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Old 05-20-2012, 07:45 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Angry Dedos dobermans

Just writing to let everyone no i was looking for a male puppy and went to this place in lemont illinois.After seeing the inside of house would never buy a dog from her had puppies and alot of dobermans jamned into cages everywere all crying and howling-she then noticed i was intheir and said you cant go in their.I was just looking for the bathroom-terrible breeder that was referred to me all dogs had some sort of scratch or bite marks on them horrible i need to report them who can i do that with.The place is in lemnot il.Owner is joan firestone with many alliases.
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Old 05-20-2012, 08:13 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Call animal control. If they are in less than stellar conditions the breeder *may* get in trouble.
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Old 05-20-2012, 08:28 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Oh, that's heartbreaking! I would definitely call Animal Control. Those poor dogs can't help themselves. They need someone to speak up for them.
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Old 05-20-2012, 10:10 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Call the (human) health dept. too, if the living conditions in the house were filthy.

If she's in city limits, check on zoning/ordinances for number of dogs.

Good luck, and thank you for not rewarding this jerk by giving her money, and thanks also for speaking out.
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Old 05-20-2012, 10:38 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Seeing this is your first post,i am reluctant in believing what you have posted.Send someone else there and have them take pictures and then post.I have never been to her,but know someone that has and has a couple of dogs from her. She no longer lives in the Chicagoland area and i do not have any contact with her,as she used to do agility at the same place we did obedience with our boy.
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Old 05-20-2012, 11:29 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Just because someone competes with their dogs doesn't mean they are good breeders. There was a case not too long ago (discussed on this forum) involving an AKC conformation judge, where the authorities removed dozens of dogs from their home. Apparently the dogs were living in filthy conditions, kept in crates full of feces and urine. People who knew this judge were said they were stunned to find out about this, because this person had been a well-known and respected breeder/judge for years.

Last edited by Rosemary; 05-20-2012 at 11:30 AM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 05-20-2012, 12:05 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I do not know this breeder, although have heard of her, and I'm not defending her per se.

However, when breeders have people/strangers over to their home, I think it's fairly customary to put them in their crates because it can be overwhelming for a newcomer to have a large number of Dobermans all over them. It's also pretty customary for those dogs to bark/howl, especially when apparently there is a stranger wandering around in their home unaccompanied by the owner. *That* aspect certainly doesn't warrant a call to animal control, imo.
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Old 05-20-2012, 01:04 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I dont see the harm in calling animal control and letting the appropriate people decide if there is an issue or not.
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Old 05-20-2012, 06:03 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Isn't it customary to kind of *ask* to use the bathroom at someone's house, rather than just wandering around without their knowledge?

I'm not defending this breeder per se, either, but I do think Mary has a good point. And I think the OP has provided kind of a weird explanation of what they were doing wandering around. I sure wouldn't be too happy if a complete stranger took it upon themselves to start cruising my house while "lookiing for the bathroom".
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Old 05-20-2012, 11:40 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I was just there today to meet with Joan, I am very new to choosing a Doberman breeder. I have never had a dob and do not know many people who own them either so unfortunately all my research has been done online, with books, through the vet. That being said my wife son and myself got to Joans and their was a family picking up a beautiful red male who seemed to be in perfect condition. I didnt get to see the inside of her house but shortly after the family left some visitors came to check out Joans puppies and they had been friends of Joan for years and raved about her and her dogs. From what I can tell but then again I am very new to this, Joan and Dedos seems to be a legitiment breeder with healthy, good tempered pups.

I would love some feedback for anyone who may know other reputable breeders in IL or WI.

Thanks!
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Old 05-21-2012, 08:41 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Personaly i would go to a few vets in Dedoes area and try to talk with them. Im sure you would be able to get some useful information from them concerning health. Use the info to decide yourself if they are for you. She has been in business for 33 years, and i have not heard anything bad about her pups. The woman that i new had 2 dogs from her they were both healthy.
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Old 05-21-2012, 03:19 PM   #12 (permalink)
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So, what are her aliases? I didn't come up with any in a Google search.
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Old 05-21-2012, 04:02 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryAndDobes View Post
I do not know this breeder, although have heard of her, and I'm not defending her per se.

However, when breeders have people/strangers over to their home, I think it's fairly customary to put them in their crates because it can be overwhelming for a newcomer to have a large number of Dobermans all over them. It's also pretty customary for those dogs to bark/howl, especially when apparently there is a stranger wandering around in their home unaccompanied by the owner. *That* aspect certainly doesn't warrant a call to animal control, imo.
You know what, I didn't even think of that but you're absolutely right. I think it's super easy to imagine the worst possible scenario and jump to extreme conclusions. I've been reading far too many animal abuse stories lately. Sure sign that I need to take a break from those stories for a while.

Unless the dogs are living in filth or clearly abused in some manner...who knows? Saying someone has "a lot of puppies and Dobermans" in cages doesn't give anyone an idea of how this person defines "a lot." 5? 7? 38? "A lot" could cover any range of numbers from person to person.

My dogs are crated when someone comes over, too, *especially* if it's someone my dogs don't know, so they don't attempt to trample the person. And the only people I'm not offended by letting themselves to the bathroom in my home are those that live there and close friends/family. Otherwise, yeah, you should ask before you go traipsing off alone thru my house for any reason.
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Old 05-21-2012, 04:44 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brw1982 View Post
And the only people I'm not offended by letting themselves to the bathroom in my home are those that live there and close friends/family. Otherwise, yeah, you should ask before you go traipsing off alone thru my house for any reason.
My reaction to a complete stranger wandering around alone in my house "looking for the bathroom" would be they were looking to see what I had to steal. I'd treat them accordingly.
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Old 05-21-2012, 05:07 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amelia_ View Post
I dont see the harm in calling animal control and letting the appropriate people decide if there is an issue or not.
Well, calling animal control is pretty serious and you better make sure it's not for kicks and giggles before doing so. I think you should have a pretty firm grasp on whether it's warranted before you make the call.
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Old 05-21-2012, 05:24 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I always crate my dogs when people come. My dogs also sleep in crates at night. Sometimes I have client dogs on top of my own. I once kept 5 dogs for a friend for a year cause their house sold so fast they had no where to go! Sometimes the dog room gets dirty, especially when its raining outside.
so many what ifs.... Don't cause trouble for someone if you don't have the facts. And don't go in my house if u aren't invited.
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Old 05-21-2012, 05:33 PM   #17 (permalink)
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While I agree it's customary to crate dogs, what sounds odd to me is the breeder saying "You can't go in there." That would make me question WHY. I don't believe on should wander aimlessly around another person's house, but again WHY couldn't people go in there?
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Old 05-21-2012, 06:09 PM   #18 (permalink)
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While I agree it's customary to crate dogs, what sounds odd to me is the breeder saying "You can't go in there." That would make me question WHY. I don't believe on should wander aimlessly around another person's house, but again WHY couldn't people go in there?
Everything we've heard has come from what I consider a pretty sketchy person themself. Who knows what was actually said.

I can tell you, if some strange person coming to look at a puppy started wandering thru my house uninvited "looking for a bathroom", my comment to them would more than likely be closer to "Get the f**k out of here!", just because I'd think they were casing the place for a burglary or something. "You can't go in there" would be MILD compared to what I'd come up with..

Another thing to consider is it's becoming more and more common for AR whackjobs to send people to breeders houses on the pretense of looking at puppies when they're really looking for ways to put those breeders out of business. For that reason, A LOT of breeders just aren't too willing to let people into their house, or beyond a certain part of the house, etc. Nothing really to hide, but too many people have had dogs seized by Animal Control people who are sympathetic to PETA type organizations, everyone is getting a lot more careful.

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Old 05-21-2012, 06:31 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Hmm, well, at this point, I'm wondering WTF we all are really missing.

I mean, c'mon, three new users with low post counts, all of a sudden showing up to accuse or defend this Dedo's Dobermans?

THAT is as hinky, if not more so, than someone wandering around supposedly looking for the john.
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Old 05-21-2012, 07:00 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Everything we've heard has come from what I consider a pretty sketchy person themself. Who knows what was actually said.

I can tell you, if some strange person coming to look at a puppy started wandering thru my house uninvited "looking for a bathroom", my comment to them would more than likely be closer to "Get the f**k out of here!", just because I'd think they were casing the place for a burglary or something. "You can't go in there" would be MILD compared to what I'd come up with..

Another thing to consider is it's becoming more and more common for AR whackjobs to send people to breeders houses on the pretense of looking at puppies when they're really looking for ways to put those breeders out of business. For that reason, A LOT of breeders just aren't too willing to let people into their house, or beyond a certain part of the house, etc. Nothing really to hide, but too many people have had dogs seized by Animal Control people who are sympathetic to PETA type organizations, everyone is getting a lot more careful.
Exactly!!! There was a Arabian breeder from back east put through hell by those nut jobs last year.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:05 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I am new to this forum and to Dobermans in general but I have a pretty good feel for the situation, A.) because I was there and B.) because I spoke to 2 other chicagoland breeders that basically called dedos a puppymill.

When we went to see the puppies she had to go get them from inside and we werent allowed inside. She also wouldnt let us see the mom of the pups. On the positive the pups looked to be in good health and their was a family picking up their puppy just as we got there who raved about her.

The other breeders I spoke to said she may have good intentions but but the end result is the dogs are overbred, she doesnt have healthy dogs and has the dogs live in filth.

I dont think this is an issue for animal control but I would not purchase a dog from her.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:48 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I was just there today to meet with Joan, I am very new to choosing a Doberman breeder. I have never had a dob and do not know many people who own them either so unfortunately all my research has been done online, with books, through the vet. That being said my wife son and myself got to Joans and their was a family picking up a beautiful red male who seemed to be in perfect condition. I didnt get to see the inside of her house but shortly after the family left some visitors came to check out Joans puppies and they had been friends of Joan for years and raved about her and her dogs. From what I can tell but then again I am very new to this, Joan and Dedos seems to be a legitiment breeder with healthy, good tempered pups.

I would love some feedback for anyone who may know other reputable breeders in IL or WI.

Thanks!
^^^Up-polar

Quote:
Originally Posted by kannonclemens View Post
I am new to this forum and to Dobermans in general but I have a pretty good feel for the situation, A.) because I was there and B.) because I spoke to 2 other chicagoland breeders that basically called dedos a puppymill.

When we went to see the puppies she had to go get them from inside and we werent allowed inside. She also wouldnt let us see the mom of the pups. On the positive the pups looked to be in good health and their was a family picking up their puppy just as we got there who raved about her.

The other breeders I spoke to said she may have good intentions but but the end result is the dogs are overbred, she doesnt have healthy dogs and has the dogs live in filth.

I dont think this is an issue for animal control but I would not purchase a dog from her.

^^^And, down-polar

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Old 05-22-2012, 10:47 AM   #23 (permalink)
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While I agree it's customary to crate dogs, what sounds odd to me is the breeder saying "You can't go in there." That would make me question WHY. I don't believe on should wander aimlessly around another person's house, but again WHY couldn't people go in there?
Again, not defending the breeder who I do not know, but there can be many valid reasons why you don't want a stranger in certain areas of your house. Really, it's their private property - why should an explanation even be necessary? Having people over to meet your puppies and/or dogs isn't an open house.

I've had a GSP in the past that had seizures. I tried to avoid excitement for him - therefore, if I had put him up to keep him away from excitement, I wouldn't want a stranger wandering in where he was. Right now, I've got an old girl having VPCs and runs of v-tach during excitement. I got extremely stressed when a satellite service salesman came to the door a couple of weeks ago because I didn't want my old girl keeling over! I know a number of breeders that are a couple of dogs over their official limit for where they live - maybe it's as simple as not wanting someone to see that. You've had a couple of dogs yourself that had issues - you probably didn't want them coming into contact with strangers without your presence and supervision, right? It doesn't make (generic) you a bad person just because you've got situations that need controlling in your own house.
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:18 PM   #24 (permalink)
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The lack of respect for private property and the rights that go with them just floors me anymore. No one has the right to go tramping around in a private home or for that matter anywhere on private property. I do not know who this breeder is, nor if she is good or bad, just commenting on the attitudes expressed in this thread.

Threads like this are unlikely to make new people to the breed, without references, instantly welcome into the homes of breeders.

Just because a house does not qualify for Better Homes and Gardens doesn’t indicate neglect or abuse. Regarding sending some health inspector over, WOW! One with a chip on the shoulder can find fault with anyone! I’d hate had to have one digging through my refrigerator looking for something out of date. Some of the posters here must be meticulous housekeepers!
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:35 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Well, calling animal control is pretty serious and you better make sure it's not for kicks and giggles before doing so. I think you should have a pretty firm grasp on whether it's warranted before you make the call.
Why is it a big deal? Perhaps it's different over here, but here if someone makes a complaint they will just go to the property and look at the living conditions of the animals. If they are happy with the condition the animals, they just say thank you very much and are on their way. If here are some minor issues, they will make some recommendations and visit back in a few weeks.

I see it as my moral responsibility to report it if I am worries for the care of an animal. If someone was worried for the care of my dogs, I hope they would report me too.
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