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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 12:40 PM Thread Starter
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Warlock Dobermans

In light of some recent discussions, I thought it would be a good idea to post this little tidbit again. I emplore those who believe in the warlock Doberman or insist they have one, to read this post. I would ask these same people to please not call your dobermans 'Warlocks' as I feel it is an insult and disresectful to a beautiful and intelligent dog that was a great representative of our breed's past and a valued part of Doberman history. There was only one Warlock, and not many who clain the name actually can prove the lineage in their pedigrees.

Anyway, moving forward, this is a story I heard from AKC judge Grace Black. She posted it on another forum, and I am sharing it here with her permission...


Warlock was a beautiful male Doberman Pinscher, bred/owned/handled by Henry Frampton. He was born in 1955 and died in August, 1966. His registered name was Ch. Borong the Warlock C.D. He was shown almost exclusively by Henry, but was handled on occasion by Joseph Gregory who is now an All-Breed judge.

Warlock was sired by a German import, out of a lovely Ch. Florowill bitch bred in this country. Warlock was a multi-Best In Show dog and, in fact, won the DPCA National Specialty THREE times -- twice from the Best of Breed class and once again from the Veterans Class!! He was, in my opinion, the greatest Doberman of all time --and had superb Doberman temperament. He was 28 inches square and his photo has been published in the AKC Book of Standards for over 40 years, as the correct example of the breed.

Many novice people think Warlock is synonymous with Doberman. Warlock means a male witch and perhaps that is where the illusion "aggressiveness" came from. But, he was extremely well disciplined and had a C.D. I visited him many times at his home and found him to be friendly and well-trained. In fact, I was so impressed with him that I purchased his son whom I not only
finished as a Champion but whom I personally trained to his C.D.X. title. His name was Ch. Charem's Warrior von Warlock C.D.X.

Warlock was 11-1/2 years old when his owner, Henry Frampton, died in the show ring in Greenville S.C. He was showing Warlock's Best-In-Show daughter, Ch. Jem's Amythest von Warlock at the time. Joe Gregory was there, and picked up the lead, and showed Bang-Bang (her call name) to Best In Show. Henry knew that he had a bad heart and his will requested that if he pre-deceased Warlock, Warlock was to be euthanized, and he was to be buried, along with Henry. It was a sad time for all of us who loved Warlock but Henry felt Warlock would grieve for him too much in his old age and did not want him to suffer.

Well, now you know a little bit about Warlock. Henry Frampton's kennel name was "Borong" therefore came the name Ch. "Borong" the Warlock. Warlock produced many champions and his name appeared in most pedigrees of the sixties, seventies and eighties - and people began to think that the word "Warlock" and "Doberman" were synonymous. Since most novices believe Dobermans are aggressive, the word "Warlock" also began to mean "aggressive". and the interpretation remains today among people who are not familiar with our wonderful breed.
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Nothing is 'natural' about drop ears. All pure breeds are designed by man with a purpose, form, function and look that is is their heritage, their history - important parts of what made the breed and must be respected and preserved.

If we want the right to have that CHOICE, let's stand up and fight for ALL choice! Let's NOT remain neutral or silent about losing the right to choose just because YOUR choice may not be the one threatened!

In doG, we trust.

Last edited by sundobe; 06-18-2010 at 12:42 PM.
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 01:02 PM
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Thank you for posting this. I think this should be a sticky.


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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 02:12 PM
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it should be a double sticky, since there are still people out there who believe in those myth and thats just one of them.

Don't argue with an idiot; people watching may not be able to tell the difference.
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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 03:25 PM
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So the original Warlock was NOT an over-sized doberman, obviously, if he was shown to his championship. How did the myth get started that a Warlock was a "superior" sized dobe? Also, nobody now would own a "warlock" doberman unless you named him or her Warlock or he happened to be a wizard in which case you'd be a millionaire.

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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 03:34 PM
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Another article with a picture of Warlock:

Road House Dobermans, Doberman Pinschers, Dobermans, Doberman, Doberman Pinscher, Doberman Puppies, Doberman Breeders, Brong the Warlock

Zoopsie Daisy vom Dobereich
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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 03:39 PM
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Another article on the Doberman Pinscher Club of America (DPCA) website, since it might be good to collect Warlock information in this thread for those who would like to learn more.
Warlock Myth

I personally think the word Gimmick is better than Myth, as I feel that people hear myth and think that we dont' believe their dog exists. Maybe there's even a better word than gimmick...
False Advertising?
Mark of a non-reputable breeder?
B.S.?

Erica


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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 05:33 PM
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and this is a prime example of why I love this forum! THANK YOU!!!!!!
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 09:42 PM
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Thanks for posting. Its interesting to see Warlock's pedigree below:

Borong the Warlock

If you follow the links in some cases you see pictures of the some of the dogs that make up his ancestry.

Last edited by Sage; 06-18-2010 at 09:45 PM.
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 11:25 PM
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Warlock Dobermans sounds like something out of a movie.lol.

Thanks for this thread.

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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 11:35 PM
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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-19-2010, 05:13 PM
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This always kills me.. My Roman the scandalous was a "warlock" Of course I got him from a byb. They also referred to him as a "king" dobe. I was all impressed b/c I had always heard this myth. Then I read the actual story behind this. Jeesh, what a fool I made of myself telling everybody "he's a warlock"

This dog has nothing to do with the warlock line, he was just huge...

Last edited by originalsinjin; 06-19-2010 at 05:20 PM. Reason: add on
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-19-2010, 08:53 PM
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I am frequently asked about Warlock Dobermans when out with Dobermans. There are a lot of people out there who bring it up. It just means oversized and not to standard. The Doberman standard is there for a very good reason and is there for breeders as the blueprint to the breed. If someone is breeding Warlock Dobermans that means they are not breeding to the Doberman standard. The word King is also used instead of Warlock.

It is important to get the word out that there are not really "King" or "Warlock" Dobermans, instead all that means is "oversized" or "bigger than standard" Dobermans. Reputable breeders do not use this word to describe their Dobermans and especially not their breeding program. Bigger is not better in this breed. The bigger the dog the less the stamina and the less the agility. Think also about lifespan, smaller dogs on average live longer lives - think Chihuahua vs. Great Dane.
A lot of people also keep their dogs overweight, thinking bigger is better for various reasons, but this is not good for the dog's health and longevity. The extra weight puts a lot of excess strain on the joints and body. Leaner dogs on average live longer than obese pets.

For more research on the breed, please spend some time on this site, in particular the Q&A section: Q&A


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Life's challenges are not suppose to paralyze you, they are suppose to help you discover who you are ~Bernice Reagon

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Last edited by Dobesanddragons; 06-19-2010 at 09:10 PM.
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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-19-2010, 09:11 PM
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I have a chihuahua . She's especially tiny,but not the smallest either. She weighs 3lbs and I can carry her in one hand/arm. MANY people ask me if she is a "toy" or a "Teacup" . There is no such thing as a "teacup" chihuahua, and NO,she's not a "toy" but she IS in the "toy GROUP" . That is another example of a gimmick, or false advertising. I think there are false advertising gimmicks with several other breeds. Now the trend is those "designer dogs" missing pure breeds and acting like they are hyper allergenic . To me, it makes NO sense. Why mix a lab and a poodle and say it's good for allergy sufferers when a PURE breed Poodle would be even better ???? I know I may sound like I'm getting off topic, but my point is,
Unfortunately knowledge in history in dogs in general is lacking . With that said, i know I have a lot to learn too. Heck, I never even knew the word "warlock" until the breeder brought it up when we were looking at his dogs,and he was telling us a few things(talking about how warlocks were a gimmick).

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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-05-2012, 10:20 PM
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I can't leave the house without someone coming up to me asking is my dobie is a 'warlock'. We got him at 10 weeks from a retired marine that realized a puppy was not going to fit his lifestyle, so I'm not sure of where exactly he purchased him. He is a larger than the standard, at 31" I love him he's part of our family not a show dog so it doesn't bother me. I LOVE the stories I get at the pet store or the park about "I used to have a doberman, bigger than your man here, came from championship warlock lines" I want to slap these people.. AHH ranting I will stop, I second or third the sticky note idea, can I smack it on their foreheads?

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― Charles de Gaulle
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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-06-2012, 10:09 AM
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well Warlock is a very nice looking Doberman...nice pose in the picture

many people don't realize Dobermans are not the only animals plagued with "Warlock" breeding

this is Rothchild Von Diesel Van Halen the Black Warlock Gerbil...most gerbils are 65-100 grams and Rothchild is 120grams...way over standard for a gerbil....

Last edited by Ruthie; 04-02-2013 at 08:19 AM.
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post #16 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-06-2012, 11:35 AM
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My first dobe, Tyler's father was called a Warlock. It was on Tyler's pedigree when I got it. I didn't carry on the Warlock name, frankly because I thought it was a little silly. I have always named my dogs with a first, middle and last name (which is mine). I never knew what that meant as far as having a "Warlock" doberman, so this is a very interesting and enlightening thread. Thank you for the information. Tyler has passed many years ago now but I still have his portrait on the wall with everybody else's.

Maui Lou, I do, Love you.
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post #17 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-06-2012, 11:37 AM
Take my Dobe, please!
 
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Kenya was a "Warlock" Dobe. For realzz!!! Borong the Warlock was her 7x*great-grandsire!!!! And she was huge!!!! 62 pounds, sopping wet, with a full tummy!!

-----------
*I think he was her 7x great-grandsire. I looked it up once, but I'm too lazy to look it up right now.
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