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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 06:31 PM Thread Starter
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I have gotten some good tips from this forum about a breeder I have considered, regarding the high number of puppies whelped in a short period of time, and the apparent red flags. To give Premier Dobermans of Talmadge Ohio the benefit of the doubt though , I would like to know if anybody has had any personal experience with Samantha and her Dobies.My interest stems from the fact that one of her bitches is an Obie Wan Kanobe daughter. My current boy is an Obie grandson, and he is arguably the best Dobie I've had the pleasure to own. He is strictly a pet, companion and family protector and his disposition fits his use perfectly. Any input would be greatly appreciated. We are still in the research stage as we don't want to subject our old man to a rambunctious puppy, but his days are undeniably numbered.
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 07:53 PM
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I trialed a lot in the Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Pennsylvania, Iowa, Missouri and Wisconsin area up until 2010 and after that time we competed in the Maryland, New Jersey, Florida, Virginia, Delaware and I don't recall ever seeing any Doberman from that kennel. We competed in agility, obedience, rally and a couple of temperament trials. We did AKC, UKC and Nadac. I think someone who has experience in the breed ring and/or bite sport will be along to help.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by J.R View Post
I have gotten some good tips from this forum about a breeder I have considered, regarding the high number of puppies whelped in a short period of time, and the apparent red flags. To give Premier Dobermans of Talmadge Ohio the benefit of the doubt though , I would like to know if anybody has had any personal experience with Samantha and her Dobies.My interest stems from the fact that one of her bitches is an Obie Wan Kanobe daughter. My current boy is an Obie grandson, and he is arguably the best Dobie I've had the pleasure to own. He is strictly a pet, companion and family protector and his disposition fits his use perfectly. Any input would be greatly appreciated. We are still in the research stage as we don't want to subject our old man to a rambunctious puppy, but his days are undeniably numbered.
Do you not think that your dog's sire and dam has any affect on his temperament? I am honestly puzzled when people give such credit to a single dog for temperament, simply because it's a "big name." There are a lot of genes that go into creating a dog's temperament, as well as their early experiences in life. One dog in a pedigree does not temperament make.

For comparison, my "Jet" grandaughter does not have identical temperaments to other "Jet" grandkids, despite sharing a famous grandsire.
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 09:08 PM
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Yeesh... 4 dogs, 7 bitches, and 6 litters expected between now and mid-June? And selling an (evidently) untitled male for $12,500?

And as many puppies as Obi Wan sired by by who knows how many different bitches, giving him credit for any and all get, grand-get, etc., with good temperaments is a bit of a stretch.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 11:28 PM
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Which one of her bitches? I'm clicking around the website and I see no pedigrees or registration names aside from Pedro Z Padoku.

Who by the way, major red flag: according to their facebook page he has been deceased since at least July 25th 2019... he was born in May 2017, meaning he was barely two years old if that when he was deceased...
After some sleuthing they claim that he was 'poisoned in their front yard at a very young age'. My question is - why is he the only one who was poisoned when they have other dogs? But ok, even giving the benefit of doubt...

A major major red flag - Desoto was born in September 8th of 2018, that means Pedro was only 14 months when he was bred to their female Beatrix. For all the health testing, temperament/titling they claim to be doing, this is highly concerning for several reasons:
- 1st and foremost a dog cannot have his hips certified by OFA before the age of 2. Prelims are not considered a certification. A quick search in the OFA base and I could not find him. There is another P-litter dog in there, named Paco but has no siblings listed.
- 2nd cardiac testing is not worth much at that age. The vast majority of dobermans will have a normal heart at 1, 2 even 3. Problems don't tend to show up until later.
- 3rd, I personally don't think it's a good idea to breed dobermans under the age of 3 because they are a slow maturing breed both physically and temperamentally. Males especially have a much longer fertility window there is no rush to breed them and their temperaments can evolve drastically even from 2 to 3.
- 4th A dog needs to be minimum 15 months old to obtain a BH. Quick search online shows that Pedro was completely untitled before and after he was bred.
- 5th according to these planned litters they are also saying that DeSoto is being bred before he turns 2. DeSoto also doesn't appear in the OFA database, but they claim his health testing is all done and use the FCI Hip/Elbow scoring "A"... I'd like to know according to what country? Dog needs to be registered with an FCI registry, but he was born in the US, and I can't find a trace of him anywhere in any database, I'd be willing to bet he isn't registered which means hip/elbow certs can't have been done.

And this is only scratching the surface.
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 07:50 AM
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Just curious if you are in the PNW why not look for breeders in that area? There are a lot of really good breeders your way.
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 08:07 AM Thread Starter
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thanks to all, I obviously have a lot to learn.
And particularly thanks greenkouki, can you recommend some good breeders in the NW?
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 09:17 AM
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thanks to all, I obviously have a lot to learn.
And particularly thanks greenkouki, can you recommend some good breeders in the NW?
A great place to start is a DPCA chapter club. If you're near Seattle that would be the Puget Sound Doberman Pinscher Club. You may look to other states as well. While it's not all encompassing, the DPCA breeder referral list has a good number of breeders and you could be referred to other people if the breeder(s) you contact from that list don't have puppies or anything planned in the near future. https://dpca.org/breed/breeder-referral-list/


Sometimes the best place to find a breeder is to go to a local AKC dog show and be at the ring where dobes show and approach people ringside who look like they know what they're doing. If you talk to a handler or someone who seems obviously busy it's preferable to do it after all the dobermans have shown. Most people will want to help you out and going to shows means you took the initiative to make a connection in person rather than just an email or phone call which breeders generally get a lot of.
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 12:45 PM
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FWIW, after further searching, Pedro died at the end of October 2018. So he was a year and a half old when he passed.


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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 04:31 PM
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Hi J.R.! And welcome from another Pacific NW denizen.

As greenkouki mentioned we do have a number of very good breeders here in Oregon, Washington and BC.

If you use the "Search" feature in the above header and type in "NW breeders" you will find some threads with the info that you may be interested in.

This will get you started: https://www.dobermantalk.com/northwe...est-coast.html.

Good luck in your search.

John Lichtwardt
Portland OR

BTW... You are to be commended for doing your research in your quest for a new Dobe pup!

J.
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