Posts Out for Several Hours? - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums
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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-02-2020, 06:01 PM Thread Starter
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Posts Out for Several Hours?

Hey all,

Today I left the house for three hours to visit a friend. When I came back, my puppy’s posts were out. Both posts, all tape, everything out. They had been looking a bit loose when I left, but now they’re out. I reposted as soon as I got home and saw, but her ears were hanging down. Is this going to undo any progress I’ve made? I’m a first-time Doberman owner and have never posted ears before. This has been such a process, and I can’t help but think I’m failing. Her ears were finally starting to be straight when I’d take the posts out, but they didn’t look particularly strong and they weren’t standing up.

Here’s a photo: https://www.flickr.com/photos/188431...in/dateposted/

9E1F9A57-B3FD-4422-B9D6-BC228BCAE380 by Ashley Vasko, on Flickr

Norah is just shy of 6 months old. Is there any hope for these ears to stand? All advice is appreciated.

Thank you!
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Last edited by MeadowCat; 07-03-2020 at 09:09 AM.
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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-02-2020, 06:42 PM
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Just keep posting!
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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-02-2020, 08:21 PM
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What method are you using to post her? We like this one:

https://www.dobermantalk.com/ear-cro...acker-rod.html

Could you put up pictures of her head, from the side and the front, of her when she is posted and holding her ears up? If there is anything you aren't getting quite right, we might be able to give you a few tips.

But generally, just the fact that she's been out of posts for a few hours won't matter in terms of the way her ears stand eventually; just keep posting.

And just as an aside--did you find all of the tape and posts that HAD been in her ears? I'd want to make sure she hadn't eaten some of it...Some pups have depraved appetites.
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-02-2020, 10:58 PM
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Hi Advasko

3 hours (or less) down as a one time event? I wouldn't be a bit concerned assuming that you are posting correctly and effectively.

So... Check out the method that Melbrod suggested. If you have any more questions, please comeback on and ask them.

Better yet, come back just to say Hi and give us an update.

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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 12:54 AM
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It looks like the posting is OK--was someone else posting them for the pictures of the posts with just the three wraps of tape (bottom, middle and top? And are you now taping all the way from bottom to top--actually it kind of looked like multiple layers of tape but you can only tell so much from pictures.

If you are going to use a brace--it should be right at the top of the head--raised like that does a couple of not so good things--it makes it easy for a puppy to catch the brace and ears on things--and you don't even want to hear the kind of screaming that goes on if that happens. I only used a brace for the first few postings. And the other reason is that often the brace will end up too tight and pull the ears together which is a great way to end up with pockets.

The three hours unposted doesn't make a lot of difference in the greater scheme of things--and the majority of puppies are posted longer than until they are six months--just keep posting.

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Last edited by dobebug; 07-03-2020 at 12:56 AM.
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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 06:34 AM
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/188431...n/photostream/

To me -- The base of the ear appears to be taped forward - Not to the back ? Or is it my old eye's
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 09:16 AM
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I embedded the first photo for you so it's easier for people to see - you can easily do that with Flickr

First, it's NO problem for the ears to be down a few hours.

Is this how you are posting her?

C32F1387-3CDF-449D-902E-DCDA7018E7CD by Ashley Vasko, on Flickr

I want to make sure that you are actually folding the "flap" at the front of her ear on the inside back towards her head, not in, all along the post...at the base of her ear, it looks like her ear is curled in towards the post? The natural flap of the ear should be allowed to turn "backwards" if that makes sense. It will look strange if you try to turn it in. The very lowest part of the tape it looks as if the ear is turned in, instead of out. This is exactly what ECIN is saying in the post above me.

Otherwise, the taping in that photo doesn't look too bad. Make sure the tape isn't too tight. I would probably make the bridge lower, and a bit less tight. This taping looks better than the picture with her ears fully covered in tape.
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 12:07 PM
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I think this is a better photo - https://www.flickr.com/photos/188431...4/49917147917/

It really does to appear they are taped in and not back .
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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 01:46 PM
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You could also make an additional improvement in the way her ears are taped. Fold back that little part mentioned above, and also make sure the forward edge of the ear goes more or less straight up the post, not twisted backwards along it the way the far ear in the pic appears to be. Of course, in that picture, she's got her ears relaxed and tipped backwards too, so it might be misleading in terms of what your posting job actually looks like.

Last edited by melbrod; 07-03-2020 at 01:49 PM.
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 10:05 PM Thread Starter
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Hey all! Thank you for the responses and advice! Those photos of the posting are old photos. I haven’t posted her that way for a while (I can’t say how long... I’m losing track of time). I am now being absolutely certain to make that the natural fold is going back instead of in. I have been covering the whole ear with tape, except for one of her ears at the moment which has a cut at the top, so I haven’t been covering the tip of that ear. I do feel that when I’m taping, her ear sort of wants to “twist” around the post instead of being straight. I’ll attach some photos of how she’s currently posted this evening. Thanks again!
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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 10:10 PM Thread Starter
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Also, I’ve been still putting the brace on, but I have been doing it at the base of her head. When I don’t use the brace it appears that, when relaxed, her ears are falling straight to the sides, Yoda style. So I figured that maybe she still needed help getting them to stand?
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-03-2020, 11:49 PM Thread Starter
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 07:34 AM
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Ad - you don't need to take the posts so high - top of the ear is just fine .
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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 08:01 AM
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Oh I do not know how to word it....hopefully some one will mention that technique of pushing the post inward..... while pulling upward on the ear ....to get to that perfect position....before you put any pressure to the post itself.
That is a true art IMO.

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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 09:06 AM
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Okay, a couple of comments on the current posting...

First, you don't really want/need to cover the WHOLE ear with tape. What you want is a piece at the very base of the ear, to hold it in place. A piece at the middle, and then you need a piece at the top. In your pictures, your top piece of tape isn't covering the tips of her ears, so you may end up with ear tips that curl backwards. You want the ear tips to be held to the post, which is why you cover the tips fully with tape. Your posts should be just a touch longer than the ear itself. They need to be longer than the ear, but not excessively longer.

The choice to brace or not brace is really up to you. If you're going to use one, I would probably make it a little looser than in your photos. The ears actually should sit a "10 and 2" - the puppy learns to use their muscles to hold them more erect. If they are TOO tight with a bridge they will actually tip inwards when the dog is alert, which you don't want. When a Doberman is relaxed, their ears are actually in "airplane" position, typically, their ears are not straight up all the time.

The ear is going to sit on the post in the natural position that the crop is shaped. You can't "force" it into another position. The best way to get the ear onto the post is to make sure you are backtaping the post with tape, get the post firmly into the ear, and then simply tape with a few pieces of tape.

For reference, here is a photo of Sypha with her ears taped as a puppy - one piece low on the ear, one in the middle, one at the top:

DSC_0002 by Shanoa Delta, on Flickr

Adult with finished ears:

DSC_0112 by Shanoa Delta, on Flickr
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DSC_0133
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post #16 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 10:03 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks all! I mentioned in a previous post that the reason the tip of her ear is not taped is because it has a cut on it. I do make fairly long posts, but I’m really bad at determining size. I have measured them out and then while posting they were too short? So now they’re on the long side. But I’ll work on that.
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post #17 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 10:22 AM
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Ad - it just takes time to get the length right - when I do the first ones when they get here - I may cut several and do a practice fit - to me that helps . I used the brace on Kadin and this also took time - but I cut a piece of backer rod then wrapped it with tape - then tied it in with the across piece of tape you are using - to me - it added strength and helped hold the ears into the position you want - Like what Meadowcat said , I did have mine a little higher than the 10 and 2 , but will try that in a week or so on new girl .

Best of luck and Happy 4th
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post #18 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Advasko View Post
Thanks all! I mentioned in a previous post that the reason the tip of her ear is not taped is because it has a cut on it. I do make fairly long posts, but I’m really bad at determining size. I have measured them out and then while posting they were too short? So now they’re on the long side. But I’ll work on that.
Advasko you can still tape the tip that has a cut. Just take the top piece of tape vertically over the post and down the other side, leaving the cut open to air.

For your posts, you can pre measure them so you don't end up with a long post. Just cut a piece of your backer rod extra long and insert it into the ear, marking the spot on the backer rod that's just a little longer than the ear. Take it out of the ear and pre cut it. Then when you do your taping, you will have the perfect size to start with.

Otherwise, if you don't pre cut the backer rod, after you finish taping, you can put your thumb over the tip of the ear before you cut off the excess, that way you don't accidentally cut the tip of the ear.
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post #19 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Advasko View Post
Thanks all! I mentioned in a previous post that the reason the tip of her ear is not taped is because it has a cut on it. I do make fairly long posts, but I’m really bad at determining size. I have measured them out and then while posting they were too short? So now they’re on the long side. But I’ll work on that.
Sorry, missed that there was a cut on the ear. Obviously you don't want to tape over that. There are some ways around that, as others have mentioned.

Keep at it. Your taping will improve!


DSC_0133
by Shanoa Delta, on Flickr

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& Sirai's Golden Masquerade ORT L1V L1E L2C L2I NW2 RATI SOG DOG TKN WAC
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post #20 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 11:21 AM
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You can cut off the tip of the post if it is way too long once your job is complete and fully taped. Just be SURE you do it in such a way that you don't get the tip of the ear too. If I have to adjust the length of the post, I put my thumbnail on the tip of the ear, making sure that I can feel the end of the ear with the ball of my thumb and that my thumbnail overhangs the ear tip, then I cut a little bit higher than the tip of my thumb. I make extra sure than my dog is staying still before I cut and that there is no chance that he will suddenly wiggle as I cut. In other words, I need the dog to be calm and accepting of what I am doing at that particular moment before I try to trim the post.

You can also measure the length of the post before you put it in, notice whether it is too long and by how much, once your pup is posted, and then use that as a guide the next time you post.

I'm not sure what mean what you mean about pushing the post in vs pulling the ear up--but basically you want to hold the ear between your fingers and thumb close to the tip, stretch it into a straight line above the dogs head (perpendicular to the top of his head) and then push the post straight down into the ear canal with your other hand, twisting it as you do. You can't damage the actual ear canal/eardrum because the ear canal turns toward the dog's head (almost in a right angle) so there is really no way you can push it in too far. Go ahead and get it snugly in there.



Stretch the tip of the ear upward from the dog's head with the forward inside edge of the ear along the post in a straight line.

DON'T let go! Press the ear leather up against the sticky post. DON'T let go! Start wrapping the tape around the ear, base and tip first (I *think* I usually put on the base first??.) Put the tape on fairly loosely and then squeeze the tape so that it sticks to itself and to the ear; that will keep you from putting it on too tight. The middle tape can come last; you can even let go of the ear for a second when you have the upper and lower tape in place if you need to adjust your grip somehow.

Your lower tape should start as low as you can get it on the post. Angle it slightly upward as you wrap it around the post toward the top of the dog's head (between the ears), but keep the edge of the tape as close to the top of the dog's head as you can. Wrap it around the back of the ear, about the middle of the bell or lower, then across and at a downward angle back to the post again, as far down as you can get it.



In general, if you have the post in snugly and the ears pulled up straight while you tape, when you let go, the ears will fall naturally into a slightly tipped outward position. \_/

If they tip inward, you need to redo your posting job.

I think perhaps if you are having trouble with the ears falling to the side too much, you are probably not pushing the post into the ear canal enough, and/or taping the lower tape straight across the ear too high up, rather than angling it downward when you stick it to the post.
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Last edited by melbrod; 07-05-2020 at 05:28 PM.
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post #21 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 12:11 PM
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Nice post Mel.

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post #22 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-04-2020, 10:05 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you so much for all the valuable information! You all have encouraged me. Happy Independence Day!
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post #23 of 23 (permalink) Old 07-05-2020, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Advasko View Post
Thank you so much for all the valuable information! You all have encouraged me. Happy Independence Day!
All of us one here has started at the ground floor - it just takes time and great advice from others on how they post - any new ways , or tape to use - We are getting a new little girl soon and I asked here about tapes and anything new to do - things change and you always want to do better - Greenie , MC , Aunt Bug , VZ , Fitz , Dobiegal , Mel , 1982 , Sandy , Faln , Aunt Bonnie , John , SD , LDi , Alan j. , TN , Rosemary - and this is just to name a few on here that really helps on explaining things with ears and many , many other subjects on here - Always hop on here if you have questions , Heck even as old as I am I still lean on the many on here for advise
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