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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 01:07 AM Thread Starter
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Question 5 1/2 year old doberman female with incontinence

My dobe was spayed at almost 3 years old and she's had urinary incontinence problems since about 6 months out. In 8/11 she developed an open pyrometria, it was treated and went away. In spring '12 we tried again for puppies and after 1 1/2 years of trying and multiple 4 hour (one way) trips to the vet college with both dogs, she was pregnant. At 6 weeks the vet saw signs that her pyrometria infection had come back on the ultrasound but she wasn't showing any signs of being sick (no elevated white blood count) so we waited to see if she could keep the pregnancy long enough to save the puppies. A week later she went septic in a matter of hours (high fever, dehydration), lost both puppies, and had to have an emergency spay.

Anyway, that's why she was spayed later. I'm at a loss as to help her now, she has been on 4 400mg corn silk capsules daily since she started dribbling in her sleep. For a year or so that was enough to keep her from having any problems, but for the last few weeks she's gone up to taking 4 550mg capsules and it isn't helping. I've had to keep a kids mattress pad on the end of my bed so she doesn't soak it. She still only has accidents in her sleep so I know it isn't a behavior problem. She doesn't have a fever and isn't drinking more than usual so I don't know what to do next. She had an unexplained high white blood cell count that was literally off the chart a few months ago. My regular vet put her on antibiotics for 2 weeks and she was fine, still have no idea what caused it though.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 02:01 AM
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DES

Some people say it's old school, but IT WORKS. Talk to your vet. Google it. At the dosages used to control incontinence there is very little risk of side effects.

My Greta was on it for years, it totally controlled her incontinence. For a few years she only had to take one pill a week. Then we had to increase to one pill every third day. She never had any side effects or problems from it. And she lived her life free of incontinence.

I wanted something that worked, no fooling around, and the main reason was the look on her face when she'd wake up and had leaked on the bed. I wanted her to maintain her dignity, and luckily I also had a smart vet who recommended DES...old school or not. It worked.
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 06:05 AM
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Mishka has had the problem for over 2 years.

Mishka has the same problems as your girl. She cannot hold her bladder and she used to pee herself whilst she slept or whilst she was laying down resting. The look on her face when she woke up and looked at me still brings a tear to my eye. I could tell she was embarassed and and unsure of what had happened. It got to the point that she would pee outside but anytime she came in the house and laid down she would potentially pee herself if she needed to go.

The vet offered 2 solutions.

1. Propalin or tablets
2. Operation that in 90% of cases fixes the problem but then you can potentially run into he same problem with the bowels and not being able to hold it in.

We skipped the tablets and went to Propalin in liquid/syrup form. We have her down to about 0.3ml each meal twice a day and this has worked for her for 2 years. No peeing.

I don't know if the treatment is available over there, it is Australia, but from what i have heard and read there guaranteed solutions for you over there.

Cheers

Lee
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 06:51 AM
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I also had good luck with DES with a bitch that started leading at age 7 after being spayed at age 2 1/2 (was never bred). Was able to maintain her on one pill a week for about a year and then had to do a couple a week after that. The initial dose is higher but then you wean them down.

I also had a bitch on Proin for about 7 years - and that worked good too.

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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 10:57 AM
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I've had success with DES as well as Proin tabs.
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 01:05 PM
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My girl has spay incontinence. The best way to mitigate it is an empty bladder. This does not mean you deprive them of water. I trained Jasmine to potty on command so she will empty her bladder, versus getting distracted and stopping. My vet showed me how to feel to see if she has an empty bladder or if she is full, so she can't trick me!

I also have her on a good potty schedule for her and my schedule. She also gets one late night potty, and (ugh) 1 super late in the middle of the night potty. I would love to go without the super late one, but you do what you have to for your fur kids!

Jasmine is not on any medication. I realize that all dogs are different, but there are options for maintaining the issue.



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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 01:56 PM
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We've used human grade soy isoflavones 750mg once a day for years with great success and zero side effects. I like Puritans Pride because they consistently test well by independent labs and are pretty reasonably priced. Soy has also been shown to increase insulin sensitivity in diabetics and lower cholesterol in some preliminary studies.

We've used DES in the past and had dogs come to us on that who did ok too. We've also changed them over to the soy supplement with equal 100% control.

Never used Proin due to suggested side effects of stroke, irritability, etc.
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 01:57 PM
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Frequent walking to keep the bladder empty helps too!
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 05:17 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you all so much, I will look into the soy supplements. I'm not sure about using the hormone drugs, I don't want to risk causing more problems for her, other than this she's completely healthy. We live on a farm so she gets the run of the place and is in and out all day. She doesn't drip as much if I stick her outside to potty around midnight when I got to bed, but there's still a little spot when she gets up.
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-21-2014, 12:09 AM
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Bailey is 14 1/2 and has had spay incontinence for about 11 years. She was on Proin until this last month. We were at the highest dosage and the leaking was getting worse. We tried Incurin but after 7 days she had an adverse reaction so we stopped the medication. She is on day 5 of DES and I fear she maybe having the same adverse reaction as she had on Incurin. I will know for sure in a couple of days. If this is the case, we can try a combination of DES and Proin. In the past, we tried corn silk without success. The only thing it did was kill the grass.

I've heard that many dogs have been helped by Incurin and DES. I would suggest doing some research and talking to your vet about the options. Proin worked for Bailey for over ten years. Good luck with your girl.
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-21-2014, 12:04 PM
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I've been using a natural product through my homeopathic vet called "Incontinence". Main ingredient is wild yam. It took about 3 weeks to have no accidents but it is working. Cheers began to have this problem during and after high doses of Prednisone. She very rarely has wet bedding now.
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-21-2014, 12:11 PM
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It took a week or less for the soy isoflavones to work perfectly in our current female if I remember correctly.
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 02-21-2014, 02:02 PM
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I have used DES on my 2nd girl with no problems. Roxy now uses Proin for about 6 yrs. One pill a day with no problems
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