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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-02-2015, 10:57 AM Thread Starter
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Doberman male hair loss - Help!

Hi, I have a 2.5 year old doberman male. Since he turned 1 years old, he has been having skin issues. It started with hair loss and dry skin. I took him to the vet at the time and he was diagnosed with demodex. I had it cured and his skin was better. However, early this May, I noticed that his hair was very thin. I took him to the vet again and they prescribed fish oil and vitamins which was helping for about a month. However, in the last several months, his hair has been getting thinner. I can see bold spots under his ears and on his thighs. I went to the vet and he did not know the cause. He said I need to monitor and document what changes I make so I can figure out the problem. He gave me some antibiotics and alergy medicine but it did not help.

I do not know what else to do! I do not want him to be bold especially when it is about to get cold outside.

Any advice or suggestions are greatly appreciated. Alyona
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-02-2015, 11:06 AM
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What color is your dobe? Blues and fawns especially can have troubles with thinning coats.

Thyroid problems can lead to a thinning coat, as can allergies.

Skin problems can be a bear to figure out. Do you have access to a dermatology specialist? Or the specialists at a vet school? That might be your best bet for finding out how to proceed from here.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-02-2015, 11:07 AM
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Sounds frustrating. Couple of questions. Number 1) what color is he, and number 2) has he had a complete thyroid panel run?


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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-02-2015, 04:06 PM
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Meds?.. Certain medications can cause serious hair thinning. Our oldest, due to a life long use of Predisone, exhibited a continuing hair loss/hair thinning. The Pred was absolutely necessary for his physical well being. His hair loss was strictly a cosmetic issue, so it was back burnered. When a substitute steroid became available, we started using it. His hair started thickening and filling in immediately.

Per Melbrod: "Thyroid problems can lead to a thinning coat, as can allergies."

Edit: You should definitely ask your vet to do a thyroid panel as was also suggested above.
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-04-2015, 03:08 AM
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Color Dilution Alopecia | Dermatology for Animals - Part 1

(If he's blue or fawn.)




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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-04-2015, 12:54 PM
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Balding doberman

I rescued my first 'FAWN" Dobie (4 yrs) about 2 years ago, with brittle, thining coat, and dry flakey skin just about all over. I never experienced this prob with the blacks and reds (liver), neutered, spayed, raised from 8 weeks or rescued. Obviously, some had better coats than others. Apparently FAWNS & SILVERS have this type of problem because they are truly genetic rejects - not to say they are less lovable, loyal, or protective. After all the blood work (normal), the special shampoos & conditioners, vitamins, etc I finally discovered a combination treatment of: HALO, VitaGlo Dream Coat (Meal Enhancement with pure oils for healthy skin . . .) and PROZYME all Natural Enzyme Supplement powder(alph-amylase - aspergillus oryzae, cellulase - aspergilus niger, liase - aspergillus niger and bromelain - pineapples, stem, fruit). Alone each product helps somewhat but together, he finally has more HAIR!! The new growth is somewhat softer (more normal) and much darker. Hair around the head, neck, chest (lion mane) is very thick (normalish) while the hair on his back and flanks are slowly filling in. His legs have always had a normal amount of hair. THIS HAS NOT BEEN A QUICK FIX. Found the best price on internet for HALO 16 oz at Vitacost $14 and 4# PROZYME powder at Entirely Pets $92, 7 oz bottle about $20. FYI - not affiliated with any of these companies/products. Can send more info about PROZYME from published vet if you want. GOOD LUCK
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-04-2015, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LYNN* View Post
I rescued my first 'FAWN" Dobie (4 yrs) about 2 years ago, with brittle, thining coat, and dry flakey skin just about all over. I never experienced this prob with the blacks and reds (liver), neutered, spayed, raised from 8 weeks or rescued. Obviously, some had better coats than others. Apparently FAWNS & SILVERS have this type of problem because they are truly genetic rejects - not to say they are less lovable, loyal, or protective. After all the blood work (normal), the special shampoos & conditioners, vitamins, etc I finally discovered a combination treatment of: HALO, VitaGlo Dream Coat (Meal Enhancement with pure oils for healthy skin . . .) and PROZYME all Natural Enzyme Supplement powder(alph-amylase - aspergillus oryzae, cellulase - aspergilus niger, liase - aspergillus niger and bromelain - pineapples, stem, fruit). Alone each product helps somewhat but together, he finally has more HAIR!! The new growth is somewhat softer (more normal) and much darker. Hair around the head, neck, chest (lion mane) is very thick (normalish) while the hair on his back and flanks are slowly filling in. His legs have always had a normal amount of hair. THIS HAS NOT BEEN A QUICK FIX. Found the best price on internet for HALO 16 oz at Vitacost $14 and 4# PROZYME powder at Entirely Pets $92, 7 oz bottle about $20. FYI - not affiliated with any of these companies/products. Can send more info about PROZYME from published vet if you want. GOOD LUCK

For your information about the breed. This is not meant to be snarky, but for your education. In reference to the color and coat texture.

http://www.dpca.org/JEC/illustrated_standard-coat.htm

I will say the reason coats are bad on most dilutes(eventually) is because the hairs break off easily. This is caused by the uneven distribution of melanin along the gait shaft making it thinner in some spots. Eventually, if the hairs are broken below the skin you get cysts and hair follicle death resulting in thinning, bald patches or baldness over most of the body except the rust points which are normal in melanin.

One has to be careful and not rub the fur backwards on a dilute doberman when petting or bathing as that will break off the hair.

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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 09-04-2015, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LYNN* View Post
I rescued my first 'FAWN" Dobie (4 yrs) about 2 years ago, with brittle, thining coat, and dry flakey skin just about all over. I never experienced this prob with the blacks and reds (liver), neutered, spayed, raised from 8 weeks or rescued. Obviously, some had better coats than others. Apparently FAWNS & SILVERS have this type of problem because they are truly genetic rejects - not to say they are less lovable, loyal, or protective. After all the blood work (normal), the special shampoos & conditioners, vitamins, etc I finally discovered a combination treatment of: HALO, VitaGlo Dream Coat (Meal Enhancement with pure oils for healthy skin . . .) and PROZYME all Natural Enzyme Supplement powder(alph-amylase - aspergillus oryzae, cellulase - aspergilus niger, liase - aspergillus niger and bromelain - pineapples, stem, fruit). Alone each product helps somewhat but together, he finally has more HAIR!! The new growth is somewhat softer (more normal) and much darker. Hair around the head, neck, chest (lion mane) is very thick (normalish) while the hair on his back and flanks are slowly filling in. His legs have always had a normal amount of hair. THIS HAS NOT BEEN A QUICK FIX. Found the best price on internet for HALO 16 oz at Vitacost $14 and 4# PROZYME powder at Entirely Pets $92, 7 oz bottle about $20. FYI - not affiliated with any of these companies/products. Can send more info about PROZYME from published vet if you want. GOOD LUCK
Hi, welcome to the forum.

There are a few misconceptions in your post above.

There is no recognized "silver" or "liver" coat color in Dobermans.

They come in Black, Red, Blue, and Fawn. It's not really accurate to describe dilute Dobermans as "genetic rejects," either. There are good quality animals out there who happen to have dilute coats.

The last two of those accepted colors listed above, being dilute colors, are the ones subject to issues with hair loss.

The reason your dog kept normal coat on legs and other rust markings is--those are not areas of dilution. Hence, no color dilution alopecia in those areas.

While getting a dog healthier in general can help with any contributing factors to hair loss, such as illness or malnutrition, you can't really posit a causative effect with your supplement regimen you list.

Most anecdotal evidence with hair regrowth in CDA animals is correlated with the use of MSM, and perna, both of which are often ingredients in joint supplements. Kind of a serendipitous discovery for many who were giving supplements for joints, and noticed their dilutes regaining some coat.




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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-03-2016, 08:54 PM
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Owner of balding blue dobey; HAIR IS GROWING BACK!

PLEASE READ! (Sorry; I know it's long)...

I'm actually going to write a new post with this information because I really think it might help other people who have blue/fawns suffering from severe hair loss. *Please be advised that I am in no way, shape, or form an expert on Blue Dobermans or their various skin conditions, but I DO have lots of personal experience with CDA (a.k.a. Blue Doberman Syndrome) with my current dog.*

Background to this: I bought a blue Doberman puppy about 4 years ago, before I was ever aware of this very common skin condition that many of them suffer from. I had done research on the breed in general, but I didn't suspect that the color would have any significance to anything. Of course, there are many reasons that all breeds of dogs can experience thinning coats or total hair loss (including the already mentioned thyroid problems, etc) but when I took my dog to the vet for his shots, coincidentally this veterinarian had EXTENSIVE experience with blue/fawn dobermans and used to breed them. He informed me of all the problems that I may start noticing as my dog ages and he recommended bringing him if I notice him getting itchy dry patches, losing hair, red bumpy pustules on his body, etc...well sure enough, my poor dog had all of the above. CONSTANT itchy dry skin...losing hair at a pretty slow rate, but it was still noticeably getting thinner and thinner. My vet ran all the tests on him to exclude all other possible reasons for this, but he concluded it was just the genetic disorder...there was nothing I could do for him besides try to make the rest of his "doggy-days" as comfortable and itch-free as possible. this was really upsetting to me because A) he was a beautiful dog, B) the food I had him on for his coat was really expensive, C) I'd just never had to deal with this much maintenance on one animal ever before, and it was turning out to be a LOT of additional work all to just slow the process of the inevitable. The extra cleaning, the special shampoos, the medicated sprays to help his itching, the bathing regimens, the special food, the supplements, the extra vet visits and Rx medicine I had to buy cause he was prone to skin infections (and he got a lot of them).
Eventually he lost ALL of his hair on his stomach, back, and hind-quarters. He was pretty much bald except for his head and legs. It became a regular thing to start putting sunscreen on him if he was going to be outside for a while because otherwise he would get a really bad sunburn. I'd have to put clothes on him when it got cold cause the poor guy had no hair to keep him kind of warm...he was a mess. So I started doing some really in depth research on just hair loss in general hoping to find some sort of new study that would give me some answers and him some relief. But I could find nothing that was specific to blue Dobermans or anything like that. But here's what I found that I decided to try, and HERE'S WHAT CAME OF IT!

FINALLY FOR THE GOOD PART:
I read that melatonin is used in all sorts of hair loss in people and animals and it is proven to be affective in regrowing hair! (There was a study done on dogs with CDA but the study did not have great results)...but I decided to try it anyway. It couldn't hurt! The things I have done differently within the last 2 months are:

I still use his regular oatmeal shampoo and I also started using Mane & Tail Conditioner. I wash him once a week, twice with shampoo and once with the conditioner. I also bought a large soft-bristled brush that I scrub him down with during his baths to really get all the dirt out of his skin and remaining fur. (You'd be surprised how much dirt is still on a hairless dog even after a regular hand wash)...THEN, (y'all are going to think I'm crazy, but someone told me to do this and it seems to make his skin retain moisture MUCH better) I swipe the water off his back and spray it with a little bit of WD-40 (yes...like the stuff for squeaky hinges)...I thought it was crazy too but someone assured me it would not hurt my dog and to test it on a small area to make sure he wasn't allergic or something. And I use the large brush to then kind of spread that around on the areas with no fur, and finish it up with a good rinsing. His skin is SO MUCH softer and not NEAR as dry. It stays pretty well moisturizer until about the 5th day. Then I can start seeing it dry out again.

FOR HIS FOOD:
I have him on just Purina One for right now because the place I used to get his special food is no longer there. But for about 4 months he's been on Purina and he's doing fine. Anyway, I mix in a couple 3mg tablets of Melatonin supplements in the dry food, and poke holes in 2 fish oil capsules and squeeze that all over the top. He loves it, and for whatever reason, his hair is finally actually growing back!! I can't believe it! I have included before and after pictures. I honestly think it the melatonin that is helping but I'm not 100%. I'm not researcher or specialist but I just hope that if anyone else has had these problems with their blue dobey, maybe this will make a difference is y'alls life too.

People who had seen him bald are amazed at how much better he looks now. My neighbor's have commented on it, my parents, friends, etc. it really is a HUGE difference. So I'm going to keep doing exactly what I've been doing and keep my fingers crossed that the progress continues. I hope I didn't put you to sleep through all of that lol!





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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2017, 04:58 PM
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im with Dxeodll .....Kobi is 3 years old losing hair on his back 2 visits to vet nothing yet stopped dandruff now hes on 24 mg melatonin, 1 ts wesson veg oil with dinner 2 weeks now hair stopped falling out ....waiting on regrowth
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2017, 08:32 PM
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Don't forget to have full thyroid panel sent out to reputable lab like Michigan State; in-house panels are notoriously poor quality and often inaccurate. Dobermans suffer from a very high incidence of hypothyroidism. A low-normal T4 is not normal for most Dobermans! Can't emphasize this enough. Anytime either of my last two males' Numbers were in the low normal or below normal range, they had serious coat issues such as infections, dandruff, and thinning. Don't assume that color related alopecia is the whole story with a Doberman! Hypothyroidism has very negative effects on the entire body if left untreated.

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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2017, 02:57 PM
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I have read that blues and fawns may not be shown in Germany.
I have also read that 75 % or reds and 90% of blues with color dilution experience alopecia.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-18-2017, 08:46 PM
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Reds don’t have problems with CDA--but blues and fawns do. I don’t know about the percentages you quote, but the number which have problems is quite high.

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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-19-2017, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AxelDeutsch View Post
I have read that blues and fawns may not be shown in Germany.
I have also read that 75 % or reds and 90% of blues with color dilution experience alopecia.
Germany used to recognise black, brown (what AKC calls red), and blue; they never recognised fawn as an acceptable color so fawn has never been shown in Germany. About 15 or 20 years ago the FCI standard (Germany--the standard set and recognised as "country of origin) did some fairly major standard changes. One was to make blue a disallowed color. So it's true that blue and fawn can not be shown in Germany or in any other country which is governed by FCI rules.

Your information is incorrect about color dilution alopecia affecting 75% of reds and 90% of blacks. The percentages you quote are those (or approximately those) which appear in most older veterinary texts as the percentages of fawns and blues which are generally affected by CDA. But that may have been a typo in your post. As far as those percentages go they are from a fairly old study done by a vet dermatologist--the problem with it is that more fawns and blues with CDA would probably have been seen by a dermatologist. There was no control group of Dobes for comparson and while most fawns and blues will exhibit some degree of CDA how much hair loss any individual dog may show can range from virtualy none to nearly bald. Blues commonly are more severely affected by CDA than fawns.

While there are a variety of skin/coat problems that may affect reds and blacks CDA is not one of them--it specifically affects ONLY dilute colors.

You may see erroneous information that claims that reds or blacks carrying one gene for dilution will be affected by CDA--it's not true.

Last edited by dobebug; 04-19-2017 at 03:04 PM.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-26-2020, 08:30 AM
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Smile little hair

Hello i bought a dobermann puppy and he don’t have a lot of chest hair.Is that a problem?I heard that it is normal for some puppys.Sorry if i did’t write good.
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post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-27-2020, 06:25 PM
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I answered this yesterday but evidently DT lost it somewhere.

Let me just try again.

Most young puppies have thin hair on the chest, bottom of the sternum and on the areas of the belly which are normally hair covered in adult dogs.

If your puppy is young and fawn or blue it is probably just the fact that ALL puppies tend to have thin hair in the areas mentioned above--it gets thicker as they grow up.

Also very young fawns and blue typically have coats that are fine--the CDA which often causes hair loss in adults usually doesn't start to show up earlier that 18 months to 2 years so if your puppy is fawn or blue and very young it doesn't mean much since all baby puppies have thin hair in some areas.

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