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Off To The Vet This Morning

6K views 65 replies 16 participants last post by  TNfisher 
#1 ·
I have to take Mocha to the vet as soon as they open; not sure what's wrong with her. She was acting a bit off last night, nothing I could put my finger on but I know my girl and something was just off with her. She ate and drank ok, and went outside for her business and I noticed she went up and down the deck stairs slow, which was a sign for sure because slow is not in her vocabulary but the way she was acting...subdued, if that makes sense.

This morning when I got up, she got up kind of slow and as I watched her, she's not her usual energetic happy self. When she stood up, she would take a step or two backwards, ears down, with a look like she had done something bad. And she keeps wanting to sit or lay down. And when I took her outside, again she went up and down the deck stairs slow. And the constant ears down, sad eyes...to me, it looks like it's either something internal or maybe her back.

She is following us around, and is looking for breakfast but I'm going to hold off on the food for now, just in case.
 
#2 · (Edited)
Best wishes for Mocha at her vet visit. It's amazing how dogs and humans can sense each other's moods and malaise in an unspoken language.

FYI: Neighbor's young male dog, Jasper, across street went through a several day period of lethargy and not eating food. She thought the influx of toads this year in our yards might have been culprit, with dog picking up something toxic off toads. This is first year we've had this issue. I have been releasing frogs I find trapped in pool or filter basket into front yard, but now I may take them down to nearby park to release. Jasper did vomit but never had the foaming at the mouth like below article discusses:

https://www.vets-now.com/2017/09/dog-poisonous-toad-vets-now/
 
#9 ·
Hoping for an update soon, TN. Worried for Mocha.
 
#10 · (Edited)
They took x-rays and did blood work, the only thing they saw was that her liver is smaller than normal and that her liver ALT levels have gone higher than before (407) so we're going to get a referral to a specialist to have an ultrasound done to see if she has that shunt issue (can't remember the exact name).
She's pooping real good, so the food is moving through the intestines ok.
The doc had her walk to watch her, and checked to see if she had any pain or discomfort along her neck when they moved her head and had her move her head, so right now they're not sure what's going on.

So unfortunately, no good answers today. It was a long and expensive morning.

Edit: she does seem to be feeling better...maybe she has/had an upset stomach? They gave us some gastric acid reduction meds and some pain meds (she won't be getting the pain meds)

Right now she's all perky, helping me eat a chicken sandwich.
 
#18 · (Edited)
You're right, none of those tests are cheap and it adds up when they're doing multiple ones at a time. I left that office a bit poorer today but honestly, I'd sell my car and walk to work to take care of Mocha.

TN - If I remember right - ALT range is ? 12 to 118 OR some place around that number . Ali's got as high as 1358 , then she was in BIG trouble . How was the ALP and Bun numbers ?

So did they set you up with a Internal Med. Vet ? They are really god to go to !

BEst of luck ole buddy and give Mocha aa big hug and ear rub for me !
They have us scheduled with an internal specialist on the 13th, where they'll do the abdominal ultrasound (ka-ching, mo money, mo money LOL). A few years ago, when we got referred, we had to drive down to Nashville but earlier this year that office opened up a sister office here in town. So far they're only an emergency vet and have an internal specialist but they hope to be totally mirrored to their Nashville office within the next year, which will be great. If their docs here are even half as good as the ones in Nashville, we'll be set. They're not cheap, but they do get results and can do things a regular vet can't.

I don't know what her other numbers were, the doc said everything was in the normal range except her ALT.

I'm going to be sure to ask them to try to cover as much of the abdomen with the ultrasound as they can, even if I have to pay more, just to see if the x-ray may have missed something.
 
#17 ·
When the liver acts up, they really don't feel well. Wicca was acting like this about 3 weeks ago, and bloodwork showed that her ALT was up over 1200. She had routine bloodwork a year ago and it was perfectly normal then. We put her on IV fluids for a day at the vet's, started antibiotics on IV, came home with Clavaseptin and a pretty high dose of Metronidazole, I started her on Denamarin and in a week, her ALT came down to just under 200, and the difference in her demeanour was amazing. She did keep her appetite through the whole thing, which surprised me, but she obviously felt really lousy before the fluids and abx started. Like you said, it almost does look like a back problem because of the caution they seem to be taking. The day I saw Wicca walk into the yard (WALK!), just pee, and walk back in was a sure sign that there was something really wrong.
 
#22 ·
She *seemed* better this morning; when the alarm went off and I started getting out of bed, she jumped up too vs. me having to prod her to get up like yesterday. Took her outside to potty, and then gave her a small handful of kibble (morning ritual so she won't throw up with empty stomach) and she went back to bed. I'll get some updates from Mrs. TN throughout the day.
 
#24 ·
I just got another update from my wife, she says Mocha seems to be acting normal so maybe, she just had an upset stomach?

As far as the ALT, it's been slightly elevated for about a year now, in the 300 range...elevated but not enough where the doc was too concerned. We put her on Denamarin which did absolutely nothing for her at all. With the most recent test, her ALT is over 400 which is why the doc wants to get an ultrasound to see if she has a liver shunt. If she doesn't, I believe a liver biopsy may be next.
 
#25 ·
So sorry Mocha is having problems. I do hope they can figure it out and she feels better soon. Yes, liver tests are expensive.

I've been dealing with Helo's up and down ALT values since April, started over 500, then 200, one was completely normal and most recently back to 190. He had a normal ultrasound and bile acid test in June but when the ALT shot back up, they recommended the biopsy which was done last week. Helo is doing well but the path report was inconclusive and they even suggested it may just be his normal. No shunt or copper storage disease (and it doesn't run in his lines that we know of). Going to try one more ALT and if it's high, will start him on Denamarin. I have Nationwide Pet Insurance but have already reached the annual max on this condition so I will pay about $3,200 of the biopsy out of pocket. That included anesthesia, more blood work and an overnight stay. The ultrasound was $350 and bile acid test $200 to give you an idea of the costs.
 
#27 ·
Thanks! I did ask the Internist about food and he said not to change it at this time. He's on Annamaet Extra which has 11.2 ppm copper. It's a really good local PA food and I hate to change it if I don't have to.
 
#32 · (Edited)
Thought I'd update this thread.

I'm so glad that I pushed my vet to refer us to the internal specialist. First they did an abdominal ultrasound to rule out a blockage and they also looked at her liver, which looked normal, then they suggested we run more tests, which we agreed to so we could find out what the heck was going on with Mocha. They did an upper GI endoscopy, an ultrasound-guided liver biopsy, and ran a ton of tests on her.
I'm pasting the email we received from the internal specialist below:
------------------------------------------------------------
Hello all- just wanted to pass along Mocha's test results - almost all completed, and to the point that I think we have a good plan moving forward. I am out of town so am emailing you all so as not to delay her management. I will followup with her final special stain results (liver biopsy) by next week.

Her GI function panel was normal, so her pancreas works well and she has no evidence of malabsorption/maldigestion.

Her intestinal biopsies showed marked eosinophilic inflammation; this is supportive of food allergy component for her diarrhea. We discussed and figured out that chicken seems to be a trigger food for Mocha.

The liver biopsies do show excessive copper accumulation and mild inflammation. Her copper level of 1760 ppm is in the toxic range; normal range is 120-400 ppm.

SO...she needs a copper chelator and a low copper diet, but also ideally a hypoallergenic/ novel ingredient diet to manage these conditions together.
---I am having my technician Shaina call in D-penicillamine (copper chelator) 280 mg capsules to Wedgewood pharmacy for us. She gets one capsule by mouth twice daily on empty stomach or with a small bit of meat. We will give this for six months to no more than 12 months, depending on her liver enzymes.
---As for her diet, I looked at the Hill's prescription l/d ad Royal Canin Hepatic Support. The L/D canned and dry formulas are based on pork, egg, and soy; the only chicken-derived ingredient is chicken fat, and if pure, fat should not be allergenic. So, this could be a feasible option for her diet to try.
The Royal Canin dry is soy-based, while the canned is chicken-based. So, the dry RC Hepatic is an option as well

****I am wondering if someone from Tiny Town could help get Mocha onto one of the diets above? We do not sell pet food.
She needs to transition slowly over 4-5 days from her current diet to the new food. If these diets do not work well, then we can see about using a custom cooked diet such as JustFoodForDogs Hepatic Low Fat fish/rice-based cooked/frozen food.

I would like to recheck Mocha in about three to four weeks for exam and liver enzymes.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Tiny Town is the name of her regular vet.
As you can see, we're in for some major changes around here. And we're so happy we caught the copper storage disease before there was any damage to the liver. It's going to be a bit tricky dealing with food allergy and copper storage at the same time. What if neither the Royal Canin or the Hills agree with her? If that's the case, and I hope it isn't, then I'll have to talk to the internal specialist and do a ton of research about preparing home-made food for Mocha.

And FYI, this ordeal has been very expensive. Between the tests our regular vet ran, and all the tests the internal specialist ran, plus the hospital stay and the meds they gave us, we've spent around $4,500 on this girl in the last 2 weeks. Now comes the liver medicine which is $80 a month, the Rx food which after taxes comes to almost $100 per 27.5 pound bag, and the Denamarin which is $60 a month. And the reason I bring up the money is because it's been brought up numerous times on this site in many threads that this is not a cheap breed to own so as a prospective or current owner, it's a good idea to 1. have pet insurance and 2. set aside some money for something like this. Thank God we have a "rainy day for Mocha" fund, and we also have pet insurance but unfortunately elevated ALT levels are a pre-existing condition so I doubt they'll cover our bill from the internal specialist. We're hoping they'll at least cover some of it...we'll find out soon enough.

So, that's where we are right now, at least both of Mocha's conditions can be managed with medicine, a proper diet, and regular checkups.
 
#35 ·
You're such a good dad TN to Mocha. At least you know what you're dealing with now and have a plan moving forward. These guys are expensive and not for the faint of heart but they are worth every cent for the love and devotion they give us.

I spent a lot of money on Coco her last year of her life and I would have spent more if I could have beaten the osteosarcoma somehow. It's only money right.

Give that beautiful girl a kiss from Sugar and I.
 
#36 ·
You're such a good dad TN to Mocha. At least you know what you're dealing with now and have a plan moving forward. These guys are expensive and not for the faint of heart but they are worth every cent for the love and devotion they give us.

I spent a lot of money on Coco her last year of her life and I would have spent more if I could have beaten the osteosarcoma somehow. It's only money right.

Give that beautiful girl a kiss from Sugar and I.
Exactly, Coco. You should have seen the looks some of my coworkers gave me when they asked me how much everything cost and I told them. Sorry (not sorry), that's my dog, and my responsibility :2smile:
 
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