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post #26 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 07:59 PM
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Ok wise guy , what Xuse would have YOU used ?
Jack Daniels? It's worked for me in the past And what, pray tell, is an "Xuse"???? More iPad shenanigans? LOL

Love ya, buddy
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post #27 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 10:20 AM
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Wishing Ali a speedy recovery!
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post #28 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 11:48 AM
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So very sorry Ken. Just saw this. Sending lots and lots of good thoughts and prayers for Ali. They sure enough love to worry us to death. Please keep us updated and hoping she is now eating.
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post #29 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 12:35 PM
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Any updates, Ken?



She is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are her life, her love, her leader. She will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of her heart. You owe it to her to be worthy of such devotion.
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post #30 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
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First off , I have to say a big thank you to one of our sisters on here , we had a nice talk and threw ideas around , I canít say enough good things about our brothers and sisters on this site ! And the knowledge about Dobermans .

Now the update , I was a mean dad last night ! Ali wanted a drink , I said ok , got her canned food , chopped it up and then poured the water over it , there ! If you could have seen the look she gave me , lol then I went and sat down , she walked off then back , looked
at me , and then she started drinking it , then she grabbed a piece of canned food , anyway , she ate it , then again around 1:30 a.m. , had to potty and same deal when she came in ,needed a drink , this time , I put in about a half a cup of dry , poured water in with it , same look , lol I shut off the lights and went back to bed , I heard her pacing around then heard her drinking , along with crunching sound , she ate it all + a good bowl clean from licking .

Now this morning , no go ! Has not ate till about 10 minutes ago , now this is funny , I put out about 3/4 cup of dry , then opened a new can of no salt green beans , poured juice only over the dry + about a 1/2 inch of juice in the bowl , still nothing , I had not ate much for lunch , sitting here at the desk and opened up a bag of Lays , wavy chips , Ali was staring at me , then brain storm ! I asked her if she wanted one ? I handed her one and am damn lucky I still have my fingers ! Then I gave her one more , but dropped it on the floor this time , wolfed it down , then I took 2 or 3 and broke them into small pieces and put them on her food , that poor girl , She was hungry , licked it clean , and is now laying on the couch getting rubs from her mom And now , I can go do some work I hope this jumped started her back to eating .

Most know on here , my hair is gray , you know that foxy looking gray , like. The movie stars have , anyway if these dogs donít stop stressing me , along with Miley , it going to be that granny blue color !

Thanks my friend for helping out Miss Ali

Doc
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post #31 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 01:21 PM
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Kenny,

Finally found this thread--ignore the PM sent today, Kenny. Your Ali girl is in my prayers and best thoughts!!!

About the not eating--there are a number of things that will cause a dog who looks and acts normal except for not eating--an infection anywhere (sounds like she may have something going in the lungs--aspiration pneumonia (I don't care what they say--those of us who've been reading the Kenny DocK posts for awhile can translate anything). And often they'll act like they are really interested in eating but when presented with food will not eat it. Kidney problems always have non eating as a symptom--that's because their kidney aren't cleaning waste products from the blood and the waste products build up and they will make a dog feel very sick. Of the thng I'm going through with my geriatric visitor--who is on an anti-arrhythmic which is well know for turning off the appetite switch as if it never existed. I can offer her any number of things and she will get excited and then sadly turn her head. And even worse, when I do find something she will eat by herself today--it becomes something she won't (can't bring herself to eat) tomorrow. There are a few things she will always eat--raw chicken gizzards--but I don't think a diet of only chicken gizzards is that great for her so she eats what she will and I am very accomplished at feeding dogs who don't want to eat--we sort of keep her diet balanced (at least sort of) and make it into little balls and poke it down her--she's willing enough to stand close to me and let me open her mouth and drop the food down her like that--so she's still hungry but every dog that I know of who has been on mexilatine has had the same problem--NO APPETITE!

Keep us posted...

ABTLH

PS Just read the food report from last night and this morning--a lot of times with this sort of non-eating Ken, try different things if she won't eat kibble or canned food. One of the things I got for my visiting girl (because I remember someone whose cardio bitch wasn't eating and she was trying everything--started giving her frosted wheat biskets)-it's almost the only thing that Jersey would eat from the beginning and still eats--not in her bowl of course but from my hand will eat 1/2 a cup so when things are really bad for her she get about a cup of those throughout the day.

ABTLH
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post #32 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 02:26 PM
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I've been out of town and just saw this - Good thoughts for Ali..... and I like how you are getting her to eat - sneaky is good!!
My go to food when dogs don't want to eat.... which is mostly when I have a picky bitch out showing.... is scrambled eggs. Might be worth a try & since it is what my girl with copper storage eats all the time, I know that they are ok for dogs with liver issues.
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post #33 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 06:38 PM
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Sending lots more good thoughts and prayers for your girl. Big secret Ken, my hair is grey also but no one will ever see it!
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post #34 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 06:54 PM
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Sending lots more good thoughts and prayers for your girl. Big secret Ken, my hair is grey also but no one will ever see it!
LOL dax...

Look at your post #20 on your thread.(unless that's your grandpa!)

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post #35 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 07:01 PM Thread Starter
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Sending lots more good thoughts and prayers for your girl. Big secret Ken, my hair is grey also but no one will ever see it!
We have a contender for post of the year with this one ! Like Brother John , lol 😂
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post #36 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 07:25 PM Thread Starter
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Update time .

Well , as you all on here know , these Dobermans are VERY wise , Ali will only eat , after I give her , her pill to make her what to eat , 40 minutes is all it takes and girl is ready to eat . So yesterday , Ken thought , cheese ! Wife had some stick cheese , so we cut it up into very small pieces , then I gave her some bait , boy did she like that ! The other day , she turned her noise on them . Then I took a hand full of her dry , along with some of th cheese and rubbed the cheese al over the dry ! Ken thought , you genius! Well my friends , I’m not ! Ali took a few pieces of the dry with cheese rubbed on , stood there , looked at me , then spit out the dry , minus any cheese on them . Ken thought , damnit !

I had talked to another DTer on here , looking for any ideas , they came up with a great idea , use the water off of a can of tuna and pour that over her dry . Well , she did the same thing , took a mouth full , looked around , then spit it out ! That is when I got the bag of Lays out and put in a few chips , then she ate it .

Tonight , well next brain storm idea , hotdogs! I cut u a half , put in her dry , she picked out every piece of hot dog . I threw the white flag and got her another and let her have it .

Plan 14 ! Told the wife about the egg deal that Fritz used , wife fixed her up some , that didn’t work either ,but the 4 legged Dyson (Mr. B ) took care of the eggs , dang , I missed a good video there , it was the first eggs he had an he was having a hard time eating the eggs as he pushed the plate across the floor ,

Tomorrow ? Don’t know , vet called me this afternoon and we had a good talk , IF , she does not eat a good breakfast on her own , then we are taking her back over there .

Friends , she eat that hotdog right down , she is so hungry , I thought was it her food ? She still had a half bag , but I opened u a new one , we washed everything , everything , yet , a no go , I don’t know , I am afraid , is there something else we have missed ? I don’t know , but we will find out , that’s for sure .
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post #37 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 08:01 PM
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Rice cooked in chicken broth, mixed with juicy boiled chicken, with extra chicken broth poured over it??

Moderately healthy in the short term, not likely to cause a dietary upset and not quite as decadent as hot dogs.
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post #38 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 09:44 PM
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Sometimes you get to a point, where you give them what they will eat. My go to meal for a dog that does not want to eat is a McDonald's cheeseburger. I've fed them while on the road with a picky bitch that can't afford to lose weight for the show ring. Never had a dog turn their nose up to a cheeseburger.... but I suppose there could be a first time.
Sometimes the hand feeding works too - had a Greyhound with end stage kidney disease many years ago that would only eat food out of my hand.
Rice and hamburger is also a good go to food that is probably a little bit healthier than McDonalds. I mostly use it for getting rid of the runs.... but it can work for picky eaters also..... as can egg noodles with chicken and low salt broth.
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post #39 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 11:27 AM Thread Starter
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Ali’s hungry pill failed today , 40 minutes after giving it to her , girl is looking for something to eat , not today , I had a cup of her dry , then added the juice off of her green beans , which has been working , then broke up a quarter of a hot dog and added into the dry , which is by now getting soft , I had a bit left on my hamburger, broke off a very small piece , she ate it , then did it again and added it to her potpourri which it was now getting to be , no go

Headed back to the Vets .

I love that girl to death , but this is very tiring on us , knowing she wants to eat , but won’t , I still think it’s in her belly , so hope the vet waves his wand over her and she gets well quick .
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post #40 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 11:29 AM
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There are meds which can be given to stimulate appetite and also ones to coat the stomach lining, if she's having trouble with nausea.

I hope your vet has a magic wand too.

Sick dogs who won't eat are worrisome, both in terms of plain old health, and also, I think, because feeding those we care for is so wrapped up in the way we nurturing parents express our love. Witness all of those overweight dogs out there.

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post #41 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 11:31 AM
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Aliís hungry pill failed today , 40 minutes after giving it to her , girl is looking for something to eat , not today , I had a cup of her dry , then added the juice off of her green beans , which has been working , then broke up a quarter of a hot dog and added into the dry , which is by now getting soft , I had a bit left on my hamburger, broke off a very small piece , she ate it , then did it again and added it to her potpourri which it was now getting to be , no go

Headed back to the Vets .

I love that girl to death , but this is very tiring on us , knowing she wants to eat , but wonít , I still think itís in her belly , so hope the vet waves his wand over her and she gets well quick .
Oh, Ali.

Did the vet give her anything for nausea? Any appetite stimulant?

Will she eat just straight canned food with no kibble in it?

Maybe it's time for a trip to McDonald's. Was it Mary Jo who mentioned the McD's cheeseburger? That's always been a HUGE hit with my dogs....or some chicken nuggets....


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post #42 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 12:07 PM Thread Starter
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MC , The vet has her on Mirtazapine- 15 mg. To increase her appetite = her hungry pill . It has been working ever since I starte d giving them to her , that is till today .

We have added broth off of low sodium chicken noodle soup . Tuna water , hotdogs , her canned food , even some of Kadins pro plan , green bean juice , some of Kadins trading treats , all of these she loved to eat , till now , , now I have questions for you pros out there

1. Ali will eat a hot dog , if she gets it along .

2. Piece of my 100%Angus , farm raised , grain feed , Hamburg

3. Then I added it to her dry , or wet , turns her nose and walks away .

4. Opened up new bag of food for her , she loves when I open it and is a good girl and helps dad get it open , no go

5. Super cleaned bowls , feeding cups , everything , I even washed my hands and took a bath .

So my friends , if she can eat a hot dog , or anything else by it’s self , then does she have a belly problem ?

6 She won’t even eat Kadins , stand alone .

7. What could it be that I’m missing here ? Could it be environmental? We are using stainless steel bowls , the same ones that we feed Kasia with , brought them in 2000 . But still the problem is even if I put it down on the floor or try to hand feed her l still a no go .

8 . Excuse me here , but she is so hungry , I think she would eat the azz end of a skunk! If only we could find a way for her too .

9 . Wife walked out when I was tried to feed her , she said this is just so , so sad to watch , shes right , I feel like I’m failing my girl , I can see the help me dad look in her eyes , she depends on us , dad to take good care of her and I’m not , I check on her a million times a night , which she growls , lol

10 . Thanks everybody for you suggestions , and were going threw them , checking them off. .

11. Forgot , I have to watch what I give Ali to eat , wife and I talked last night , feed her bad food and kill her or don’t eat and kill her , hell of a place to be . With luck , doctor H will help us out today .

Last edited by ECIN; 08-08-2019 at 12:10 PM.
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post #43 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 12:46 PM
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The most common side effect of Clavmox is stomach upset, including vomiting and diarrhea. As with any medication, some dogs may have an allergic reaction.
...Side Effects of Clavamox for Dogs
Swelling.
Rash.
Difficulty breathing.
Increased heart rate.
Fever.
Vomiting.
Seizures

It appears this is a broad spectrum antibiotic........suspect the antibiotics might be playing quite a role here Doc .......so I hope your vet comes up with some answers....maybe switching to a different antibiotic that would be effective and easier on the belly.

Did some reading and it was mentioned heating food can enhance the smell of the food....in hopes of getting Ali to eat more.

One other thought I had .....which may play no role at all........was the Hellicopter that was spraying........you mention that you and Ali sat outside watching the spraying activity......and I know you were looking for something you might have missed.........not sure if this would play a role in any way but thought it was worth mentioning.

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post #44 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECIN View Post
MC , The vet has her on Mirtazapine- 15 mg. To increase her appetite = her hungry pill . It has been working ever since I starte d giving them to her , that is till today .

We have added broth off of low sodium chicken noodle soup . Tuna water , hotdogs , her canned food , even some of Kadins pro plan , green bean juice , some of Kadins trading treats , all of these she loved to eat , till now , , now I have questions for you pros out there

1. Ali will eat a hot dog , if she gets it along .

2. Piece of my 100%Angus , farm raised , grain feed , Hamburg

3. Then I added it to her dry , or wet , turns her nose and walks away .

4. Opened up new bag of food for her , she loves when I open it and is a good girl and helps dad get it open , no go

5. Super cleaned bowls , feeding cups , everything , I even washed my hands and took a bath .

So my friends , if she can eat a hot dog , or anything else by itís self , then does she have a belly problem ?

6 She wonít even eat Kadins , stand alone .

7. What could it be that Iím missing here ? Could it be environmental? We are using stainless steel bowls , the same ones that we feed Kasia with , brought them in 2000 . But still the problem is even if I put it down on the floor or try to hand feed her l still a no go .

8 . Excuse me here , but she is so hungry , I think she would eat the azz end of a skunk! If only we could find a way for her too .

9 . Wife walked out when I was tried to feed her , she said this is just so , so sad to watch , shes right , I feel like Iím failing my girl , I can see the help me dad look in her eyes , she depends on us , dad to take good care of her and Iím not , I check on her a million times a night , which she growls , lol

10 . Thanks everybody for you suggestions , and were going threw them , checking them off. .

11. Forgot , I have to watch what I give Ali to eat , wife and I talked last night , feed her bad food and kill her or donít eat and kill her , hell of a place to be . With luck , doctor H will help us out today .
My gut feeling is that she's nauseated from the antibiotics. I'm really hoping your vet will put her on something like Cerenia (if it's safe for her) and that it will help her. I've had similar experiences where a dog *wants* to eat but is also feeling nauseated, and so they'll maybe eat something that tastes "good enough" to put up with the nausea to eat it, but turn up their nose at other things, and it might change every time they try to eat. So, you might feed her something and she thinks it smells okay, so she eats it, but then it turns her stomach because she feels so icky and off, so next time she says...hmmm, no thanks. Then you try something else, she thinks it smells okay, she may try a bit of it, and then, ewww, it feels icky in her stomach, so....no go next time.

I won't even pretend to know enough about her liver issues to know how fast things will affect her, so I can't say what I would or wouldn't be willing to try feeding her. Certainly at some point no food at all is going to be much worse than getting her liver out of whack....I guess if it were me I'd probably be erring on the side of "whatever she'll eat", but, again, that's me. Right now if she's really rejecting kibble I might just stop trying to force it and work on whatever I could get her to eat. Is it cooked chicken and rice? Is it canned food? Is it tripe? Is it chicken nuggets? I'd really want to get her to eat *something* with her pills, whatever that might be.

I might even be asking if she needs some sub-q fluids - I've seen dogs perk up some with just that, because they're mildly dehydrated with the lack of food and not drinking as much. I might be headed to a specialist, since it's been so many days without improvement. I dunno...just throwing out ideas.


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post #45 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 02:48 PM
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Kenny,

I had to finally quit putting any food of any kind (even things that Jersey was eating out of my hand in her bowl because she was NOT going to touch anything that was in her bowl..this morning Jersey ate about half a cup of chicken ( simmered by me) hand fed by me when she had turned it down for the last two days. Her probably isn't as mysterious as Ali's--we kow it's the mexilatine that has killed her appetite her appetite--it's nearlya universal problem with adding mexilatine to cardio drugs because of arrhythmias.

So Miss Jersey's breakfast was the cicken (and boy was I glad to see her eat that) a hard boiled egg, 1/2 a cup of frosted when biscuits (thank you for the spelling Mel, a handful of the junk food Milk Bone minibones bacon flavored, two raw chicken gizzards and two liver brownies (recipe on request). What she also ate (well sort of--I rolled it into small balls and stuffed it down her along with all of her meds 1/2 cup of ProPlan Focus Salmon and Rice mixed with a 1/4 can of Evangers Beef and chicken pate.

I'm with your wife--it makes me sad to stuff food down Jersey but onj the other hand it's so ovious that she feels much better when she eats and in the name of getting both carbs and protein into her I try to stuff her only as much and when I think it's necessary.

In between I feed her some "treats' that I've got around--freeze dried liver, freeze dried heart, some Evangers dried kibble looking things (they are kibble, a soft kibble but don't tell Jersey--she thinks tey are dog treats. She ate toast for me for several days but not any longer--now it is poison--I try not to give her much between breakfast at 6:00am and dinner at 6;00pm. She gets the Mexilatine at 6:00 am , 2:00pm and 10:00pm and I give her 5 mg of famididine 1/2 hour before the Mexilitine. It will settle her stomach but she is only a cardio dog with lots of VPC's not a liver dog. I know you can use it with kidney disease because it's used with cats all the time but it's OTC and cheap if you can use it to settle her stomach.

I'm doing my best to leave her hungry for breakfast and dinner--but it's hard because I can tell she feels worse if she's too empty and is less likely to eat.

Ah Kenny--you have my sympathy--if you can use any of the things Jersey will eat, feed them to her--if she's anything like Jersey at this point she needs the calories.

DAGNABIT--I want this poor lil' wisp of a girl to eat and for Ali to eat. Tell your Missus Kenny that it makes me very sad to think about Ali and watch Jersey--so obviously want to eat but they just cant...!

ABTLH
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post #46 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 03:04 PM Thread Starter
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Well ó- we just got back from the Vets . With not good news , I know sometimes my spelling is not the greatest , but please bare threw it as I canít see the key board for thee tears .

Our go to vet checked Ali out a little bit ago , we have seen with him for over 20 years , what he found was a growth or something that is not suppose to be there in her intestines , the size of as baseball , he pulled up the x rays from Monday and there is a area of white , right in the area he found the growth .

Doc says we need to take her to the vca and have a ultrasound done to determine if its local or attached to other intestines and maybe what we are dealing with .

If itís local then they could operate and take it out .

As most know on here , Ali girl has copper storage , Doc also said that her liver felt firm , more than a normal liver , which is probably from the first round and itís the damage left from it .

Ali also had a cancer taken off her rear leg last year ,

Miss Ali will be 12 in Oct.

And she has got Arteritis in her rear legs , poor girl has been have a harder and harder time to jump up on the couch .

Wife said she did not want to put her threw this type of operation , with her liver condition , whoís to say she would even make it threw it . I donít want to give up , Ali girl is my girl , she is laying right next to me as I type and looks up at me to check , then lays her head down .

I donít know what to do , do we take her for the ultrasound ? Or just let her live her days out here , which will be very short Iím afraid , they did give her another steroid shot to help boost her eating and sent home some cans of AD to help her .

I will be honest here , I had a gut feeling this may be what was wrong , as she has lost some weight over the last few months , I just didnít want to face the fact , and now I have it in black and white .

A operation like this on a almost 12 year dog , I just donít know , it would be easier if she was in perfect health , and I want her to be home with us , not on some cold damn operating table when itís time to go play with Kasia , Baron , Coco ,Mafia and all the rest we have lost on here .

Iím at a total lose here .

Kadin will be heart broken , Ali is his bestest friend and he will not come in till she comes in or stands at the door and watches her till she does .

Any suggestions ? Anything Iím not seeing ? Is there a ray of hope I missed , I donít know

Doc
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post #47 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECIN View Post
Well ó- we just got back from the Vets . With not good news , I know sometimes my spelling is not the greatest , but please bare threw it as I canít see the key board for thee tears .

Our go to vet checked Ali out a little bit ago , we have seen with him for over 20 years , what he found was a growth or something that is not suppose to be there in her intestines , the size of as baseball , he pulled up the x rays from Monday and there is a area of white , right in the area he found the growth .

Doc says we need to take her to the vca and have a ultrasound done to determine if its local or attached to other intestines and maybe what we are dealing with .

If itís local then they could operate and take it out .

As most know on here , Ali girl has copper storage , Doc also said that her liver felt firm , more than a normal liver , which is probably from the first round and itís the damage left from it .

Ali also had a cancer taken off her rear leg last year ,

Miss Ali will be 12 in Oct.

And she has got Arteritis in her rear legs , poor girl has been have a harder and harder time to jump up on the couch .

Wife said she did not want to put her threw this type of operation , with her liver condition , whoís to say she would even make it threw it . I donít want to give up , Ali girl is my girl , she is laying right next to me as I type and looks up at me to check , then lays her head down .

I donít know what to do , do we take her for the ultrasound ? Or just let her live her days out here , which will be very short Iím afraid , they did give her another steroid shot to help boost her eating and sent home some cans of AD to help her .

I will be honest here , I had a gut feeling this may be what was wrong , as she has lost some weight over the last few months , I just didnít want to face the fact , and now I have it in black and white .

A operation like this on a almost 12 year dog , I just donít know , it would be easier if she was in perfect health , and I want her to be home with us , not on some cold damn operating table when itís time to go play with Kasia , Baron , Coco ,Mafia and all the rest we have lost on here .

Iím at a total lose here .

Kadin will be heart broken , Ali is his bestest friend and he will not come in till she comes in or stands at the door and watches her till she does .

Any suggestions ? Anything Iím not seeing ? Is there a ray of hope I missed , I donít know

Doc
Oh, Ken. I'm really sorry. I don't want to tell you what to do. I think you and your wife need to sit down and really think about it, and you'll know what's best for Ali. Whatever decision you make with Ali's best interest at heart will be the right one.

You are in my thoughts and prayers.


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post #48 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 03:26 PM
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Dammit, Ken....this is not what anyone wanted to hear. I'm so sorry you guys are facing this--it sounds like a tough choice with probably no right answer.
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post #49 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 03:55 PM
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Chit Kenny,

I don't care what your spelling, grammar or punctuation looks like I know that neither of us is really all right--but I also know that you'll always make the right decisions about your dogs. It's just such an unenviable place to be Ken and I know it all too well.

I also know that Ali is your girl and I know you'll make the righ decision.

Feel free to remind me of what I've said here when I face the same decisions for Toad.

I think I'll just go away and think about the dogs who have left me and those that I met on DT and have left their owners.

May they all have had great lives as long as they were here and may they all meet each other where the good dogs go (and the good cats--we wouldn't forget about you so quickly Tiki) where they are all healthy and feel well again.

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post #50 of 148 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 05:22 PM
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Aw ****. I agree with the others, whatever decision you make will be the right one. Keeping you very much in my thoughts.
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