was a pretty good day. He only went in the house once today so far. I began using the crate a lot more and closing the door. There were only a few times where we went outside and he didn't go. Thanks for the suggestions!



I started with the second crate in the living room today, and it was a huge help. He caught on pretty quickly that biting gets him sent to the crate, and it's also reduced the number of times he went in the house. I find it odd that he goes in willingly even for punishment, but if it works it works. He falls asleep half the time. I also used it when feeding my other dog and his temper tantrum wasn't nearly as bad as it was before. Thank you for all of your suggestions and happy Easter to you and yours too!!
I'm so glad the suggestions were helpful. I've been using crates to teach a variety of things (mostly about settling down when a puppy is just WILD! And it's often the case they just don't know how to settle on their own--it's much harder to be wild and continue to be wild in a crate.

I found, over time, that puppies who were even partly crate trained (crated at night for instance) never really seemed to see the crate as punishment. I practically always would toss at least a single piece of kibble into the crate when I was going to put a puppy in it--that seemed to help a lot.

A belated Happy Easter to you and your baby dog--he'll grow up so fast you won't believe it and Dobes are quick to figure things out if you are consistent. and I have had an occasional dog go into a full fledged sulk (although they are rarely vindictive--it's not how their brains work) but I have had dogs who sulked if they though I wasn't being fair in my requirements. I ignore that kind of thing--it blows over pretty fast.

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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-28-2020, 11:39 PM Thread Starter
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I am reporting back with an update:



For over a week, the puppy biting subsided. Perhaps the immediate time-out after biting worked. However, the biting has returned in the past few days, and it seems worse than it was before, especially with respect to him biting my older dog. My older dog rarely reacts to the biting; she's yelped twice that I know of—he bit her feet both times. She doesn't react to any other bites. I will continue to enforce time-outs for this behavior in the hopes that it subsides again. If it doesn't subside, should I keep them separated until the biting phase ends?

The food-fixation is also slowly decreasing. I still have to be firm with him, but he doesn't dive head-first into the food-container anymore, and he is becoming a little more patient when my other dog eats.

On an unrelated note, we decided to give my older dog a high-value treat recently (kong filled with peanut butter). The puppy kept trying to get at it and got in her face a little bit. She was up on the couch and he was on the floor, but he was able to get to the toy. (In hindsight, I realize the puppy shouldn't have been around for this). My older dog showed some patience at first, but three or four times she has sort of frozen, lifted her lips to show her bottom teeth (boxer underbite), and then snapped at him. He's a bit relentless and didn't catch on. It never escalated beyond that, and I removed him once I thought she got the point across. Some sources I've come across say to let this happen. Should I let this happen? Should he be catching on by now?

Thanks again for all the suggestions!
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post #16 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-29-2020, 02:59 PM
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Unfortunately many bitches seem to get their motherly instincts aroused with a puppy (even though it isn't theirs). A bitch who is a good mother will, when a puppy is playing and hurts her will generally effectively teach a puppy to not do whatever it was by rising up as a deadly menace. Roaring at the puppy, often tumbling it end over end and sometimes pinning it down and then walking off and leaving it to contemplate it's sins.

I've been around enough breeders, their bitches with and without puppies to tell you that in general they don't usually let another dog (not the puppies mother) discipline a puppy. The mothers can usually stop behaviors like your puppy is inflicting on the Boxer without going overboard and killing or maiming them.

I'd be a lot more careful about letting the puppy pester the Boxer--which probably means a lot less contact between the two. And when it comes to high value treats or toys--I had one Dobe who was, other than a new bone, not particularly aggressive about anything--but for the first week there was a a new bone in the house he got it but only in his crate. After that the bone became just another bone and no one was playing the "MINE" game.

So you probably just need to think ahead about giving either dog something of high value and starting an argument about it.

As far as biting goes--there is no substitute for long term appropriate treatment for it--my success in having puppies that don't bite me EVER after about the first two weeks with me is because I start the walk away and shut a door in the puppies face the first time they bite and into the crate for a short period of time (unless they fall asleep--which is often what happens) and I do it every time. To a large extent for the biting the thing that stops it is consistency on your part. Neither the walk away and deprive the puppy of your presence nor the crate and ignore are "punishments" in the sense of the business of throwing the puppy to the floor and/or holding it's mouth shut--but rather in the sense of depriving something they want (your presence) or want to do (play with you as if you were another puppy). So stick with it--as long as it keeps on not working for the puppy the sooner they'll stop doing it.

I would really continue to keep interaction between the Boxer and the puppy at a minimum with maximum oversight. At best this would probably be until your puppy has finished teething (puppies with all of their adult teeth in seem to be somewhat less bitey than puppies who haven't started teething or are in the middle of teething. The puppy (dispite how fast they grow and how quickly he'll get to the size of the Boxer) at this point he's only what? 12 weeks. Puppies need some lessons repeated over and over again--(ask me how many times I've said to my loaner puppy Joey--"LEAVE THE CAT ALONE") He's getting it but it's a long process for a puppy who came to keep me company after I lost my old Doberman and was 6 months and had never been in a house with a cat. The cats were appalled because they had both been raised with Dobermans who knew that cats ruled and Dobermans had to behave by cat rules.

Puppies are pills--and anything they thought was fun and they did even once they'll try to do again. "NO" still doesn't mean much to them at this stage so the best thing you can do for your sanity and the puppies safety is to prevent situations that will get him in trouble either with another dog or you. And if he still does the things that get him in trouble you'll just have to work at keeping him out of the situations that end up with you saying the not very effecting "no" and keeping him from doing things to the Boxer that will eventually cause her to be less rather than more patient.

Good luck--sometimes it's just a long hard road.

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post #17 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-29-2020, 03:11 PM
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I really can't say much more than Bug said.

They key is 100% consistency. Those smart little buggers will continue to do things if they get reinforced even one time out of 20. Or less!

As far as the super good treat and the raised lip goes...in my house, dogs don't get "high value" things except in their crates, alone. Anything that produces "guarding" behavior just isn't out for them to guard. I had one dog who was a serious resource guarder, and I just don't set my dogs up to have that behavior. Stuffed Kongs, raw bones, bully sticks - anything like that has to be alone in the crate until they are gone. I know not everyone does it like that, but that's how it goes in my house. No one needs to worry about stealing or protecting.
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Richter & Sypha
Glengate's Mountain Fortress CAA ORT L1E L1C NW2 L2V L2I ACT1 RATI SOG WAC
& Sirai's Golden Masquerade ORT L1V L1E L2C L2I NW2 RATI SOG TKN WAC
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post #18 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-29-2020, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
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I really can't say much more than Bug said.

They key is 100% consistency. Those smart little buggers will continue to do things if they get reinforced even one time out of 20. Or less!

As far as the super good treat and the raised lip goes...in my house, dogs don't get "high value" things except in their crates, alone. Anything that produces "guarding" behavior just isn't out for them to guard. I had one dog who was a serious resource guarder, and I just don't set my dogs up to have that behavior. Stuffed Kongs, raw bones, bully sticks - anything like that has to be alone in the crate until they are gone. I know not everyone does it like that, but that's how it goes in my house. No one needs to worry about stealing or protecting.

Ditto this in my house.

A lot of successfully managing multiple dogs comes down to removing opportunities for competition.
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