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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-28-2020, 06:33 PM Thread Starter
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Blood test results - Creatinine - SDMA - BUN

Just had blood work done on Katie, 4 yrs old. I'm concerned because her creatinine and IDEXX SDMA readings are high.

She's tall, weighs 87 lbs, well proportioned, runs quite a bit, drinks a lot, and urinates a lot when she goes. Last year I switched her from Purina Pro Plan Sport (30% protein) to Science Diet Sensitive Stomach & Skin (~21% protein)

I would appreciate thoughts / info from anyone knowledge or having similar experiences.

Thanks

05 2020 04 2019 11 2018
Creatinine 2.3mg/dL 2.0mg/dL 1.5mg/dL
IDEXX SDMA 16 μg/dL 17 μg/dL
BUN 26mg/dL 28mg/dL 31mg/dL
MPV 15.3 fL 13.8 fL
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-28-2020, 06:51 PM
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The way your figures are posted kinda turned into a mess--the forum software doesn't let you use the space bar to line up rows.

Is this what you were trying to show?

Creatinine
5/2020--2.3
4/2019--2.0
11/2018--1.5

BUN
5/2020--26
4/2019--28
11/2018--31

You only had two values for the others, so I don't know which date they go with.

Do you have the lab's normal values for the tests?
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-29-2020, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melbrod View Post
The way your figures are posted kinda turned into a mess--the forum software doesn't let you use the space bar to line up rows.

Is this what you were trying to show?

Creatinine
5/2020--2.3
4/2019--2.0
11/2018--1.5

BUN
5/2020--26
4/2019--28
11/2018--31

You only had two values for the others, so I don't know which date they go with.

Do you have the lab's normal values for the tests?
Thanks Mel, I was really slow in figuring out what on earth the numbers related to.

I've got an older IDEXX report from one of my Dobes (the reference ranges don't often change so here are the BUN and Creatinine ranges.

Creatinine: 0.4 - 1.18 mg/dl
BUN: 7 - 27 mg/dl

And I see and can actually read for results for most IDEXX reports but I don't have a clue what IDEXX SDMA or MPV stand for.

87 pounds is pretty heavy for a bitch. How tall is she? Measured from top of shoulder to ground with the front legs perpendicular a Dobe bitch in the normal size range would be between 24" and 26".

Did you talk to your vet about those results?

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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-29-2020, 02:51 PM
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I haven't seen many dobes with Kidney issues, personally, although I'm sure they're out there. Have you had an echo or holter done?
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-29-2020, 03:12 PM
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It is true that heart problems can cause kidney problems, which may be indicated by an abnormally high creatinine level. So I think you should include tests to determine her heart function with other diagnostics to try to figure out what is going on, especially since she is a doberman. (But I'm not a vet. At least ask your vet for his opinion though.)

And even if you get good results on her holter and EKG, you will, at the very least, have a baseline that you can compare to on down the line if she develops heart trouble.
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-29-2020, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gretchen_Red View Post
I haven't seen many dobes with Kidney issues, personally, although I'm sure they're out there. Have you had an echo or holter done?
Kidney issues are fairly common in some lines--everything from an outright missing kidney--from birth. To a variety of things some of which can be controlled with meds and I lost one of my males (long ago now) to a kidney infection that was such that his vets could not control it--we ran cultures to see what was the most appropriate antibiotic to stop the infection--tried everything the sensitivity part of the test indicated should work. And it became a matter of using two different antibiotics and switching them when his temperature rose, indicating which drug wasn't controlling the infection any more. We'd switch drugs but never ever found anything that stopped the infection--it caused him to run an elevated temperature and it slowly literally burned his weight off. He ate huge quantities of food but continued to look more and more like a dog who was being starved.

I felt terrible when I took him in to let him go--nicest dog in the world--put up with everything with good grace. He never ever deserved something like a kidney disease--they are horrible. Make the dog feel bad even though they are not typically painful.

Ick..didn't meant to tell you guys that story--kidney disease seems to run more heavily in some lines than others but it's not uncommon. I think it often goes undiagnosed because it's more common in aging dogs than young one (well, except for Juvenile Renal Disease but there's a genetic test for that now I think.)

ABTLH
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-01-2020, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiedobie2016 View Post
Just had blood work done on Katie, 4 yrs old. I'm concerned because her creatinine and IDEXX SDMA readings are high.

She's tall, weighs 87 lbs, well proportioned, runs quite a bit, drinks a lot, and urinates a lot when she goes. Last year I switched her from Purina Pro Plan Sport (30% protein) to Science Diet Sensitive Stomach & Skin (~21% protein)

I would appreciate thoughts / info from anyone knowledge or having similar experiences.

Thanks

05 2020 04 2019 11 2018
Creatinine 2.3mg/dL 2.0mg/dL 1.5mg/dL
IDEXX SDMA 16 μg/dL 17 μg/dL
BUN 26mg/dL 28mg/dL 31mg/dL
MPV 15.3 fL 13.8 fL
Creatinine and BUN both have to do with kidney function. BUN = Blood Urea nitrogen and Creatinine helps distinguish kidney related causes of high BUN and non kidney related causes.
Neither of the levels you cited are very high. In fact normal reference range for BUN is 9 to 31 MG/DL and Creatinine is 0.5 to 1.5 MG/DL.
My Recent experience with Vet, which ended in the loss of my sweet baby Duchess, says that your reported levels should be monitored from time to time and if they increase action can be taken. There are many causes for these levels to be elevated most are transient and will self resolve action you can take on your own is decrease level of protein and increase fiber in the diet. Both BUN and creatinine are indicators of protein metabolism level. IDEXX SDMA not as familiar with this one still not extremely high could be transient problem you may want to ask your vet, It also has multiple possible causes and further investigation will be necessary to determine which possibility is the cause.

Last edited by Phy; 06-01-2020 at 07:51 AM.
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-01-2020, 09:23 AM
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Individual labs may have somewhat different normal values depending on their own particular processes--differences in testing equipment, chemical reagents used, and analysis techniques. So they include their ranges on the report to help whoever is interpreting the test know what to compare the results to. That's why I asked for the normal values for these particular results. That being said, for common tests like BUN and creatinine, all labs should have reference ranges that are very close to each other.

Differences in muscle mass between breeds can make a difference in normal creatinine values too. Creatinine can be elevated in a muscular dog as opposed to one of a less muscled breed and still be normal. An elderly dog who is losing muscle mass may actually be starting to have problems that aren't picked up because his lack of muscle lowers the test results.

The SDMA test is marketed as being more sensitive to kidney problems than either the creatinine or BUN test, and as being able to pick up early disease before the BUN or creatinine is elevated. The company which produces it says that >14 is considered to indicate a problem which needs more investigation. It is a relatively new test however; I don't know if they have a really firm handle on exactly how much they should rely on these test results to specifically determine kidney disease. And it can apparently be elevated with heart problems too.

Have you had a urinalysis done on Katie? Kidneys tend to spill protein if they are damaged, so looking at those test results may help clarify the picture a bit.

A lot of times, it can more useful to look at changes in test result values over time, than to just rely on comparing the results to normal values, because every dog may start with a different baseline.

What does your vet say?

Last edited by melbrod; 06-01-2020 at 09:37 AM.
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