How do I stop this?

Sagesmom · 05-20-2008, 11:11 PM

Sage and I have started working with recall outside. As there is not toy or treat that is good enough outside we use outside as the reward for returning to me (I do ask for a sit somewhere in front of me though).

There is nothing better to Sage than being able to run free (as free as 33 feet will let her anyway) and sniff and bark. And the recalls are going pretty well and go something like this....

Sage is playing (running and sniffing)
I say her name and call her to me.

If Sage comes anywhere in my direction I step in front of her (that way she can fail) and when she slows (so as not to hit me) I ask for a sit (which I get most of the time without help).

Once she is sitting I pat her on the head tell her what a good girl she is and tell her to go.

Here is where the problem is..... I say go, then Sage jumps up and tries to rough house with me like she does with my DH (she learned early on that I can't play like that and doesn't even try most of the time). Today, she caught my armpit and I have a pretty good bruise.

How do I stop this? I am going to try to step on the leash for a couple of seconds after I tell her to go and see if that helps but any other ideas would be most helpful.

Thanks again

bleh60 · 05-21-2008, 01:13 AM

when she comes over to you, before you tell her go, step on the leash so she dosnt have enough slack to jump, if she does give her a swift 'no', if he does go off, take your foot off the lead. Or maybe change your command to something other then 'go'?

**voodoolizard** · 05-21-2008, 03:10 AM

try "away" or another word instead. it might ne the word thats triggering it..

**doberkim** · 05-21-2008, 07:09 AM

for your "emergency" recalls, don't ask for sits. I ask for sits for formall ones, but its pretty demotivating asking for a sit for your dog repeatedly when you work recalls - my dogs need to come to me, and that is it. I need to be able to grab their collar (I work this separately, my dogs learn to present their necks to me - speaking of, berlin needs to learn this!). Through work, Rah's most reliable command is probably his "cuddle"!!

And you say there isn't something better to sage than running - there IS, you just don't do it with her - she wants you to physically play with her - she just needs rules to go along with the game. She is trying to get you to play with her, and gets overly excited about it, so you end it almost before it starts, but that is what she wants as a reward, she just never gets it.

You need to try to find a way to play with her - find a tug toy, find a way to wrestle (pinching her butt , slapping her on her sides, having her jump in the air but not landing on you, etc) that INVOLVES you - she wants to physically play with you and wants physical praise, something more than a pat on the head! - as a reward. Teach her to speak, teach her to jump up and give you a kiss. Teach her the rules are she can play with you WITHOUT using her teeth!

Personally, recalls need to be very rewarding. You calling her, making her sit, and giving her a lil pat on the head will likely NOT be enough to stand up in the real world with heavy distraction. It certainly would not be enough for any of my dogs, and god bless the dog that would come solely for that all the time! THe whole premise of reliable recalls is that they need to be paired with something ENTIRELY fun for the dog - a super yummy treat that they ONLY get with recalls, a fun toy they ONLY play with during recalls, or a fun game (such as wrestling with YOU) that she ONLY gets when she comes when called. If she loves this game, the love for the game (which believe me, will be more than her intrinsic love of coming when called!) will be what holds up - when she is distracted and you say "Sage Come!" it's not going to be "Oh, I have to come because mom makes me sit and gives me a pat, she says so", it's going to be , "wow, I really would like to keep sniffing this, but whenever I go to mom when she says come we play that AWESOME SUPER DUPER GAME so gotta goooooooooooooooooooooo"!!!!!

the key of course, that you have to be faithful in your end of the bargain here

robinb · 05-21-2008, 11:06 AM

I agree with Kim in that you need more rewards. Good treats and toys or tugs, that the dog get's to play with only when you are training. I never ask for a formal recall with a sit until the dog is solid. When I do want a sit, I start with the dog in either a down position or sit position, then the recall and the formal sit, on the command come. You can use the dogs name then the come command. When I just want my dog to come into me without the formal sit, I use a different command. Solid recalls are your most important obedience exercise so reward big time with food and/or a high value toy or tug. Make it really fun for her.

DOG TUG TOYS - FRENCH LINEN OBEDIENCE DOG TUG TOY - DogEquipment.com Here is a link to the tug toy that I use for a reward in obedience training. I use the double handle one and that is very easy for the dog to take. I also use the rubber orbee balls. For food I use cheese, hot dogs or beef jerky.

**sebsyd** · 05-21-2008, 06:51 PM

You have gotten excellent advice above. It is the same advice I was given in the beginning and I used it all with good results. I still treat occasionally now and then when they come immediately when I call. Other times they just get a "good girl" or "good boy". It kind of mixes it up and they never know what they are going to get when called. We worked on this for a couple of months before I introduced "immediate recall" when I want them to come immediately because I feel that they are in danger or someone else is in danger of them. I use a different word for this. For example, I use "come" for normal recall and "NOW" for immediate recall. Also, we have just finished an obedience class where our trainer told us to never "pat" the dog on the head. I had never heard of this before, but she said that dogs don't like it. Mine seem to love being touched on their heads, just thought I'd pass it along. Maybe other members have more info on this. I'd be interested to hear it. Good luck.

Sagesmom · 05-21-2008, 09:02 PM

Thank you all for your advice..... I am still in search of "the one" reward that Sage will work for outside. While inside I have things that she would move heaven and earth for that we use during training, but outside she has no interest in anything, I have have used cooked deer steak (we don't feed raw), hot dogs, cheese, jerky, tuna (both in treat form and fresh from the can), cat food (had to put it up on the dresser to keep her out of it so the cat can eat), we have tried the tugs (rope, and fleese), balls (with and without tails - which she will only chase a couple of times in the house then she is done), we have even taken new stuffies outside, and I have tried to play with her but she hurts me, or runs away from me (a good game of chase could be the goal but she stops when I get close to her and won't chase me even when I am making happy noises).

I think that part of this could be that she doesn't know how to play with people (except to play rough). I also have a problem playing tug with her as I can't hold on to it (severe carpal tunnel in both hands).

I should also mention that a pat on the head is more than that, but I will keep that in mind.

2RescuedDobies · 05-22-2008, 12:09 AM

I totally understand. There is no toy on the planet that my Boris will play with outside. He's not too food motivated either. I have found that in order to keep it interesting I have to have a variety of different treats in my pocket so he never knows which one he's going to get. The rough housing can be dealt with in the same way. Calm treat jumping all over MOM results in a correction and no treat. Have you tried teaching her the touch command. I know I taught my Boris to target my hand touch it with his nose and get the treat. Might be a better game.

Sagesmom · 05-24-2008, 04:04 PM

I have tried targeting.... and in the house it works great. I have started to take the tug outside.... she doesn't tug on it (she just doesn't seem interested in tug but I have started throwing it when I tell her to go play. It is kind of funny, she will run in the direction that I throw it but won't pick it up. She did catch it once.... then dropped it in the mud and moved on with her sniffing and running. Thank you for all of your advice, it did help even if she does things her own way.

thea2003 · 05-24-2008, 04:19 PM

This was happening with my dog as well when we were doing obedience class, the teacher explained it VERY well, and simply, she is getting something out of it.
For me it was i was smiling when she came to me so them she would jump up so.
Basically I had to quit smiling when she did something i liked and just reward her in other ways lol.
How can you not smile when you are pleased with your dog? It was very hard!
Sorry didnt read above posts, all very useful info and may try some of those techniques as well.