Breeders near Florida who sell Dobies with natural ears - Page 3 - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums
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post #51 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 06:03 PM
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I don't hang out with these people. My friends know me well enough not to preach.

However, my friends are dog people, and the general public that I encounter are not. The breed guesses I've heard have all been while waffling down the street or while in training classes (thankfully the trainer is more knowledgeable about breeds than her students!). Or while waiting in the vet office. I think you'd be surprised. If he is in posts, people get preachy, and that's not an uncommon thing reported around this forum either. If his ears are "down" aka standing but not in posts, no one comments. Posts get me dirty looks, sucked breath, sighs, preaching, death threats (seriously), and people telling me to kill myself (yup, seriously, in person AND online).

Lucky for me, I don't care what they think, but to claim that there is no one interested in a natural dog is rather untrue.

And, besides Joe Q Public, I'll pretty sure the Landgraf and von moeller hof puppy buyers that are leaving their puppies 100% natural would disagree with you anyway.

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post #52 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 06:19 PM Thread Starter
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That's why I'm asking for help. I wouldn't be here if I didn't want it. You've pretty much made me feel like an idiot since I've been on here. Read all of the post. You're the only one who came across as a butt.
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post #53 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 06:20 PM
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I think we have someone here who is actually open to learning, so let's not totally attack him (her?) okay?

spencerklly, I think you may need to slow down just a bit and do some more research on the breed. Have you spent time with Dobermans? What draws you to them? I also think the advice to change your contact with breeders is a good one - you need to provide more information about yourself - it's almost as if you are writing a resume. Good breeders will need to be convinced to sell you a puppy. Be prepared to have long conversations with them to discuss why you are the right home for one of their puppies.

If natural ears are a dealbreaker, something you MUST have, then it's going to be on you to really, really research to find ethical breeders that will leave pups natural, and that may mean a roadtrip across the country, or shipping a puppy. The good breeders that do this are a small percentage of the whole, so limiting your geographic area in this search isn't going to work necessarily. You also have to understand WHY breeders crop ears in this country, and that goes back to researching the breed so that you can talk about Dobermans with a good understanding of the breed.


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post #54 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 06:35 PM
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Quote:
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I don't hang out with these people. My friends know me well enough not to preach.

However, my friends are dog people, and the general public that I encounter are not. The breed guesses I've heard have all been while waffling down the street or while in training classes (thankfully the trainer is more knowledgeable about breeds than her students!). Or while waiting in the vet office. I think you'd be surprised. If he is in posts, people get preachy, and that's not an uncommon thing reported around this forum either. If his ears are "down" aka standing but not in posts, no one comments. Posts get me dirty looks, sucked breath, sighs, preaching, death threats (seriously), and people telling me to kill myself (yup, seriously, in person AND online).

Lucky for me, I don't care what they think, but to claim that there is no one interested in a natural dog is rather untrue.

And, besides Joe Q Public, I'll pretty sure the Landgraf and von moeller hof puppy buyers that are leaving their puppies 100% natural would disagree with you anyway.
I didn't say that NOONE was interested in natural puppies. I said that the market for them was very limited at this time. Between people not thinking it's a Doberman without cropped ears and people not wanting to pay for a well bred natural puppy, the market is in fact limited. The breeders you mentioned aren't selling puppies to JQ Public. I am not in disagreement with them or their puppy buyers. They represent the small "market" for expensive, well bred, natural puppies. Since the dogs are Euro bred and the buyers are likely to want Sch. prospects, they are in keeping with the Euro trend.

You aren't going to see American breeders going the natural route for a long time, if ever.

I'm sorry that you have had such bad experiences with having a Doberman with cropped, posted ears. I've had 7 over the years and have never gotten anything beyond a passing comment that was easily ignored. Death threats are just a bit over the top. Makes me wonder if you encourage and invite controversy.
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post #55 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 06:42 PM
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That's why I'm asking for help. I wouldn't be here if I didn't want it. You've pretty much made me feel like an idiot since I've been on here. Read all of the post. You're the only one who came across as a butt.
I told you quite patiently what you didn't want to hear and you clearly weren't going to attempt to understand. Now you are calling me a butt. I will stop trying to help you now. See where this attitude gets you in your search. Good luck to you.
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post #56 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:11 PM
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OP, did you contact Jesaran Dobermans in Virginia? Her contact info is on the DPCA breeder referral list.

She has finished a natural eared Doberman in AKC conformation and is seemingly open to leaving pups natural. Definitely reach out to her and if you sent her an email like the one you posted, I'd suggest following it up with a phone call.
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post #57 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:18 PM Thread Starter
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First off, I wanted a dog that was a working breed, midsize to large, & has minimal grooming (minimal shedding). I'm a big guy, 6'4, and want a dog that can represent his owner. I also wanted a breed that was more than a companion, also a guardian. I also ant a dog who appreciates his place in the pack. I'm currently engaged and going through the police academy. I want my children to be around dogs and enjoy them as much as I have. This lead me to dobermans. They appear to be great dogs to grow up with and to have by my side during daily activities.
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post #58 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:20 PM Thread Starter
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OP, did you contact Jesaran Dobermans in Virginia? Her contact info is on the DPCA breeder referral list.

She has finished a natural eared Doberman in AKC conformation and is seemingly open to leaving pups natural. Definitely reach out to her and if you sent her an email like the one you posted, I'd suggest following it up with a phone call.
I haven't gone that far north yet lol, but I will contact her. I also sent an email to lavelle dobermans in New York. I found a breeder in Tennessee just now, Baptist Ridge Dobermans. They allow the dog to remain natural, and at a very low price.
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post #59 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:25 PM
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Big fat NO on Baptist Ridge. For starters, my spayed mutt has more titles than all their dogs put together.


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post #60 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:26 PM
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I haven't gone that far north yet lol, but I will contact her. I also sent an email to lavelle dobermans in New York. I found a breeder in Tennessee just now, Baptist Ridge Dobermans. They allow the dog to remain natural, and at a very low price.
There you go. Now you are onto bybs. I'll let others tell you about Baptist Ridge.
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post #61 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:27 PM
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Before you contact a breeder, you should search on this site by the breeder's name. Example: https://www.dobermantalk.com/breeding...dobermans.html

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post #62 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
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I haven't gone that far north yet lol, but I will contact her. I also sent an email to lavelle dobermans in New York. I found a breeder in Tennessee just now, Baptist Ridge Dobermans. They allow the dog to remain natural, and at a very low price.
Baptist Ridge is terrifying. please don't support them.
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post #63 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:35 PM Thread Starter
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I didn't contact Baptist Ridge, they're pricing kinda gives away what kind of breeder they are. I just received an email from treasure seeker dobermans. Leslie said she could do natural eared pup if I put 50% down I want to hear churchill's response.
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post #64 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:38 PM
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In a previous post you said you currently have Shepherds but later said you won't have them when you get the doberman. I guess I don't really follow there I really think you should re-consider the ear thing, and seek a reputable breeder that is breeding healthy long lived dogs, whether they have cropped ears or not. After all this is not a healthy breed and limiting your choices of breeders based only on a personal preference could mean you don't get a healthy puppy with an excellent pedigree... Good luck.
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post #65 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:41 PM
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I needed to double check before I said my "and second of all" and I was remembering correctly another thing about Baptist Ridge. They got some dogs from an absolutely atrocious greeder (Guardian Angel) last year.


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post #66 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:42 PM Thread Starter
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I have one. He's 13.... The poor guy won't be able to follow me once I move out of my parents because he has been a pure outdoor dog.
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post #67 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:45 PM
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I didn't contact Baptist Ridge, they're pricing kinda gives away what kind of breeder they are. I just received an email from treasure seeker dobermans. Leslie said she could do natural eared pup if I put 50% down I want to hear churchill's response.
Why? What do you expect me to say? I'm not against a breeder selling a natural eared puppy. I know nothing about this breeder so I have no opinion about her. It doesn't change the fact that responsible American breeders who will sell uncropped are far and few between. If you found one, great.
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post #68 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 07:51 PM
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There you go. Now you are onto bybs. I'll let others tell you about Baptist Ridge.
How is your nagging helping him to avoid BYBs?

OP, I personally think you have a good lead with Treasure Seekers if she thinks you'd be a good fit for her upcoming litter.
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post #69 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 08:03 PM
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How is your nagging helping him to avoid BYBs?

OP, I personally think you have a good lead with Treasure Seekers if she thinks you'd be a good fit for her upcoming litter.
I'm pointing out that he is moving on to bybs and considering them as I hoped he wouldn't but thought he might. When I checked on the treasure seeker breeder I realized that I do know who she is but didn't know her kennel name. She doesn't breed American dogs, she breeds Euro dogs. She breeds high drive dogs from Sch lines. It would be between the buyer and the breeder to decide if that was appropriate for his needs and his ability as an owner/trainer and a first time Doberman owner.

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post #70 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-25-2014, 08:19 PM Thread Starter
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Leslie seems very nice. She ask that I fill out one of her questionnaires and then she will talk to me further.
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post #71 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-26-2014, 10:30 PM
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Leslie seems very nice. She ask that I fill out one of her questionnaires and then she will talk to me further.
I don't know if anyone has suggested this to you yet, but reading this might be helpful to you, prior to discussions with good breeders:

https://www.dobermantalk.com/puppy-co...etiquette.html

It is possibly an unfair generalization, but...it does seem to be that police officers often wind up with poorly bred animals from less-than-stellar breeders.

We see a lot of "wash outs" locally, and I've heard similar stories from friends around the country.

I think most departments often don't have the funding to send officers and officer candidates to really good training seminars, as well.

You will really deserve big kudos, if you find a great ethical breeder to work with you, and obtain your puppy that way, instead of falling into the trap of bad breeder sales pitches.




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post #72 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-26-2014, 11:06 PM
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They tend to break easily?

Based on what statistics? What well-designed study told you this?

Just trying to jog you into realizing it's not a good idea to buy into myths, and especially not when it comes to Dobermans. We have a larger-than-usual dose of mythology surrounding our breed, sadly.

Dobes carry their tails over their backs--so, nope, they don't tend to "break easily."

A correct tail set does not even pose more of a risk for "happy tail syndrome," due to the way it is carried.

So, if you like a docked tail for cosmetic reasons, that's cool, but don't perpetuate myths about natural Dobe tails, k?
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post #73 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-27-2014, 04:50 PM
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About the tail thing - I seem to recall having read that in countries where docking was banned (the numbers I saw were from Sweden) therapeutic docking went up by a whopping 30%. I don't know if it was broken down by breed or not. I'm trying to google it to find more info.

As for the whole "is there a market for natural ears"... I think there definitely is. I think part of my mother's reluctance at getting a Doberman is that she does not like the cropped ears, especially not the standard show crop. She thinks they are much cuter and softer-looking with natural ears, they look more snuggly and cuddly. This is also the reason she prefers Reds over the Blacks, because she finds the blacks look 'harsh'. It is not that she dislikes the breed's personality or other characteristics, and I know a lot of other people who say they would be attracted to the breed but dislike the cropping and sometimes docking.

(On that note, I used to much prefer the natural ears too, but I now love a good crop just as much!)

Most of the Dobes I've seen in my city actually have natural ears though docked tails, so even when I was a little kid I had no trouble recognizing those dogs as dobies. Maybe this is also European influence. But to me a Dobe is just so recognizable, both with cropped and natural ears, it is impossible for me to mistake it for anything else.

I don't have much to add on the topic of American breeders selling uncropped puppies but from what I've heard and understood, the reputable breeders who will do it, will only do so if you've reserved the puppy put a deposit on it (either 50% or sometimes even the full price) to make sure you're not going to back out. Sure if someone flakes before the puppies are 7 weeks it doesn't matter, but it is indeed harder to sell an uncropped puppy to people who are interested in people who want the iconic silhouette in the breed. I think though a lot of people might not admit it, one of the first things that attracts people to a certain breed is their standard look. The people who are attracted to representations of the breed you don't see often are in the minority.
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post #74 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-27-2014, 06:16 PM
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Regardless of whether the breeder is paid in advance for the puppy so that the buyer is less likely to back out, it is up to each breeder to decide if they want to take the chance that the puppy they sold comes back to them and is harder to place because of natural ears and tails.
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post #75 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-27-2014, 10:39 PM
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I bought a natural puppy from Dobereich in Ontario Canada. You always have an option to ship a puppy.
Definitely there are many reasons to sell a natural puppy to a good family. Talk to breeders and you will find it.


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