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post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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Doxycycline

*sigh*

So a few weeks ago, I switched Toorc from Iams to Blue Buffalo Wilderness Puppy. I transitioned him into it like I was supposed to but he eventually began developing bumps on his body and his skin became flaky and dry. He also started biting at his feet and scratching. Took him to the vet for his third shots and they gave him a cortisone dose claiming it was a bug bite. I told them that it wasn't and was positive he was having a reaction to his new food. But they just gave me an antibiotic and I was on my way. We went back on Friday for his final parvovirus shot and told the vet that his skin was still flaky and bumpy and FINALLY they said food allergy. Gave him another shot of something mixed with cortisone and prescribed doxycycline. Told me it would make him pee more often.

Well yesterday morning, Toorc was chilling in bed with me when he suddenly got up and peed all over me and the bed. I thought he was being a little turd so I was super pissed and yelled at him and after I took him outside, I kenneled him while I cleaned it all up and showered. This morning, he was laying down with me again and literally peed while he was just laying there. I got up really quick and got him onto his own bed. He knew it was bad but I didn't even scold him because I knew something was up. Poor thing kept apologizing and I tried to keep him calm so he wouldn't pee again. Took him outside and sure enough he had lots more where that came from. I am doing laundry right now and I'm about to go through his food bags and see what I need to do for process of elimination.

Can anyone please tell me what the best approach is to this and also should I take him off the doxycycline? Do I need to switch his food altogether? I thought Blue was a good food... Paid like 60 bucks for it :/ The antibiotic isn't helping his skin and just making him incredibly incontinent. Please help my poor boy normally sleeps through the night and morning with no issues. And I don't know how to go about pinpointing what his allergy is.

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post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 12:21 PM
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Oh jeez...how terribly frustrating. I'm not nearly as knowledgable about food as many people here are, but I'm no stranger to returning items... I just returned a bag of Pro Plan yesterday that I bought only to transition Grizzly over to Innova...I know that's bad, but I went into the store and just told them that I didn't care for the food and switched him to something different. They gave me a full refund, and then they told me they would donate the open bag of food to a local rescue. Win-win!

I hope you get this all figured out. Poor you and poor Toorc.
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post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 12:30 PM Thread Starter
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Thank God for my mattress cover but I feel so bad that he has become incontinent AND itchy. He loves the food but I'm sure it's an allergy because as "crappy" as Iams is, he was just fine on it. I switched him because his trainer said I could be doing more for him nutritionally. I still have his Iams bag because I kept forgetting to throw it out. I'm writing down the ingredients for each food and eliminating the stuff they have in common since he was fine on Iams to begin with. It should help narrow it down but I'm confused about how to figure it out. Like if sweet potato was part of blue but not Iams, do I just give him a sweet potato and see if he has a reaction? Lol I'm wanting to do elimination before spending $260 on a allergy panel. Or maybe I will and just get him feeling better faster


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post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 12:35 PM
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Well, Kip has taken doxycycline for the skin infections which went along with his allergies--but I don't remember any side effects like what you describe. Yours is just a baby however? I didn't think food allergies were common in the very young, though certainly skin infections can be. And you talk about other things which could be affecting his system, like the steroids or the food switch, for example. Or he could have developed a random urinary tract infection.

What a mess.

I would think that the best first step for you to take is to consult with your vet, however, rather than here. I guess today is a holiday, but I would get ahold of your vet as soon as he's available. You could call an emergency vet if you want to, in the meantime--not that this sounds to me like an emergency (I'm not a vet)--but you could make sure there is no possibility of your fellow coming to real harm while you wait, and maybe help yourself feel better about how to deal with your pup til he can be seen by your normal vet.

Good luck!

Addition:
1. He could be having a reaction to the food which is not due to an allergy to any of its components.
2. Environmental allergies are much more common that food allergies.
3. A proper elimination food trial would involve you putting him on a very limited food for a couple of months, looking for a improvement in his condition during that time, and then introducing foods, one at a time, every six weeks or so and looking for a re-occurance of his problems.
4. If you are dashing about changing his foods every few weeks or so, it will make it much harder to identify a food culprit, because you will be introducing a lot of possibilities to weed out.

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post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
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So puppies don't get food allergies as often as adults then? Hmmm... That makes me wonder now. There are days that the bumps are worse than others. And some days like the day he got the last cortisone shot, it looked as though he didn't have any. His coat is still super nice and shiny and soft. But his skin in places just flakes off

I thought it would be the food because that's about the time when it all started happening. I have only bathed him once and that was when he first arrived. Since then he just gets patted down with wet rags if he ever gets too dirty. When I brought him home, I thought he had some sort of eye irritation because his eyes have always been slightly more watery and he gets those wet eye boogies. He also had a dripping problem when he peed but that cleared up after he was treated for his UTI.

Maybe it isn't food then and something else. I don't know what could have changed environment wise... Maybe the pollen or something? I developed a sinus infection just this past week. Now I'm confused


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post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 01:24 PM Thread Starter
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I'm going to make an appointment with a different vet. Mine always wants to shove you out the door to get the next patient in. He's great for ear crops. But that's all he was talented at.


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post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 01:37 PM
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Have you changed your fabric softener/ laundry soap recently?

One of my previous fosters went to a new home, she was a notorious blanket sucker... the fabric softener the owner was using was causing the foster to break out in hives and also was causing some serious shaking or quivering (probably from ingesting the toxins)...

Just a thought... I've given Doxy to many fosters for HW treatment with no issues. So I am not sure

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post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 01:49 PM
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I haven't heard of Doxy causing excessive urination, though I am not doubting your vets judgement. I would think he we would have been put on a steriod with what side effects you are describing. If the combo injection had a steriod component to it, that could be causing your excessive urination/drinking (polyuria/polydipsia).

Why would your vet put him on doxy (a strong antibiotic) for a skin issue?

I would consult the vet before doing this (I would do it, but depending on your situation it could be unwise) and just take him off the antibiotic and change his food back- maybe put him on fish oil supplements, etc. to assist his skin issue (oatmeal based shampoo/conditioner).

The doxy just doesn't fit into the skin allergy/reaction mix. The food might just not work with him.

Again check with the vet.

Good luck and keep us posted!
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post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 02:55 PM
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I am going through this same situation right now. I am at wits end. I had allergy tests ran and on the 20 food allergens Mayhem is not allergic to any. He is currently on prednisone. While on he is fine...no bumps, itching, etc. As soon as I wean him off he breaks out, begins scratching like crazy. I don't know what it can be I have had him on Natures Balance Sweet Potato and Venison for roughly 6 weeks.

I know this doesn't help you any but if you figure something out please pass on the info and I will do the same. Thanks.
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post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 03:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharly View Post
*sigh*

So a few weeks ago, I switched Toorc from Iams to Blue Buffalo Wilderness Puppy. I transitioned him into it like I was supposed to but he eventually began developing bumps on his body and his skin became flaky and dry. He also started biting at his feet and scratching. Took him to the vet for his third shots and they gave him a cortisone dose claiming it was a bug bite. I told them that it wasn't and was positive he was having a reaction to his new food. But they just gave me an antibiotic and I was on my way. We went back on Friday for his final parvovirus shot and told the vet that his skin was still flaky and bumpy and FINALLY they said food allergy. Gave him another shot of something mixed with cortisone and prescribed doxycycline. Told me it would make him pee more often.

Well yesterday morning, Toorc was chilling in bed with me when he suddenly got up and peed all over me and the bed. I thought he was being a little turd so I was super pissed and yelled at him and after I took him outside, I kenneled him while I cleaned it all up and showered. This morning, he was laying down with me again and literally peed while he was just laying there. I got up really quick and got him onto his own bed. He knew it was bad but I didn't even scold him because I knew something was up. Poor thing kept apologizing and I tried to keep him calm so he wouldn't pee again. Took him outside and sure enough he had lots more where that came from. I am doing laundry right now and I'm about to go through his food bags and see what I need to do for process of elimination.

Can anyone please tell me what the best approach is to this and also should I take him off the doxycycline? Do I need to switch his food altogether? I thought Blue was a good food... Paid like 60 bucks for it :/ The antibiotic isn't helping his skin and just making him incredibly incontinent. Please help my poor boy normally sleeps through the night and morning with no issues. And I don't know how to go about pinpointing what his allergy is.
So confirmation on the food allergy, Blue Buffalo?
Today we purchased a 15lb bag of the large breed puppy. Maybe we will
just leave her on the Innova.
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post #11 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 05:11 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy'sMom View Post
Have you changed your fabric softener/ laundry soap recently?

One of my previous fosters went to a new home, she was a notorious blanket sucker... the fabric softener the owner was using was causing the foster to break out in hives and also was causing some serious shaking or quivering (probably from ingesting the toxins)...

Just a thought... I've given Doxy to many fosters for HW treatment with no issues. So I am not sure
Ya know, I had been using Purex laundry detergent and washed his sucky blanket without thinking much of it. I luckily just ran out and bought Tide. I think I'm going to wash it tonight and see how that works. I'm infamous for forgetting to put in fabric softener maybe that's it because he didn't have the skin issue when I brought him home.


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post #12 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 05:11 PM Thread Starter
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I took him off the antibiotic today. I don't like that he can't control his pottying.


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post #13 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-01-2013, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JNKHANGMAN View Post
So confirmation on the food allergy, Blue Buffalo?
Today we purchased a 15lb bag of the large breed puppy. Maybe we will
just leave her on the Innova.
Allergies are specific to individual dogs--one dog might be allergic to a particular substance; the next might not be.

Of course, if there is a bad ingredient in the food, that might affect many dogs. But it is not an allergy.

All this to say--your puppy may not be bothered by the Blue Buffalo food. But if she is doing well on what she was on before,and it is a quality food, there is really no need to switch.
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post #14 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JNKHANGMAN View Post
So confirmation on the food allergy, Blue Buffalo?
Today we purchased a 15lb bag of the large breed puppy. Maybe we will
just leave her on the Innova.
I gave Halla BB and she got diarrhea that didn't 'go away'.

Took her off the BB and put her on Innova Beef and TOTW puppy and it was gone the next day.

I've never had good luck with BB.

Don't know why.

Corticosteroids will cause polydypsia/polyuria but usually in high/prolonged doses.




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post #15 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharly View Post
Ya know, I had been using Purex laundry detergent and washed his sucky blanket without thinking much of it. I luckily just ran out and bought Tide. I think I'm going to wash it tonight and see how that works. I'm infamous for forgetting to put in fabric softener maybe that's it because he didn't have the skin issue when I brought him home.


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I only use Palmolive Clear when washing evrything my dogs come into contact with and no softener.
[fabric softeners have creepy stuff like formaldehyde and mercury in them...they're not regulated like food or drugs so they don't have to list all the ingredients if they don't want to]

The Palmolive is a dish detergent and leaves no residues whatsoever.

Any chemical residue makes me itch like crazy so I know this stuff is true to its word.

White vinegar in the rinse cycle is double protection against residues.




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post #16 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 01:14 PM
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The steriods can cause the excessive peeing. I'd be concerned a vet gave an unhealthy (at the moment) puppy a parvo shot also. I wouldn't give a steriod shot WITH a vaccine on the same day. And then give antibiotics.

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post #17 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-03-2013, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melbrod View Post
Allergies are specific to individual dogs--one dog might be allergic to a particular substance; the next might not be.

Of course, if there is a bad ingredient in the food, that might affect many dogs. But it is not an allergy.

All this to say--your puppy may not be bothered by the Blue Buffalo food. But if she is doing well on what she was on before,and it is a quality food, there is really no need to switch.
Correct... and the BB Wilderness is a different formula from the regular BB large breed puppy.

Kimber just finished her first bag of BB Freedom for large breed puppies, and she looks awesome. She's almost through the transition from that to Wellness Super5Mix Large Breed Puppy. After that bag is gone, she'll transition to a different protein source. Probably TOTW.

She also gets two fish oil gel caps daily, except on days when I mix in a portion of sardines into her dinner. Shiny coat, no dandruff.

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post #18 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-05-2013, 04:47 AM
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Ahren is allergic to blue buffalo, I put him on exclusive brand -large breed formula it's a little cheaper than blue a 35 pound bag is $45-$50 he loves it, it doesn't have all the fillers or junk in it and is formulated for sensitive dogs. I would definitely switch his food. Blue either had dye or wheat in it that Ahren was allergic to.


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post #19 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melbrod View Post
Allergies are specific to individual dogs--one dog might be allergic to a particular substance; the next might not be.

Of course, if there is a bad ingredient in the food, that might affect many dogs. But it is not an allergy.

All this to say--your puppy may not be bothered by the Blue Buffalo food. But if she is doing well on what she was on before,and it is a quality food, there is really no need to switch.
Yes, this is very obvious, and would say common knowledge. My reply post was one of comfort to the original post. Want to say that a few others here have had some issue with this brand, my pup is not one of them, yet. And now on day 6 of introduction to BB large breed. Finding a recipe that the pup likes is battle one, two would be if they have no adverse problems.
But thank you.
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post #20 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 12:18 PM
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I had a dog a couple of years ago that had allergies. Treated him with steroids and he peed all the time. I have my dobie on BB and all is good. However, a friend switched her dog to BB and he developed really bad allergies.
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post #21 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 02:53 PM
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I have not read all of the replies, but quickly:
how old is this puppy??
Any steroid can increase drinking and urination.
It is very unlikely this is a true food allergy. Food allergies are identified by feeding a novel diet (new protein & carb source) for at least 2 months, then feeding the old food again and you should get the same reaction. Serum tests for food allergies are unreliable.

Doxycycline would not be my first choice of antibiotic in a puppy if all adult teeth are not in yet.
01 Doxycycline (Vibramycin) - VeterinaryPartner.com - a VIN company!

I would seek a second opinion -- potentially with a veterinary dermatologist.

Good luck with your dog.

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post #22 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Sharly View Post
Thank God for my mattress cover but I feel so bad that he has become incontinent AND itchy. He loves the food but I'm sure it's an allergy because as "crappy" as Iams is, he was just fine on it. I switched him because his trainer said I could be doing more for him nutritionally. I still have his Iams bag because I kept forgetting to throw it out. I'm writing down the ingredients for each food and eliminating the stuff they have in common since he was fine on Iams to begin with. It should help narrow it down but I'm confused about how to figure it out. Like if sweet potato was part of blue but not Iams, do I just give him a sweet potato and see if he has a reaction? Lol I'm wanting to do elimination before spending $260 on a allergy panel. Or maybe I will and just get him feeling better faster


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Sharly,

For all that people persist in telling dog owners that diets like Hills, Iams/Eukanuba and Purina are "poison" I'm going to point out the obvious. Not all dogs do well on the same thing and I tell you that for all of the people who have opinions to the contrary none of major dog food manufacturers (expecially the ones who still maintain colonies of dogs who are used to test the efficacy of the foods)are out to poison your dog and I'd really rather trust them than some of the small providers whose food is built by computer model and doesn't always work on real dogs in a real world situation.

Instead of reinventing the wheel and trying to develop your own method of testing for "presumed" allergies I'd stop the meds and put the puppy back on what was working before. If it's Iams if it works it's fine.

The acid test for me is does the dog love the food and eat it readily? Does it keep the dog in good weight without feeding huge quantities of food? Is his coat glossy, does his breath smell good and are his stools firm and normal looking. If you can answer yes to those questions there is probably nothing wrong with the food for the dog.

A lot of the super premium, five star rated foods don't do well for Dobe puppies and there are lots of experienced breeders who feed Iams, Eukanuba, Purina or Hills to their young dogs even though they might not feed it to their adult dogs.

I don't care how many stars a food is rated at if the dog is itchy, has a dull coat or constant diarrhea or soft stools.

Good luck.

Last edited by dobebug; 01-06-2013 at 03:43 PM.
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post #23 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 03:43 PM
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First for sure I would change foods to a higher quality grain free one.
Second I agree with Adara I would not have any Vaccinations until this cleared up. Allergies are an immune response and giving any vaccinations you are putting more strain on the immune system. Do some searches on Vaccinations. VACCINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE GIVEN TO A SICK ANIMAL!
Third for sure do not use any Dryer sheets with any dog bedding or coats.
Fourth when giving any antibiotics and even people (because they are also killing good bacteria) also give some plain yogurt. It will put good bacteria back in the intestines. About 70% of a dogs immune system is located in its intestines.
Hope Toorc get better.
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post #24 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 03:49 PM
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I am by no means an expert on pet nutrition but what dobebug says really makes sense. For the first year of Coco's life I tried every "high quality" kibble I could get my hands on and spent a fortune doing it. She was soooo skinny that people often commented I should feed her more. Her stools were always loose and her gas could clear the room. She always checked out at the vet fine and I even tried her on some vet diets but never with good results. I don't think she was able to process kibble properly. Around a year old I switched her to raw with great results. No gas, properly formed stools, good teeth and she gained weight. We never looked back. Raw is also something to consider but at first it's overwhelming and a bit gross. It's not for everyone but it worked for Coco.

I have a very long haired cat who is finicky and prone to hairballs. She loves the cheapest, no name kind of kibble around but I felt bad feeding her such "low quality" kibble so I started experimenting with higher grades. It was a disaster. She had hairballs multiple times a day and would refuse to eat. I tried Iams hairball formula and at first was appalled that I was feeding my dog such good, natural food and feeding Tiki "garbage". Well she has thrived on Iams so this is what she eats now. No more hairballs at all. I tried raw with her but she refused to eat it so we will stick with what she does well on.

Good luck. It's hard finding a food that they do well on but don't be hung up on "high quality" kibble because if it doesn't work for your dog it doesn't work.

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post #25 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 03:50 PM
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By the way, when my dogs were on doxycycline (the puppy turned up with kennel cough and the adults got doxy as a preventive--it worked, at least only the puppy actually had kennel cough) none of them had problems with urination.

I'm surprised that anyone even suggested that the pu/pd was due to the doxy when he's also had a cortisone shot--those shots are designed to be fairly long lasting and it's probably whats causing the problem with uncontrolled urination so don't be terribly surprised if just taking the puppy off the doxycycline doesn't fix everything. You might want to ask the vet how long the effects of the cortisone shot usually last.
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