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To the " I don't need a show dog, I need a pet people".

4K views 29 replies 15 participants last post by  RMcIntyre 
#1 ·
Not sure if this is the correct place but here goes. Maybe it's a pointless rant but if I help one person steer the right direction I've did some good.

A little over 5 years ago I started dobie shopping. They were beautiful and loyal and I wanted one. I only needed a pet though and thought it was absurd to pay the show price for a companion. I was arrogant, wrong and had some heated discussions on here that can prob be found with people who I thought were just greedy, snoody people. What they were is right and knowledgeable and trying to help. I listened to myself though and I found my $800 puppy on some puppy search engine.

Now for the good. I purchased my sweet boy jager from a very nice lady. I won't name names because she only bred one litter and then turned rescue. I honestly think she had good intentions but was in to deep and didn't have the proper knowledge and only realized it to late. My boy was so sweet with a great temperament. To much so honestly. You probably could have robbed my house and took him with you. He gave me, my family and everyone that met him so much joy. I could take him anywhere on or off leash and knew I would have no problems. He gave our family 5.5 years of great love and companionship.

Now the bad. We spent so much time at the vet. At a young age he was diagnosed hypothyroid. He pretty much had no thyroid and was on max dosage from there on out. At the age of 3-4 we dealt with lipomas, rupturing cysts, and skin problems. We seriously never went more than a month without a vet visit. The last month of his life I spent over 5k on vet bills and visits/travel to the local university for chemo treatments. All this because I wanted to save a little money and didn't need a "show dog".

I consider myself a manly man and my boy passing was honestly the worst thing I've ever been through. After a month of crying I honestly thought I might require some sort of counseling. Sure I can't pin point cancer on the breeder. It can happen to anyone. But I'd bet the farm my sweet boys parents had some if not all of those conditions in the bloodlines.

Please listen to these people. Some of them may not have the most tact but they do have the knowledge. I suggest you listen to it. Don't put yourself or a dog through what I went through this last May. There are no guarantees but a "show bloodline" puts the odds in your favor. I hope this can help to change some people's mind with the mentality that I had.

Thank you, my rant is over for now.
 
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#2 ·
Part 2

Spare me the I can't believe you spent that on a dog comments. I would have spent 20K more if I thought I had one more quality day with my boy. This will sound snoody but if you don't have the disposable few thousand dollars or credit at any given moment that a dog can cost(especially dobies), then you should stick with a more suitable pet such as sea monkeys, goldfish, or gerbils.

Have a great day.
 
#3 ·
Many of us have been through nearly EXACTLY what you have been through. That's what makes us so passionate, sometimes angry, but always heartbroken knowing someone else will make a mistake that we made. We try to save them the heartbreak we went through. The money's the money, I could have had 10 dogs or more for what I paid in vet bills. But the heartbreak of seeing them in pain and not being able to make it better is something that's so very hard to accept. To watch a dog die so much earlier than it should have is heartbreaking.
 
#5 ·
A million times, amen. I have never 'bought' a dog in my life. We always got shelter dogs growing up and I've rescued my two dobermans, which is how I know that (1) I will always have dobermans in my home (until I'm too old to care for them) and (2) I will only buy from breeders with strong health records from now on. All dogs deserve loving homes, so I really feel for puppy mill dogs, but I don't have the money or the heart to watch another dobe suffer and then die at such a young age. I lost one to a combo of very common doberman diseases and the other is currently in a painful decline. I think we'll foster in the future, since all dogs really do deserve loving homes and I want to support the rescue community, but I agree with you 100%. A doberman is an expensive dog no matter what. It's definitely preferable to make the investment on the purchase and then make another investment in health insurance that you will hopefully never need!
 
#7 ·
Wow.

I am a rescue person as well, but would love, love, love a Doberman as it should have been bred, in the first place.

Thank you, rjohnsontx!

Axel's Mom was a puppy mill rescue from Arkansas. She had 14 puppies. 4 of them came to Kansas City and the rest went to other Dobe specific rescue groups.

I was VERY fortunate with his health! He made it to 14.

Being associated with rescue groups helps with weeding out riff raft breeders.

I appreciate everyone's comments!
 
#9 ·
When the time has come it's either us or our dog die! If we die first do you think are dog will cry for us? Yes, because how much we love our dog is double of their feeling for us. It's so heartbreaking for both of us to lose someone we love.
 
#11 · (Edited)
Have you seen a show dog in real life? My guess is no, here's why. Everywhere I go, literally everywhere, people comment about how beautiful my dogs are. Even my awkward puppy, I took hiking with a friend an he couldn't believe how often we were stopped and how often people commented. Many times people tell me should show m dogs, "funny you should say that, I do". Yet, at a dog show he looks just like all the others.

To say you don't like show dogs makes no sense to me. They set the standard that byb and puppy mills sell upon. Without the show dog there's no breed type. Without show dogs and the "form follows function" you would have a bunch of lopsided cripples (not that we still don't).
These dogs are the ones that set the standard and stick out in crowds:








Not these (although I love our fosters)



And if you have a dog with euro lines I'd be worried. I've been researching euro males and lines from the UK, Finland, Germany, Poland, Italy... (because I'd like to get more bone with Gretchen's breeding) astounded to see so many passing away at 6 and 7 and so few living past 9. And that was EVERY breeder I looked at and ONLY the puppies they kept. I was blown away and it's doubtful I'll go with a Euro. for breeding too many of those popular sires used in every line.
 
#19 · (Edited)
#21 ·
Major
I have had Dobermans for well over 30 years. Have they changed? Yes both the American and the Euro have changed. I have Dobermans and German Shepherds. My Shepherds are from Germany. My Dobermans are from some of the best lines here in the U.S. (yes I know that is my opinion. But it is also many others) Both of these dogs originated in Germany. Shepherds being older of the two breeds. But either one you go back one hundred years and look at them as they have progressed to our day and you will see changes in both. Much more so in the shepherds. Many of the dogs from Germany the focus is more on drive then it is on the physical structure. And if you look at the pictures and compare anatomy of both dogs through the ages you will find the euro dogs have changed at a faster rate with a lot more extremes. Which isn't surprising since their goals remember are more about drive then structure. The German Shepherds go absolutely crazy for a ball or stick but most of them can't calm down to be a calm dog in the house. Those with Euro dogs act as if they are the standard where they have deviated grossly from the original standard and have many extremes. The backs of the German shepherds look like a ski slope The Dobermans are borderline overweight. Many will debate all this but all you have to do is go back on the different pedigree websites that have pictures and look for your self. The pictures don't lie. Now if a dog that is above the breed standard in height and weight appeals to you that is fine but still recognize that is what it is. And if you don't that is fine too. There will always be people who breed outside the standard and call it special. The problem is most of these same people don't do all the health testing. And even ones who say show line, see the value of conformation. But they themselves might not show. They are trying to capitalize off of others work. The problem is that even though their dogs may be "off show lines" they themselves may not conform and may have faults that shouldn't be bred. Things that only those who really know the breed standard may spot. So you may have been told show lines but in reality they may have been simply using those words as a marketing tool. If you are in the south east contact me and we can attend some shows together and talk about structure of different breeds. Think about some of these extreme body builders. While they look impressive, What practical value is there? Could they get out there and do an honest days work in construction? Not likely. So what value is all their hard work? Not much. If we tried to make everyone look like that what kind of health problems would we be bring in? Think about how that oversize would actually limit us. so it may be impressive to see a large dog but they lose speed, agility, They also put more stress on their organs. There are enough health problems with each breed with out making more. By the way about going to the dog shows was an honest offer.
 
#22 · (Edited)
Quite interesting link--especially the last comment about the size change.

The thread says that the standard from 1929 in both America and Germany were basically both the same at that point: Height at shoulder dogs 22 3/4 to 25 3/5, bitches 21 3/5 to 23 3/5 Faults...too heavy and massive.

That’s a huge change in size--the German dog, if anything, has deviated from this early standard more than the US dog--it is more at fault (in that many are shown so overweight) by being too heavy and massive.



A random thought: Why does the first height start out with 22 and 3/4 inches, while the other 3 show the height as some number plus 3/5 inches? Like 3/4 inch is so different from 3/5 inch--can you really tell the difference in the field?
 
#26 ·
Via Melbrod: A random thought: Why does the first height start out with 22 and 3/4 inches, while the other 3 show the height as some number plus 3/5 inches? Like 3/4 inch is so different from 3/5 inch--can you really tell the difference in the field?

Simple...
Translation from metric (most of the world) to our SAE standard (inch, foot, yard, etc,) is by its very nature rounded either up or down. It is really stupid, but that is just the way it is.

Here in the US we have to have an entire set of of both metric AND SAE tools. How dumb is that?
 
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