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post #1 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 03:42 PM Thread Starter
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Hello Everyone, This is my first post on this Forum but I have been reading other posts and feel that my experience may be helpful to others who come across this breeder or even enlighten them from the mistakes we made in trusting that everyone in the World is truthful and honorable. (sorry for the length)

In early May, I contacted Olivia Harvey (RM Dobermans) through her Ad on Kijiji about the upcoming litter in June. We wanted a black and tan purebred registered Doberman and she told me that if I sent her $1,000 deposit, we would get first pick of the litter. So I sent her an e-transfer. I asked when we could come down and see the mom (Lazy Daisy) and dad (War Cloud) (apparently the Dad was from a breeder in Florida so it was unclear if he was still there or not …….. at least that’s what she said). Every time I contacted her inquiring to come to see the kennel, meet her and see the mom, she had excuses of why we couldn’t. First it was a bridal shower she had to attend, then a wedding. Whenever I text her it was at least 2 days before I had a response – sometimes there was no response and I had to text again. From a client/customer’s perspective, for $3000 Dog ($1,000 deposit already given), I would like to have updates and pictures at the very least if we are unable to physically be there. According to Olivia, the puppies were born on June 3. Out of a litter of 10, there was only 1 female and on a phone call she told me that she gets first pick of the females in a litter. I asked what that meant for us. She said that she had another Doberman (Pearl of the Sea – she is on the website but there is no picture of her nor is there any pedigree information) that had a litter at the same time – it was a litter of 5, with 2 females. She said out of the 3 females from both litters, she will pick one and we get the second pick. I asked when we would be able to meet them and pick and she said not until after they are weaned at about 5 weeks. So we waited patiently and asked that she sends us pictures. We did get a couple of pictures and a very grainy video once but that is it. When the 5 weeks were up, we text again and asked when we can come down. After a couple of days, she text back that she is in the States working and she would have to check with her husband because they were very busy. My initial thought was, if you are never home and you have two litters of puppies – who is looking after the dogs???

Her website hasn’t been updated and continues to say that a litter is due May 15, 2019 (that should have been my first clue since the dates she told us about the litter didn’t match the date she’s advertising on her website). I called the Canadian Kennel Club was advised that Olivia Harvey is a Member but her membership is on hold due to financial issues and therefore can not register any puppies. The person I spoke to at CKC said that there is no record of expecting litters from her. I wish I would have known this information sooner and that’s on me for not doing due diligence.

After considering all we went through to this point and STILL have not seen the dogs nor met Olivia, I text her on Monday, July 22 to say that we have changed our mind about taking a dog from her. I explained that we contacted CKC and was told that due to financial issues, she was unable to register puppies at this time and that is contradicting on what we agreed to. And the fact that she seemed to have every excuse not to allow us to meet her or the dogs didn’t leave us with a comfortable feeling. She immediately responded saying the deposit is non-refundable and both her and her husband have full time jobs PLUS hours every week, they have kids and are very busy. Which again, my initial thought was – who is looking after the dogs??? She also chastised me for contacting the CKC and inquiring about her – she said I had no right to do that. I told her that I should have done it in the beginning and if someone is spending $3000 for a purebred registered puppy, it is their right to do due diligence (which I take full responsibility for because I didn’t do it in the beginning). She continues to refuse to give us back the deposit and has said the puppy is ready for us to pick up on July 30, with the balance owing and to let her know what we want to do. On August 8 I text her to ask about our puppy (knowing full well the either there was never a litter or we were never getting our money back but I want her to know it is NOT alright to play games like this). She responded that the puppy has been placed in a different home because we forfeited the deposit, which is not true – she wouldn’t give us back our deposit, we never said we forfeited it. We now accept that we will never get the deposit back and my husband did text her to clearly describe how we feel about her and what she did to us – in which she responded that she is calling the OPP and her lawyer – we would welcome that 100%. We have decided to take our experience to this forum in hopes that no one else is as naďve and gullible when it comes to RM Doberman. We take full responsibilities for our actions or lack of due diligence and I truly wish I would have found this Forum and the threads about her as well as gone to the Better Business Bureau and found the complaints against her BEFORE ever getting involved with her. She claims she has another litter coming due this Winter (again, we don’t know if it’s a real litter or a ghost litter) so buyers beware!
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post #2 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 07:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurie Riley View Post
I called the Canadian Kennel Club was advised that Olivia Harvey is a Member but her membership is on hold due to financial issues and therefore can not register any puppies. The person I spoke to at CKC said that there is no record of expecting litters from her.
I am not defending the breeder at all - it wouldn't be my choice of a breeder. However, the CKC has no way of knowing who is expecting litters. We do not have to inform them of that! When a litter is born, then we send in a litter registration application. After the litter as a whole is registered, and the puppies head off to their new homes, we then are responsible to individually register each puppy for their owners.

That said, given the timeline you are providing, one would expect that a litter born in June would more than likely have been registered as a whole by this time. Then I guess the CKC would know there IS a litter, and is then expecting individual applications later. With privacy laws in Ontario and Canada, in general, I find it really odd that the CKC would tell someone that a breeder's membership is questionable due to financial issues. We used to be able to send in our litter and individual registration applications and be billed later but, as I understand it, the CKC is all pay-as-you-go now so any registrations sent would have to include payment. If there is a problem with her membership, I would assume the puppies could still be registered as a non-member at the higher rate.

Anyway ... maybe spend some time on this resource to help find a better breeder.
https://glengate.webs.com/buyingguide.htm

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post #3 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryAndDobes View Post
I am not defending the breeder at all - it wouldn't be my choice of a breeder. However, the CKC has no way of knowing who is expecting litters. We do not have to inform them of that! When a litter is born, then we send in a litter registration application. After the litter as a whole is registered, and the puppies head off to their new homes, we then are responsible to individually register each puppy for their owners.

That said, given the timeline you are providing, one would expect that a litter born in June would more than likely have been registered as a whole by this time. Then I guess the CKC would know there IS a litter, and is then expecting individual applications later. With privacy laws in Ontario and Canada, in general, I find it really odd that the CKC would tell someone that a breeder's membership is questionable due to financial issues. We used to be able to send in our litter and individual registration applications and be billed later but, as I understand it, the CKC is all pay-as-you-go now so any registrations sent would have to include payment. If there is a problem with her membership, I would assume the puppies could still be registered as a non-member at the higher rate.

Anyway ... maybe spend some time on this resource to help find a better breeder.
https://glengate.webs.com/buyingguide.htm
Having been dealing myself with the CKC for the past 4 months both on my behalf and the behalf of others, I can say they are nothing if not inconsistent. Some people you get on the phone will not even tell you if a member is in good standing or not, let alone why - meanwhile I got one person on the phone who confirmed x member was not in good standing, and since which date. She didn't tell me why but then again I didn't ask why.

For the membership it depends on whether she is simply not in good standing, or if she is also suspended. If she is suspended then she cannot register dogs, cannot sign any document (co-ownership, change of ownership, cancellation of non-breeding etc.) or participate in any CKC activities except as a spectator. Or, that's what I was told last time I was on the phone with them. (Trying to figure out why this one breeder had two unregistered litters on the ground born in spring of 2018 and fall of 2018... as of spring 2019)
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post #4 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 03:15 PM
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Well, I can comment that she was still in decent standing at the end of March, since Olivia took 5 months after shipping Lois to us to finally get around to getting her registered in our names. And then I phoned the CKC to confirm that the document was genuine and ownership had been transferred. So I'm thinking whatever happened took place after that.
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