A thought on large breed - Page 2 - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums

Matt Vandart · 11-09-2012, 05:19 PM

Looky here:

Quote:

THE FIRST THIRTY-FIVE YEARS. The first Standard ever written was by Germans in 1899, which read as follows: “General Appearance: The Doberman Pinscher should be built muscular and powerful, but not clumsy and massy, neither should he be greyhound-like. His appearance must indicate swiftness, power and endurance. Temperament should be lively and ardent.---Height at the shoulder: Males 21.6 to 25.6 inches; Females, 18.9 to 21.6 inches.—Length from occiput to first joint of tail about 27.5 inches.—Tail: cropped, not longer that 5.9 inches.”

RedMaro · 11-09-2012, 05:25 PM

To me a doberman should be a medium size. They are suppose to be a lean agile dog. Making the dog bigger hinders this. Just my opinion.

I do agree with Kansa though, most of the public sees them as a large breed.

Don't get me wrong, they are a big dog. But the terms large, giant, and medium are all subjective.

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RedMaro · 11-09-2012, 05:35 PM

This all just comes down to what each individuals opinion of large is. Do you go off of what a vet says, a food company, the standard, compared to other dogs? There are so many varying opinions on what a big dog is. Some people see 40 pound dogs as large. Each person is different.

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Tayl · 11-09-2012, 05:52 PM

I agree with every person has a different perspective. I grew up with a 130lbs Newfoundland so to me Rowan is pretty small (medium-large) but the newf I'm pretty sure is considered giant so my perspective is kinda skewed that anything under 100lbs is kinda small ;p he does make up for it in personality though! As for food it's so hard to determine especially when you look at the back of a large breed food and the smallest weight is around 50 I think

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ataro · 11-09-2012, 06:03 PM

How about going on what other dog breeds are considered "large" by standard, but are similar to the Dobermann in size?

Giant Schnauzer:
http://www.ispu-org.com/Standards/ri...auzer_181e.pdf

Beauceron:
www.fci.be/uploaded_files/044a2006_en.doc

Japanese Akita:
www.fci.be/uploaded_files/255gb2001_en.doc

Q734 · 11-09-2012, 06:39 PM

There were some very mastiffy looking males @the National this year, one of which was in the judging seminar; a dog that was every bit of 100lbs, almost as thick as he was tall, coarse steroid looking IMO...an example dog to people who will be using that dog as a template for what is correct with their newly minted judges licenses.

There was one dog that didn't bring me to disillusioned tears, but I wouldn't have taken him home either.
I cried my head off after that seminar.

Kansadobe · 11-09-2012, 07:32 PM

I did not attend the seminar, but had a demo dog myself so I have no idea of what dog you are speaking of that was "mastiff looking". Most of the class dogs there and many of the specials were very bitchy with no bone or body. This breed is in real trouble with our males because they are no longer real Dobermans in look or temperament.

A quality Doberman is a balance of substance and elegance with heavy bone, but never coarse or clunky. They must have the stamina and agility to run down the bad guy and the temperament to be a man stopper. Unfortunately, there are too many that have neither the body nor the temperament to do the above.

smudgeid · 11-09-2012, 07:54 PM

I have a medium dog. She's not a small dog. She's not a large dog. She's a 60 pound, relatively small (she looks tiny compared to some) doberman.

She wears her medium collar in the tightest hole - because her neck is skinny, but the small collar isn't wide enough & looks too narrow for her body.

She's 60 pounds - but since she has no fat, she looks smaller than some 60 pound bulkier dogs. I worry about the vet's prescription (and the food bag amounts) because her body weight doesn't really reflect her ability to absorb whatever she takes in.

I like 'big dog' food for her because it takes more crunching & she eats slower. I also like the glucosomine that it included. Since her current food doesn't come that way, I'm pleased that it does have glucosomine & chondrotin. (I'm sure I spelled those incorrectly - sorry.)

My vote is medium.

Kate

Q734 · 11-10-2012, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kansadobe

I did not attend the seminar, but had a demo dog myself so I have no idea of what dog you are speaking of that was "mastiff looking". Most of the class dogs there and many of the specials were very bitchy with no bone or body. This breed is in real trouble with our males because they are no longer real Dobermans in look or temperament.

A quality Doberman is a balance of substance and elegance with heavy bone, but never coarse or clunky. They must have the stamina and agility to run down the bad guy and the temperament to be a man stopper. Unfortunately, there are too many that have neither the body nor the temperament to do the above.

I vehemently disagree. This "no bone bitchy" meme is alarming, how BIG do these dogs have to get before the "authority" decides they've "corrected" the look of the doberman over the previous 60+ years?

Now there were a lot of ring-FAT dogs, dogs whose undercarriages shook like jello going down the mats. Anyone curious enough could spend some time looking @ showdogvideopros.com this past National(and 2010 FAT CITY w/dogs that year OMG) and see them jiggling across the ring.

Of course a humongous oversized FAT dog is going to make whatever it's standing next to look "bitchy" by comparison- but those dogs are the tragedy IMO when they get chosen over a standard dog as they are the ones morphing the breed into mastiff land.

If the doberman is going to become a giant beefcake 'roided out looking creature-on top of being ridiculously short lived -- want nothing to do with it as the breed will have become extinct from what I've know of it all my humble 40+ years looking at them.

The bigger is better trajectory is a widespread problem in this country not just in dobermans, but in many other breeds- I don't understand how people can stand by and let it happen without a fight, particularly so when this is a heart damaged breed.

Temperament's another topic- there are only so many hours in a week for people who are inclined to pursue "working titles" and conformation....not to mention the litigious society there is now vs. 40+ years ago.

I'm sure my boy is considered bitchy these days, but he's a freaking puppy and shouldn't be looking like a 5 yr old dog waddling down the mat, and hell will freeze over before I stuff him just to give the false illusion of "mature" just to beat the ones who've been feeding their dogs hohos all day.

Matt Vandart · 11-10-2012, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Q734

I vehemently disagree. This "no bone bitchy" meme is alarming, how BIG do these dogs have to get before the "authority" decides they've "corrected" the look of the doberman over the previous 60+ years?

Now there were a lot of ring-FAT dogs, dogs whose undercarriages shook like jello going down the mats. Anyone curious enough could spend some time looking @ showdogvideopros.com this past National(and 2010 FAT CITY w/dogs that year OMG) and see them jiggling across the ring.

Of course a humongous oversized FAT dog is going to make whatever it's standing next to look "bitchy" by comparison- but those dogs are the tragedy IMO when they get chosen over a standard dog as they are the ones morphing the breed into mastiff land.

If the doberman is going to become a giant beefcake 'roided out looking creature-on top of being ridiculously short lived -- want nothing to do with it as the breed will have become extinct from what I've know of it all my humble 40+ years looking at them.

The bigger is better trajectory is a widespread problem in this country not just in dobermans, but in many other breeds- I don't understand how people can stand by and let it happen without a fight, particularly so when this is a heart damaged breed.

Temperament's another topic- there are only so many hours in a week for people who are inclined to pursue "working titles" and conformation....not to mention the litigious society there is now vs. 40+ years ago.

I'm sure my boy is considered bitchy these days, but he's a freaking puppy and shouldn't be looking like a 5 yr old dog waddling down the mat, and hell will freeze over before I stuff him just to give the false illusion of "mature" just to beat the ones who've been feeding their dogs hohos all day.

I love this post and have almost come to the conclusion of the bolded bit, if it wasn't for the fact I know there is at least one breeder out there doing it right.