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Old 12-07-2012, 11:34 PM   #1 (permalink)
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i have a 5 and a half old male and he jumps on the counters and steals stuff i say to him he is bad and i put him in his crate this does not work some one told me to get a shock collar i think that is a bad idea can any one help me
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:45 PM   #2 (permalink)
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DON'T use a shock collar on a five month old puppy!!! You need to teach "leave it". I suggest you learn how to use positive reinforcement to train you puppy by finding a good trainer in your area, and taking some classes. Failing that, look up kikopup on youtube. She's been highly recommended by others on this forum.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:45 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Thankfully mine has never done this but you might want to work on obedience training. Whether on your own (you tube has good videos) or via a class. A great command to work on is the "place" command. Is this during meal time or always?

http://www.cesarsway.com/training/do...uring-Mealtime

Maybe try teaching him the "leave it" command. Work up to actually putting a treat on the counter and reward him when he doesn't get it with another treat. (Not the one on the counter use that one for repetition of the exercise then put away.) this worked to keep my dobe from getting stuff off the coffee table.

http://www.cesarsway.com/tips/trainerscorner/LEAVE-IT

Another thing I've always believed in is you have to set your dog up for success. If the dog is getting in the trash, get a trash can with a lid. Maybe gate off your kitchen from him/her if possible. The times you let him in there make him sit or down for a treat. If he gets on the counter, make him leave and gate off the kitchen again.

I was always taught to never use the crate as a punishment. Hope this helps!




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Old 12-07-2012, 11:45 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Mouse Traps.

The old fashion snap kind. Place them on the counter where is he jumping up on. When he puts a paw up he sets it off. Normally the sound is enough to startle them. Sometime the snap actually gets them but won't do any more damage or harm then a shock collar would. Works like a charm on counter surfers. My dogs use to consider it a competitive sport until I was given this suggestion. Only took my dobie get snapped once for her to decide the counters were not worth it. My Vizsla is a little more stubborn and I occassionally have to put one near the sink to remain him the dishes are not there for him to clean...
best of luck
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:49 PM   #5 (permalink)
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What training have you done to stop the behavior?
Other than telling him that he is bad, I mean.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:51 PM   #6 (permalink)
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problem with putting the dog in the crate when he is bad is that when you just want him to go into his crate because you are going out or something he isnt going to want to, id try and lay off punishing him with the crate if possible
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:53 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Why is he allowed the opportunity to steal stuff. Put it away, and keep him out of the kitchen.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:53 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I want to thank every one who reply to my post all is very helpfull
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:21 AM   #9 (permalink)
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that's great, but you still haven't answered the all-important question: what have you done to train this dog? please be specific.
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Old 12-08-2012, 01:08 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Watch your dog at ALL times. Ifyou cannot give your attention and eyes to him, he must be crated for everyone's safety. Spend your time teaching instead of scolding
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Old 12-08-2012, 09:21 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Hate to say it, but Zack the Dobermonster has stolen a full roast beef, cheese, and my lunch, several times off the counter. They are speedy buggers.

clearly this is my fault.

We are still working on "leave it!"

Dobermans are smart, and stubborn, and require a lot of patience.
Training is an ongoing thing.
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Old 12-08-2012, 01:31 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I don't think any training can keep a Doberman from stealing something tasty off of the countertop when you're not looking, they are pretty smart.
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Old 12-08-2012, 01:38 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdubois64 View Post
I don't think any training can keep a Doberman from stealing something tasty off of the countertop when you're not looking, they are pretty smart.
Once upon a time, Elka nibbled a single corner off of a brick of mozzarella cheese left on the counter. She also once stole the top bun off of a burger my fiance had on a plate in front of him on the coffee table.

Since then, we worked gradually and consistently on "leave it" (and also "drop it"). I dropped a full tupperware container of taco meat on the kitchen floor, and she took a step towards it and then sighed and sat down. She picked up something at the park on the long line; I said "drop it" and recalled her. She did (and got to shove her face in the treat bag ). When I went over to see what it was, I realized my dog had picked up an entire turkey sandwich, and dropped it when I asked her to.

Training works.
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Old 12-08-2012, 01:41 PM   #14 (permalink)
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It takes a lot of patience and training but you can teach a dog to leave food alone.
If you look at my resent post about Darcy you can see the end result of positive training.
She used to be a little food thief too lol.

I have never used a crate and personally I don't like them, but understand in the right hands they are useful.








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Old 12-08-2012, 02:18 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GingerGunlock View Post
Once upon a time, Elka nibbled a single corner off of a brick of mozzarella cheese left on the counter. She also once stole the top bun off of a burger my fiance had on a plate in front of him on the coffee table.

Since then, we worked gradually and consistently on "leave it" (and also "drop it"). I dropped a full tupperware container of taco meat on the kitchen floor, and she took a step towards it and then sighed and sat down. She picked up something at the park on the long line; I said "drop it" and recalled her. She did (and got to shove her face in the treat bag ). When I went over to see what it was, I realized my dog had picked up an entire turkey sandwich, and dropped it when I asked her to.

Training works.
I'm talking about when you are not there, like in a different room. Dillon would have never dared if I was there.
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Old 12-08-2012, 02:59 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Oh man, I don't want anyone thinking I'm scolding Gem with mouse traps or suggesting using a shock collar or coporal punishment on a 5 month old

I agree with the constant training. She knows leave it and spit it out. and never crating for "bad" behavior, the crate is their safe den.

The mouse trap suggestion is strictly for those times when I couldn't be with her, like when I ran to the bathroom and I could hear her in the kitchen sink. Yes I could come out and tell her to leave it and get down, and normally as soon as she heard the bathroom door open I'd hear her toe nails hit the floor and I'd have nothing to correct. But the point is she shouldn't be doing it in the first place. She doesn't do it while I standing right there for immediate correction. I assumed the OP was having the same type of issue. and realisticly I wasn't going to throw her in the crate every time I had to go the bathroom.

The mouse trap gave her a negative result instead of the positive "reward" she was looking for. It took one loud snap with no physical hit for her to realize counter surfing will not be the instant self reward she thought it would be.

I agree wholeheartedly with the train, train, train method. But how would others suggest keeping your dog off the counter when you are out of the room for 2 seconds? You personally can't correct an offense you don't see, right? It's like yelling at them after they destroy something you left laying around, they have no idea what they did wrong and you're correcting at the wrong moment.

And yes, put away the tempation is correct as well, but we all know when the call of nature hits, sometimes you better answer right then! lol.

I hope this don't come off as jerkish. Just adding to the discussion.
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Old 12-08-2012, 03:20 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdubois64 View Post
I'm talking about when you are not there, like in a different room. Dillon would have never dared if I was there.
At this point, she leaves unattended food alone, be it countertop, stovetop, or on the coffee table.

There can definitely be the "are they watching" standard!
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Old 12-09-2012, 07:23 AM   #18 (permalink)
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I agree with the constant training, AND I HAVE BEEN TEACHING HIM LEAVE IT AND DROP IT I DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH HIM AND THE COUNTER SURFING FOR THE MOST PART ZEUS IS A REAL GOOD DOBIE I COULD NOT ASK FOR A BETTER DOG
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Old 12-09-2012, 07:37 AM   #19 (permalink)
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I would never reprimand and place in the crate. Rou had such anxiety in his crate as a puppy I didn't want him to feel like it was a prison (same goes for other dogs).

I don't care much for Caesar Milan...

Have you tried a SQUIRT BOTTLE?

Keeping them on their own strict diet unless absolutely necessary can keep their curiosity to a minimum
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Old 12-09-2012, 07:39 AM   #20 (permalink)
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When teaching leave it, I took a desirable treat, showed it to my boy, closed , my palm and said "Leave it". When he gave up on trying to get it out of my hand by nosing and pawing at it, he got the treat. but only when his attention came off the treat in my hand.
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Old 12-09-2012, 09:45 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I agree with teaching him leave it.

Also I teach Jones/fosters that the kitchen is off limits. They step a foot in the kitchen they get a "No" or "Ah" as soon as they back up out of the kitchen they get a cookie.

As far as respecting the counters and "not being able to keep a dog from stealing food". Jones has always respected my counters since learning that counter/table= mine not his. I can leave food/his food/ anything on the counter he isn't going to try to get it. (whether I am in the room or not) same goes with my end table that is more his height.

Jones also has awesome self control
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Old 12-09-2012, 09:28 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Gracie is fine. Unless you allow yourself to be distracted. For even a moment.

Butter is out of reach and in a covered dish, as it is her favorite thing to find on the counter.

She has, several times, stolen sandwiches in the process of being made when someone moved away from them and also looked away.

Diva will not counter surf unless she spies a ball on the counter. Getting food from a human is a fun game to her, but not as much fun as playing ball with the human!

Rouleaux describes "leave it" training the way I was taught. It is still the case that these are dogs tall enough to counter cruise effectively, and smart enough to know when you are fully distracted (like vacuuming in another room).

With a five month old puppy, I'd not expect a great deal of self control, and I'd be working on sitting back a decent distance from the front door when it's opened in preference to refraining from stealing food. I want my puppy to be extremely food motivated during early training.
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Old 12-09-2012, 09:37 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:49 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I love that photo of Dillon.

Gracie does not understand the nature of the problem here....
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Old 12-16-2012, 04:29 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flaminscotch View Post
Hate to say it, but Zack the Dobermonster has stolen a full roast beef, cheese, and my lunch, several times off the counter. They are speedy buggers.
Hmmmm...my Dobes, including a couple who can easily rest their chins on the counter to watch me while I'm prepping stuff for meals, don't take anything off the counter...EVER! For the same reason they don't just step over the 2' baby gates that I lean up against doorframes to confine them for a variety of reasons. They all learn as puppies that putting your tongue on the counter, your feet on the counter or trying to jump, climb or step over baby gates is a huge gigantic mistake and will bring down the wrath of the Keeper upon you.

Quote:
clearly this is my fault.
Yeah <g> it is...you are right about that.

Quote:
We are still working on "leave it!"
That's a command that helps but I know Dobes are often faster than a human can spit out that command.

Quote:
Dobermans are smart, and stubborn, and require a lot of patience.
Training is an ongoing thing.
While I agree that Dobermans are smart and that training is an ongoing thing I don't necessarily agree that Dobes are particularly stubborn.

I know sometimes it looks that way.

Dogs, not just Dobes, are the ultimate pragmatists. They do whatever works. That's why if you don't want the dog on the furniture you don't EVER let them on the furniture, the bed or whatever. The dogs tiny brain makes connections like this. Once, in another time and maybe in a galaxy far, far away I got to get on the bed (or put my feet on the counter and take a really tasty thing that was up there), and I'm sure that this time I can get on the bed and stay on the bed (or, put my feet on the counter and take that honking big roast the smells just great)...after all it happened once so maybe this time it'll happen again.

Fading that initial response where they got rewarded takes incredible patience and a lot of time--but bear in mind it isn't really stubborness it's the way the canine mind is wired. If A=B (even if it was only once, maybe just maybe it'll happen again).

You can't start any sooner to retrain but you can put a leash on the puppy and never, ever let him put his feet on the counter again. With the leash you can correct him every time without fail. It actually works--I've faded similar behavior on 3, 4 and 5 year old chronic counter surfers.

And as for how can you keep a dog from counter surfing if you aren't there (even if you aren't there only for seconds)--you can take them with you for those couple of seconds--and that way they don't have an opportunity to try to snag something tasty from the counter. Eventually all of my dogs learn that feet on the floor and tongue in the mouth around the counters is a rule you don't want to violate.

One of my dogs drools--but I can leave him in the kitchen with anything--the roasted chicken, the salmon filets, the beef roast--and he's one of the tall ones and everything is within reach of that long pink tongue--but he touches nothing--he drools lakes--that's disgusting but at least he doesn't steal the dinners.

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