dobegal

I could not have said it any better than Murreydobe.

Santa

Funny how one never meets anyone who has actually had their Doberman turn on them - it's always 'knows someone who knows someone who'. It's urban legend.
Dobes don't just 'turn' anymore than any other dog. Crow pointed out exactly how and why incidents can sometimes happen, it's nothing to do with suddenly turning anymore than it is to do with their brains growing too big for their skulls.

Julie W

Some dogs period will go after their owners, being a doberman has nothing to do with it.

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RedFawnRising

I personally don't like the whole paradigm of alpha and weak vs. strong.

I think it sets up new owners to be in a combative position with their dogs/puppies.

I think it is more about "language" barriers and cultural dichotomies, between dogs and humans.

If the OP would read Jean Donaldson's The Culture Clash and Pat Miller's The Power of Positive Dog Training, that would be a good start to a great relationship with the new pup.

There is a place for discipline, but leadership does not have to equal tyranny, in order for a dog to be accepting of you as "alpha."

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It takes more than a baby and a box to make a normal monkey.—Harry F. Harlow

Doberdog

Last year when I told this guy at work that I had put a deposit on a Doberman pup, he told me he had one for two years that turned on him. I asked if he had it from a pup and he said yes. He said he never had any problems before, then one day they went to his sisters house for a cook out. They ate, then feed his dog, the dog jumped up on the couch to nap. His sister does not allow dogs on the couch so he told him to get down and when the dog didn't, he took hold of his collar to pull him down. He said the dog went off on him and then cornered him and his sister and two kids in the bedroom. His brother in law came home who always had Dobies and he gave him a command and took him out of the room. The dog was fine after that but Estill was scared of him, so gave him to an older woman who said she was not scared and could handle him. He said two weeks later the dog put the lady in the hospital after he got her down and took hunks out of her back.
I almost did not get Q after this story. Then I thought, Where did he get him? What were the temperment of his parents? How did he raise his Dobie? He does not seem authorative to me. Did he ever train him and teach him commands so they could communicate correctly with the dog knowing what was expected of him. Then we all know that sometimes you just get a dog that is not right and can't be fixed, regardless of the breed, it happens in all breeds, just like people. Plus I only know this guy professionally, I don't know how he treats animals. Did he do all the wrong things, like rub his nose in shit and hit him for chewing stuff up, hours after the fact even. See what I mean. So even though I know someone personally that it happend to, I don't know what the human did to encourage it.
I choose to disregard him and I'm so glad that I did. I must admit though that his story encouraged me to do the right thing more quickly and work with Q and take him to classes early.
I must also say that I have more Ex-Doberman owners with good experiences. My uncle had a Dobie for 12 years and him and my Aunt both said it was the best dog they ever had. My best friends first husband had a Dobie when they married and she said he was awesome. I have another friend that found a female Dobie stuck in a fence in the country. She had chewed half her leg off to try and get free. They had to amputate the leg. That dog was the best dog they ever had and was great with their toddlers. They had her for years. She also got around great. Man she was fast.
Ok, I'll quit rambling. If any of you read my thread in nondoberman animal talk, you know I'm very emotional today, so excuse the long reply.

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Have a great day, Sheila-owned by Quentin (b&t,M, dobie), Maggie Mae(1/2 shar pei, 1/2 ?, F, from the pound), and Peaches (red dobie, F)

eph94

But for some dogs, they need to live under martial law in order to be an acceptable (i.e. non-biting) member of society.

I have a rescue of somewhat shaky temperament that is always looking to "ladder climb" the family hierarchy. I've tested it over and over again. Give him an inch, and he'll take a mile. My family has to follow strict program of NILIF with him; otherwise, he empowers himself in his own mind and then believes he can correct us. And when he corrects, he uses those sharp and scary Doberman teeth.

Scoob

My Rudy loves to play rough and I use a shock collar when he plays so rough he bites me. Funny thing, inside he goes to bite me and I put my hand there and he nibbles and then just licks my hand over and over -- bottom line, there have to be lines the dog cannot cross, and you have to be able to control your dog. My dog has one history, being with me, so I know all his past.

Scoob

RedFawnRising

Eph94, was that in response to my recommendations?

Both those trainers use NILIF type programs.

I don't consider NILIF tyranny, myself.

We all have to work, humans and dogs. Some beings just do better with more work on their hands!

Kudos to you for managing a dog of "shaky temperament," btw, and shame on the humans who bred and/or nurtured that in temperament in the first place.

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It takes more than a baby and a box to make a normal monkey.—Harry F. Harlow