DCM and 'Grain Free Foods' and FDA Warning - Page 2 - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums
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post #26 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-06-2018, 07:48 PM
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Insert grumbling about how hard it is to find a limited ingredient food that isn't grain free - that's what we're working on right now with Jaina (she's *very* allergic to chicken, and has a few other sensitivities). Definitely looks like I'll be finding her "something else." I know Pro Plan's not the most amazing food, but it looks like I can get a fish or lamb-based food for her that shouldn't aggravate the allergies. Might even help her coat (she's always had a patchy coat, and it's gotten worse because of the tumor she has over her thyroid. Benign, but we're going to go ahead and get it removed this winter when she has her next dental).

At least it'll help me pick out what food to transition Sora to.

Roses are grey,
Violets are grey,
Everything is grey,
Because Jaina's a dog.
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post #27 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-06-2018, 08:36 PM
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Hi zori...

Maybe I am missing something. I do feed my boys primarily a grain free very high protein kibble.... But that never stops me from adding what ever I want to each meal. It's not too difficult. In fact I enjoy making my boys' meals "complete".

Personally, I can't remember the last time I just laid down a bowl of Acana or Orijen, which is their main source of nutrition.

One can "customize" any meal, whether it is more fiber, more probiotics, grain, fruit, vegetables, rice, potatoes, fresh meat or fish, etc.



I get a kick out of customizing my boys' meals.

I like it... They like it too.

John
Portland OR
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post #28 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-07-2018, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorianak View Post
Insert grumbling about how hard it is to find a limited ingredient food that isn't grain free - that's what we're working on right now with Jaina (she's *very* allergic to chicken, and has a few other sensitivities). Definitely looks like I'll be finding her "something else." I know Pro Plan's not the most amazing food, but it looks like I can get a fish or lamb-based food for her that shouldn't aggravate the allergies. Might even help her coat (she's always had a patchy coat, and it's gotten worse because of the tumor she has over her thyroid. Benign, but we're going to go ahead and get it removed this winter when she has her next dental).

At least it'll help me pick out what food to transition Sora to.
I know tons of dogs that do great on Proplan. I wouldn't hesitate to feed it.


DSC_0133
by Shanoa Delta, on Flickr

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Glengate's Mountain Fortress CAA L1V NW1 L1I L1E L1C NW2 L2V L2I ACT1 RATI WAC
& Sirai's Golden Masquerade NW1 L1C L1V NW2 RATI SOG WAC
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What you do makes a difference, and you have to decide what kind of difference you want to make.”
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post #29 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 10:42 AM
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My thoughts exactly. This study does not show a link between grain free food and DCM, it suggest a correlation from a very limited sample population. The study clearly says no causal relationship has been established, more study is needed. But the way it was reported by the corporate media I immediately had the cynical thought this is propaganda by the major cheap dog food manufacturers, who sell feed grain based feeds.
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post #30 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 10:44 AM
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Grain free dog food IS a marketing gold mine for many dog food manufacturers in response to skin problems from food allergies. It seems logical that wild dogs did not evolve eating grains, its not a food they are adapted to. On the other hand, they did not eat sweet potatoes and peas in the ancient past either, and these are the carbohydrate base of many grain free dog foods.

I spent a fortune over the past years on Earthborn Coastal Catch and Primitive grain free dog food for my dobes. Their skin itching was not, as it turns out, from food allergies but from living in a tropical climate the first four years of their lives. Their 'allergies" went away completely when we moved to a drier climate.

I don’t think that grain free or grain based is the issue. What matters is the quality of the food in the bag. Remember, dog food began as a marketing solution to the costs imposed on multinational corporations by the prohibition against selling moldy, expired, and spoiled vegetables and meat for human consumption. Instead they created dog food and marketed it as something good for your dog. Nothing has changed. In fact, it has gotten worse. Nowadays all those vitamins and supplemental goodies in the dog food, which the manufacturers claim is there to help your dog grow and live a healthier life, are synthetic. Many, like vitamin E, are actually produced from petrochemicals, they are not natural. These synthetic supplements are now coming under suspicion of being carcinogenic, too. And this on top of the carcinogenic properties of moldy grains due to aflatoxin.

A whole industry has been built around perceived differences in dog food quality. For example, look at:
Dog Food Analysis - Reviews of kibble
https://www.whole-dog-journal.com
You will see that Eukanuba has a very bad reputation among those who evaluate dog food its quality. But I don’t believe the brand of dog food really matters except, perhaps at the extreme end of the quality scale. The real question is, does feeding your dog processed food with a three year shelf life improve or diminish the health of your dog? (Or you, for that matter, in the case of people food). I think we all know the answer to this on an intuitive level, at least. Yet we continue buying processed dog food because it is convenient. We like the reassurance given to us by marketers that we are feeding our dogs healthfully right out of a bag. But is it true?

Personally, going forward, I just replicate the ingredients in the “healthy” dog food in real, fresh form, which will reduce my cost by 60%, and the dog will be happier and I hope healthier. Throw in some bones once in awhile, and all should be good. It’s more work, but isn’t a Dobe worth it?
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post #31 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenroberto View Post
My thoughts exactly. This study does not show a link between grain free food and DCM, it suggest a correlation from a very limited sample population. The study clearly says no causal relationship has been established, more study is needed. But the way it was reported by the corporate media I immediately had the cynical thought this is propaganda by the major cheap dog food manufacturers, who sell feed grain based feeds.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenroberto View Post
Grain free dog food IS a marketing gold mine for many dog food manufacturers in response to skin problems from food allergies. It seems logical that wild dogs did not evolve eating grains, its not a food they are adapted to. On the other hand, they did not eat sweet potatoes and peas in the ancient past either, and these are the carbohydrate base of many grain free dog foods.

I spent a fortune over the past years on Earthborn Coastal Catch and Primitive grain free dog food for my dobes. Their skin itching was not, as it turns out, from food allergies but from living in a tropical climate the first four years of their lives. Their 'allergies" went away completely when we moved to a drier climate.

I don’t think that grain free or grain based is the issue. What matters is the quality of the food in the bag. Remember, dog food began as a marketing solution to the costs imposed on multinational corporations by the prohibition against selling moldy, expired, and spoiled vegetables and meat for human consumption. Instead they created dog food and marketed it as something good for your dog. Nothing has changed. In fact, it has gotten worse. Nowadays all those vitamins and supplemental goodies in the dog food, which the manufacturers claim is there to help your dog grow and live a healthier life, are synthetic. Many, like vitamin E, are actually produced from petrochemicals, they are not natural. These synthetic supplements are now coming under suspicion of being carcinogenic, too. And this on top of the carcinogenic properties of moldy grains due to aflatoxin.

A whole industry has been built around perceived differences in dog food quality. For example, look at:
Dog Food Analysis - Reviews of kibble
https://www.whole-dog-journal.com
You will see that Eukanuba has a very bad reputation among those who evaluate dog food its quality. But I don’t believe the brand of dog food really matters except, perhaps at the extreme end of the quality scale. The real question is, does feeding your dog processed food with a three year shelf life improve or diminish the health of your dog? (Or you, for that matter, in the case of people food). I think we all know the answer to this on an intuitive level, at least. Yet we continue buying processed dog food because it is convenient. We like the reassurance given to us by marketers that we are feeding our dogs healthfully right out of a bag. But is it true?

Personally, going forward, I just replicate the ingredients in the “healthy” dog food in real, fresh form, which will reduce my cost by 60%, and the dog will be happier and I hope healthier. Throw in some bones once in awhile, and all should be good. It’s more work, but isn’t a Dobe worth it?
Are you a qualified dog food nutritionist? PhD? Veterinarian?


DSC_0133
by Shanoa Delta, on Flickr

Richter & Sypha
Glengate's Mountain Fortress CAA L1V NW1 L1I L1E L1C NW2 L2V L2I ACT1 RATI WAC
& Sirai's Golden Masquerade NW1 L1C L1V NW2 RATI SOG WAC
“You cannot get through a single day without having an impact on the world around you.
What you do makes a difference, and you have to decide what kind of difference you want to make.”
― Jane Goodall
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post #32 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 12:41 PM
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I did the same. a base of good quality dog food then add all kinds of fun things for them. Salmon skin, carrot juice, blueberries (they loved to eat those frozen, ha ha), bananas, fried eggs, apples, coconut, blueberry buckwheat pancakes, sweet potatoes, you name it. Dobes are such chowhounds!


Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4bike ped View Post
Hi zori...

Maybe I am missing something. I do feed my boys primarily a grain free very high protein kibble.... But that never stops me from adding what ever I want to each meal. It's not too difficult. In fact I enjoy making my boys' meals "complete".

Personally, I can't remember the last time I just laid down a bowl of Acana or Orijen, which is their main source of nutrition.

One can "customize" any meal, whether it is more fiber, more probiotics, grain, fruit, vegetables, rice, potatoes, fresh meat or fish, etc.



I get a kick out of customizing my boys' meals.

I like it... They like it too.

John
Portland OR
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