BEWARE RIESIG KENNELS - Maricopa, AZ - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums
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post #1 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-12-2014, 09:45 PM Thread Starter
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BEWARE RIESIG KENNELS - Maricopa, AZ

Hello All:

I recently started looking for my first Doberman; I am a Rott person but wanted a Doberman. I spent a lot of time researching what to look for. Even though the Doberman was created using some of the Rott genes and they are similar in their personalities, I know that the energy level of a Dobe is over the top compared to the Rotts.

I found a breeder in my state, AZ., and sent her an email inquiring about a litter she was expecting soon. This is exactly what I was looking for; the reason isn't important. She required a deposit and then more money after the pups were born, and the remainder of the balance when I picked up the puppy; total price = $700.00

She emailed me a five-page "Contract and Warranty." It didn't say much about the testing and stuff this forum talks about reputable breeders doing. No X-rays, just a guarantee that the pup wouldn't die of Parvo for 14 days after I picked him up. Absolutely NO deposits would be refunded, for any reason. Your deposit would be applied towards another pup from another litter. Her contract also said she had 2 years to replace a lost pup. 2 years?!!?? The very last line of the contract says, "All dogs and puppies are sold without papers!" If the breeder has purebred dogs why wouldn't they have papers? She lists four or five different breeds she sells, including Rotts. She recently posted pics of 15-day-old Rott pups, "Available for deposit," and they were filthy-looking.

She only wants to communicate via text or email; severely shied away from land-line phone calls

In my desperation to have a pup from that litter I sent the deposit and signed her contract. I had read it thoroughly and found the loop holes necessary to get out of it should it come to that.

Three days after she got my deposit I got three text messages, one right after the other. Telling me that the bitch had "absorbed" her eggs and it was actually a "phantom" pregnancy!!! Then she started texting me photos of the supposed bitch showing milk and that her abdomen had returned to its normal size. BS! I say. She was, however, willing to refund my deposit. Must have been something in my tone of voice that convinced her I wasn't stupid. I bred Rotts for years and do know a little about it. She told me she would put my deposit in the mail on that very same day, Mon Dec 1st. I had sent a money order and she said she hadn't cashed it yet and would just return the MO. Mail from her address takes one day to get to my address; we both live in AZ. Tues. no MO; Wed. no MO; Thurs. no MO. Contacted her about it and she said it was taking longer because she sent it certified..I say again; BS!! She then stated that she had never told me she would send out my MO on the 1st. I sent her a copy of her email where she said it. The string of lies got longer and longer. I did get my MO back and a valuable lesson.

Regards,

L4T

Beware this breeder; Von Riesig Kennels, Maricopa, AZ.; Emily Tiscarenio

Last edited by dax0402; 12-13-2014 at 07:17 AM.
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post #2 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-12-2014, 11:18 PM
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Sad story.

Buyer beware.

Always do a lot of research on HERE when looking for a breeder.
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post #3 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 05:40 AM Thread Starter
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That is why I signed up at this forum. After reading many of the posts it was obvious that the people here are very serious about this breed and protecting it.

L4T
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post #4 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 06:13 AM
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The total price of $700.00 should have been enough of a clue to stay away.
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post #5 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 06:26 AM
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^^^this and the fact that she's breeding multiple breeds, has a wonky 5 page contract.

OP, titles, testing...these are important! Please run your next breeder potential by members here before sending any money.
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post #6 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 06:41 AM
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Hmm, sorry that you had to go through that ordeal, and thank you for sharing your story. I think you can probably do MUCH better in choosing a responsible Doberman breeder. Welcome to Dobermantalk and enjoy your stay; you should find a lot of worthwhile information here.

I think you will find that the Doberman temperament is actually quite different from that of the Rottweiler. Dobermans are often (and affectionately) described as being a particularly "unique combination of pushy and sensitive." Not everyone realizes that, going in as someone new to the breed...

Dobermans (like Rotts) require a confident handler, and I put great emphasis on the importance of early, consistent training using a positive, reward-based approach. They rarely learn much of anything using adverse training methods; some will shut down completely, in response to harsh corrections or force.

My own Doberman is a little bit on the "needy" side, and much less independent than any of the Rottweilers I've ever known. Whenever someone asks me why I chose a Doberman, I tell them that I wanted a short-haired, muscular and athletic, highly intelligent and trainable dog, that was into me.... aaaand then I tell them to be careful what they wish for.

Seriously though, I love this breed, and I love love love my boy!

One last thing for now... and I apologize for being nit-picky and a little off topic... but, from my understanding of Doberman breed history, no true "Rottweiler genes" went into creating the Doberman. I think it's more plausible that the Doberman and Rottweiler share some common ancestry, with some of the earliest foundation dogs being of similar type; however, each breed emerged independently, around roughly the same time.

Most of the resources I'm familiar with, describe the earliest Doberman-type dogs as crosses of Thuringen Shepherd (Old German Shepherd-type), Butchers' dogs (Shepherd-type crossed with Molosser-type) and of course, the Old German Pinscher-type dogs. There were no true purebreds used; Herr Louis Doberman used "mutts," and kept no records of breeding, hence the use of the term, "type."

I speculate that the "Butchers' dogs" may be common ancestor to both the modern Rottweiler and Doberman. This may very well be what you were meaning.

Photo of a "Butchers' Dog" - taken from Blitzkrieger Kennel website:






"I will lend to you for awhile, a Doberman pup," God said...
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post #7 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 07:29 AM
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OP, I looked at the kennel website. These people do a lot of cross breeding (pitweilers)

Not sure why their dogs aren't AKC registered, but maybe because they never purchased the breeding rights to these dogs in the first place.

They are selling a senior FM for $200, or free with the purchase of a puppy. And many more unscrupulous things, IMO.

Thank you for pointing this greeder out. Now when anyone googles them, your post will come to the surface.
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post #8 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 08:07 AM
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Are u wanting a pet and will it be neutered ?

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post #9 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 09:44 AM
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Well, this pretty much tells you everything you need to know about this kennel. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...81828268,d.eXY as does their website. http://www.puppyfind.com/redirect/?a..._id=x9629omxav


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post #10 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 09:48 AM
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I'm glad you were able to get out of the contract and get your money back! Welcome to DT.

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post #11 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 11:18 AM
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As for funky contracts, the breeder I most recently dealt with said that "six lawyers" had looked at her sales contract. I thought it more likely that Weird Al wrote a song about it.

I recognized it as a free download created by a paralegal with no language skills.

Definitely search on this forum before considering any breeder. I wish I had.



Ain't no scritches when she's gone. . . . but at least the furnace is on.
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post #12 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosemary View Post
Well, this pretty much tells you everything you need to know about this kennel. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...81828268,d.eXY as does their website. Elite K9 Kennels trained protection dogs, police K9, rottweiler pups, studs
Oh no... oh NO!

I wish I had not looked

Only $3000 for the Tosa Inu/Cane Corso cross pups.



"I will lend to you for awhile, a Doberman pup," God said...
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post #13 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-13-2014, 09:16 PM
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Hi.

Welcome to DT.

I admit to being a bit confused, after reading thru your post.

You say you "bred Rottweilers for years."

Soooo, that begs the question--why did you then not know that health-testing, and titling, of all breeding stock, is vital?

And if you know that, why did you give money to this very clearly sketchy, unethical breeder?

And if you *didn't* know that...why were you breeding Rottweilers?

Edit to add: I'm always surprised when I see someone say Rotts and Dobermans are "similar in personality," because I strongly disagree with that, having lived with, trialed with, and interacted with, both breeds. I find them very dissimilar.




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Last edited by RedFawnRising; 12-13-2014 at 09:19 PM.
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post #14 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 06:58 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alan j. View Post
The total price of $700.00 should have been enough of a clue to stay away.
As I said, "I am new to this breed of dog," doesn't automatically make me "clueless," just still learning. Didn't appreciate the insult. Thought this was a helpful place.

Regards,

L4T

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post #15 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 07:26 PM Thread Starter
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Talking I Object your honor!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedFawnRising View Post
Hi.

Welcome to DT.

I admit to being a bit confused, after reading thru your post.

You say you "bred Rottweilers for years."

Soooo, that begs the question--why did you then not know that health-testing, and titling, of all breeding stock, is vital?

And if you know that, why did you give money to this very clearly sketchy, unethical breeder?

And if you *didn't* know that...why were you breeding Rottweilers?

Edit to add: I'm always surprised when I see someone say Rotts and Dobermans are "similar in personality," because I strongly disagree with that, having lived with, trialed with, and interacted with, both breeds. I find them very dissimilar.
OK! This is the second nasty comment I have received. I don't fit into this kind of
Quote:
character assassination
forum and refuse to become another of your
Quote:
victims
. However, before reading either one of these I was warned, in a PM, that there is a lot of
Quote:
bashing
here. That PM was quite correct. It would have taken the same amount of time and energy to make your response informative. But, I understand; that secret euphoria people get from bashing someone else, in a public forum no less, would be missed.

I'll be Judged when it's my turn. What a shame that passive-aggressive narcissists join forums and discussion groups just so they can bash others; completely disavowing their own imperfections! Cloaking their bashing and insults behind words such as
Quote:
I'm confused!
I noticed you edited your post; to make absolutely sure I would come away humiliated after reading it?

Although, there were 20 other individuals that thanked me for posting that. to those people.

Regards,

L4T

"For a plot hatched in hell, donít expect angels for witnesses." Robert Perry
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post #16 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 07:39 PM
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This is a helpful place but at some point you have to take responsibility for not doing your homework in the first place.

We will help you but you must also help yourself.
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post #17 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosemary View Post
Well, this pretty much tells you everything you need to know about this kennel. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...81828268,d.eXY as does their website. Elite K9 Kennels trained protection dogs, police K9, rottweiler pups, studs
This is so sad.

Besides the poor quality of the breeding dogs, what idiot comes up with these combinations? Tosa and Corso are two very different breeds, as are Pit Bulls and Rottweilers. What can a combination of those breeds do any better than a well-bred Rottie/Corso/Tosa?
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post #18 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 08:01 PM Thread Starter
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Are u wanting a pet and will it be neutered ?
Absolutely! I recently lost 2 of my "pets" within six months of each other. Gut-wrenching grief is the only way to express it.

L4T

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post #19 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 08:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RottenVonSpotten View Post
This is so sad.

Besides the poor quality of the breeding dogs, what idiot comes up with these combinations? Tosa and Corso are two very different breeds, as are Pit Bulls and Rottweilers. What can a combination of those breeds do any better than a well-bred Rottie/Corso/Tosa?
Aaah, but you're missing the point. It's not about making some kind of improvement in the dogs' performance. It's all and only about hyping it to the idiots of the world who swallow pretty much any line of bs that some byb spews.

I think the idiots who buy these dogs actually believe that having a "unique" dog makes them think they're quite important and gets them respect.

Last edited by melbrod; 12-16-2014 at 09:33 AM.
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post #20 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 08:07 PM Thread Starter
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I'm glad you were able to get out of the contract and get your money back! Welcome to DT.

"For a plot hatched in hell, donít expect angels for witnesses." Robert Perry
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post #21 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VZ-Doberman View Post
Aaah, but you're missing the point. It's not about making some kind of improvement in the dogs' performance. It's all and only about hyping it to the idiots of the world who swollen pretty much any line of bullshit that some byb spews.

I think the idiots who buy these dogs actually believe that having a "unique" dog makes them think they're quite important and gets them respect.

Small wee wees and even smaller brains need lots and lots of stroking.....even if it costs them big bucks. Puts a little swagger in their mincing.


Oh, yeah. Sometimes I give too much credit to human kind.

Seriously though, what's not unique about a Tosa already? Majority of people will go their lifetime without ever running into one.
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post #22 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by RottenVonSpotten View Post


Oh, yeah. Sometimes I give too much credit to human kind.

Seriously though, what's not unique about a Tosa already? Majority of people will go their lifetime without ever running into one.
But that's the beauty of it. The fools have something their neighbor or their coworker doesn't.
And THAT is worth every penny they forked over.
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post #23 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 09:13 PM
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OK! This is the second nasty comment I have received. I don't fit into this kind of forum and refuse to become another of your . However, before reading either one of these I was warned, in a PM, that there is a lot of here. That PM was quite correct. It would have taken the same amount of time and energy to make your response informative. But, I understand; that secret euphoria people get from bashing someone else, in a public forum no less, would be missed.

I'll be Judged when it's my turn. What a shame that passive-aggressive narcissists join forums and discussion groups just so they can bash others; completely disavowing their own imperfections! Cloaking their bashing and insults behind words such as

I noticed you edited your post; to make absolutely sure I would come away humiliated after reading it?

Although, there were 20 other individuals that thanked me for posting that. to those people.

Regards,

L4T
Um, where to start?

I am guessing you do not know that correct editing etiquette and form means when someone writes "Edited to add:" then the text immediately following that is the part of the original post that was changed.

So, if you think my editing to add that I am surprised to see folks think Rottweilers and Dobermans are similar in personality was to make sure to "humiliate" you...wow, I genuinely hope you never have to face an actual problem.

At some point, communication has to be at least partly the responsibility of the reader, as well as the poster, and you have gone to Bizarro Land, with your inferences, bucko.

You sound exactly like the BoDT types, which is funny, since they were recently dredged up here.

I'm convinced there are common themes in the minds of byb types--you are certainly displaying many of them with your post here.

You folks fling names and insults casually, when simply questioned about your practices.

You could have chosen to answer my questions--perhaps you'd even had had rational reasons for your actions, or perhaps you'd have been able to beg ignorance and a commitment to do better by the breeds with which you become involved, but nah.

You went straight to the byb's ad hominem mantra, which we've seen and heard ad nauseum, over the many years.

Yawn.

Edited to add: Oh, and btw, just FYI, in your post, you have placed many unattributed quotes, and that's a total flag on the play. Not only is it weird, frankly, but, um, why? It doesn't even make sense, and no one reading gets where you pulled "quotes" from. You don't make a cogent point in that manner.




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―Cyril Connolly

Last edited by RedFawnRising; 12-15-2014 at 09:16 PM.
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post #24 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-16-2014, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by looking4trth View Post
Absolutely! I recently lost 2 of my "pets" within six months of each other. Gut-wrenching grief is the only way to express it.

L4T
I don't quite understand how losing pets and neutering them go hand in hand...unless you are equating not neutering your last two pets directly to their loss?

I am curious, were these pets your breeding pair? What did they pass of?
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post #25 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-16-2014, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by mommyblaze3 View Post
I don't quite understand how losing pets and neutering them go hand in hand...unless you are equating not neutering your last two pets directly to their loss?

I am curious, were these pets your breeding pair? What did they pass of?
Glad to see someone else asking relevant questions.

Always offering to "help," can be worrisome--would hate to see DT "help" yet another person become yet another BYB of Dobermans.

Besides, I have no doubt, if they are really determined, they will achieve that goal all on their own




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