Prong position

JAXDOG · 05-13-2008, 02:21 PM

I tried searching this, but didn't find exactly what I was wanting to know.

I was at a horse show (I will post pictures later) with Jax and thought I had his prong positioned how it was supposed to be from sites that have been linked to here. It was up high on his neck and tight to keep it there, but not too tight, it would slide down some. I know he's just over 5 months, and I hate to use the prong so young, but this puppy is already huge and it doesn't look good having a 55+lb puppy dragging me around new places.

I had several people (dog people, one lady has two rescue Dobe's and helps train at a local dog club) tell me that his prong was too tight. They said that it was okay if it slid down his neck. That as tight as it was up high on his neck like that I was not able to take any slack out. That he was constantly feeling that collar and was not having any release.

I will say, I'm a horse person. I'm a dog person, but most of my formal training has always been show horses. What they said made sense to me. When we have a show horse that we are trying to train into a frame, we have to give them some slack that can be taken away. That way there is relief (slack rein, relaxed leg) for good behavior, correction (tightened rein, usually tight legs) for wrong behavior. They learn to stay in that frame for the relief and the correction becomes less and less.

Are they right? Does the prong need to have links added so that it is more down around the bottom of his neck, and I'm able to take something away from him when he gets ahead of me and starts pulling?

babyangl86 · 05-13-2008, 02:39 PM

the lower on the neck it is the more control a dog will have. If it's lower on the neck they have more leverage and are able to pull you around no matter what kind of collar you are using because thats where all the muscle is, higher on the neck is most sensitive hence why in the show ring the lead is really high up on the neck, the handler is able to use the tiniest of lead on the largest dog simply because of the position of the lead. There is a thread in here about position of the collar and stuff I'll find it and link to it if i can figure out how to do so..

here is the link on how to position it It comes from the I need to know: does your dobe pull on leash even with a prong collar? thread

Hope that helps you!

Lexxsmom · 05-13-2008, 03:43 PM

I think that you need to be able to see some relief in the collar... I also ride horses and your metaphor was perfect... think about it from his angle.. if the collar is always tight, the correction will start to become obsolete plus, uncomfortable for him. I'd add a link. Try to keep the collar up as high as possible, but mine slides a bit, i just reposition it

secretz · 05-13-2008, 04:39 PM

I think it's not a matter of more slack = good behavior. You can have a dressage horse on the bit with solid rein contact and perform the tasks you want without it being a bad thing (unless you've got a habit of bumping the horse in the mouth quite often). I think the same thing is true of prong collars. I had to switch from a choke chain to a well fitted prong collar (fitted at the jawline/behind the ears) to get sufficient results. What I mean to say is that the timing for correction is cut down.

Whether you have dogs or horses, everyones going to have their opinion. Just remember that there's a lot of crazy people out there giving advice. I used to walk down by the beach and have a lot of people tell me a lot of things that just never added up.

In my own opinion (and it's probably crazy, too), most dogs won't want to pull against a prong collar. Mine never really does and I only use it for minimal correction....as leerburg says, "it's the powersteering of dog collars."

JAXDOG · 05-13-2008, 05:49 PM

Thank you, everyone. I know there is more muscle down at the base of the neck, and can see the reasoning for keeping it up high. I just think there should be some relief there. Something to give and take with.

Yes, dressage horses work well with contact on the bit. They are supposed to have constant contact on the bit to be rode properly, the rider is also constantly driving the horse with their legs and seat. I'll be honest, I don't want a dog that is the equivalent of a dressage horse. Constantly at the end of a taut lead. I want a "western pleasure" dog.

I want to walk or run anywhere on a loose lead.

I hope to teach him to walk obediently on a loose leash with a flat collar on in all situations, but I know that will come with maturity and lots of work. My thought is if I have it tight enough that it stays up all on its own, he knows with certainty it is there. If it is a little looser (not even a lot looser) he may forget it's there, and it will magicly come back to "bite" him if he misbehaves. He would therefore never really know when it's on and when it isn't?

Shoot, I'm probably crazy, too. Who knows, maybe I'll start lunging him for exercise?

**Jenny** · 05-13-2008, 06:01 PM

Now that would be a sight to behold - a lounging dobe

I have thought about using my lounge line as a long line

secretz · 05-13-2008, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenny

Now that would be a sight to behold - a lounging dobe

I have thought about using my lounge line as a long line

Actually, it works pretty well. I've got a 15 ft lunge line and use it at the beach and before obedience class.

Although, she doesn't go around as consistantly as the horses do...but one can hope...

robinb · 05-13-2008, 06:16 PM

re the prong it should be pretty high on the neck, I've had far better luck getting them to fit correctly using the 2.5 mm or small size rather than the medium prong collar.

robinb · 05-13-2008, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenny

Now that would be a sight to behold - a lounging dobe

I have thought about using my lounge line as a long line

I use my lunge line for tracking!

**BlackandTans** · 05-13-2008, 06:18 PM

I have noticed with using prongs on both my dogs that the higher up it is on their neck, the more control YOU have not them.... If it is lower my two will start pulling again.... Mine are really bad at pulling and that is one reason why we are now using prongs. We have tried choke chains, gental leaders, praising with treats, stopping till they stop.... they dont care. My female will choke herself to where she was caughing on our walks and I would not be pulling on her but keeping my arm in one place and she did it on her own. I have my prongs big enough that I can slip them off their heads without having to undo the teeth and break it apart... I dont know EXACTLY how long you are supposed to have it but I know that even if I do have slack in mine, my two usually pull and then continue till they have all the slack out of it... I have slack there if they would choose to want it but they pretty much have it tight the whole time while walking. When we stop or sit or something then it relaxes and falls lower on their neck. When we start walking again I pull it up higher under their head. That is what works for us....