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post #1 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-24-2010, 07:30 PM Thread Starter
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NY Dobermans - Anybody?

Any info on this breeder? Not looking for me (at least not for the next year or two!) but rather for a business acquaintance who is beginning his Dobe search. They are not part of the DPCA preferred list, but I know first-hand not to just trust that list without lots of other homework. Conversely I'm sure there are terrific breeders not on the list. Is this one of them? My friend has Dobe experience and is basically looking for a companion dog though he does lots of ob training. He likes the euro look. I don't see lots of health testing info on their site. Any info on listed pedigrees would be very much appreciated. He plans on contacting them and setting up an appointment to meet the next time he's in the NY area.

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post #2 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-24-2010, 10:01 PM
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I,ve been to Meagans house (NY Doberman) to meet her and check out her dogs and pups.She went to school with my daughter.She had a litter there already that was sold,so i basically went to check out the whole operation.She explained her breeding and health testing practice and i met her stud dog and dam.The pups were beautiful as all pups are,and very responsive and energetic.The temperment on her two adults were what a Dobermans should be.Her dogs are raised in her house with lots of land to excersice and train on.I definetely wouldnt think twice about getting one of her pups.But i happened to have found a breeder in Virginia that i want to get a pup from in the near future.
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post #3 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-24-2010, 10:46 PM
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What health testing? What longevity of the lines? What titles to show worthiness of the dogs being bred? Only uses the resident male. I won't even comment on conformation. Did you happen to notice that poor Anya will have TWO litters in 2010? That single fact would be all it would take for me not to support this breeder with my money.

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post #4 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 10:10 AM
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The fact that she says American dobes are more prone to health issues than Euros would make me run far far away. Sounds like just another Euro greeder to me.


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post #5 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by triciakoontz View Post
What health testing? What longevity of the lines? What titles to show worthiness of the dogs being bred? Only uses the resident male. I won't even comment on conformation. Did you happen to notice that poor Anya will have TWO litters in 2010? That single fact would be all it would take for me not to support this breeder with my money.

Yes, I also noticed that about poor Anya, 2 litters in one year -

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post #6 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 12:12 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you all!

I've noticed many of the same things you have, and already passed along my thoughts to my friend. Your input will help him immensely. He's an intelligent person who will take everything into consideration before making a decision. I know he's already visited with a few breeders and is evaluating all he has seen and heard. I also told him about DT so he may be reading this himself.

Anyone else? Anyone use them as trainers?

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post #7 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 12:17 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triciakoontz View Post
What health testing? What longevity of the lines? What titles to show worthiness of the dogs being bred? Only uses the resident male. I won't even comment on conformation. Did you happen to notice that poor Anya will have TWO litters in 2010? That single fact would be all it would take for me not to support this breeder with my money.
Tricia - thx for the input. May I ask what you see in the conformation? Asking for myself, as I'm still learning about such things.

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post #8 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 12:17 PM
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Their protection training isn't very good IMO.


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post #9 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 12:20 PM
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They have a couple of Half Sisters of Petey's in their breeding program. Their sire Euros died at only 7. We were told it was from bad antibiotics. One of Zahra's puppies was in Monty's OB class last month and he was adorable and had a nice temperament, he reminded me of Petey.

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post #10 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 02:09 PM Thread Starter
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They have a couple of Half Sisters of Petey's in their breeding program. Their sire Euros died at only 7. We were told it was from bad antibiotics. One of Zahra's puppies was in Monty's OB class last month and he was adorable and had a nice temperament, he reminded me of Petey.
Wow. "Bad antibiotics"? That's a new one for me. Are Anya and Zasha Petey's half sisters? I don't remember where Petey was from, but for some reason I thought he was somehow connected to this breeder. I may be way off base with this; I may be confusing you with someone else. Just seemed to click again when you said they have a couple of Petey's half sisters. Oh and I do notice we're coming up on another "Petey Day"

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post #11 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-25-2010, 04:29 PM
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Two of her females came from Petey's breeder, same sire. Not sure where her male is from, there is no pedigree listed.

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post #12 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-26-2010, 01:49 AM
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We were told it was from bad antibiotics.
Yea... about as likely as Rossiiskiy Kolorit Arbat Aldo being killed at 4 by a "snake bite".... I heard that when I was first trying to research Miesha's pedigree. Hmmm same "breeder" though...

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post #13 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-26-2010, 01:57 PM
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post #14 of 219 (permalink) Old 08-26-2010, 02:21 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you all again...I believe he's crossed them off his list by now, but will follow up with him soon.

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post #15 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 11:34 AM
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What health testing? What longevity of the lines? What titles to show worthiness of the dogs being bred? Only uses the resident male. I won't even comment on conformation. Did you happen to notice that poor Anya will have TWO litters in 2010? That single fact would be all it would take for me not to support this breeder with my money.

First off titles to me are worthless. I don't need a medal or someone to tell me my dog can work or has the right size head- I can decide that for myself. I stay away from dog people like that for the simple reason all they ever do is bad mouth eachother before finding out any facts. What difference does it make I use the same male? He produces great puppies and anyone who meets him falls in love with him. I have a very small breeding program because all my dogs are family pets and not kennel kept like plenty of other breeders out there. Any research you do shows that Euro dobermans do have better not only health but temperament as well so maybe people that are so stuck on American dobermans should read up a little more on what their dogs are more prone to. And as far as my dogs having two litters a year- as per my vet as long as they are young and healthy there is no reason why they can't. I take better care of my dogs than most breeders I have checked in on before finding the dogs to start my breeding program and if you actually spent the time to talk to me or come visit them you would see that rather than making a judgement based on my website. I pride myself in having wonderful family dobermans and I believe that anyone who has gotten a dog from me in the past would agree since they keep such strong relationships with me years after I sold them a dog. So obviously this is more than just a way to make money for me. Next time before you have so much to say about something you might want to make sure the info you have is actually correct.
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post #16 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 11:39 AM
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Their protection training isn't very good IMO.
I don't do the work for titles I do the bite work for fun and because the dogs like it. Those videos were training. Any training you do there are mistakes. I am not pretending to be perfect. I never said I had shutzhund titled dogs and would never because that's not what I am into. There are different styles of bite work. All I need to know is that my dog has enough confidence to protect me if needed.
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post #17 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 12:35 PM
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THIS IS FROM YOUR WEBSITE


Unfortunately American Dobermans are more prone to more health problems than the European Dobermans are because of the breed standards they have in Europe. For some reason American breeders are not held to the same standards of breeding and the Doberman breed is the one who suffers for it. This is another reason why I have decided to breed only European lined dobermans. As I said before I had American Dobermans in the past and their health is just not the same as the dobermans that I have now.

DUH,,,,,,, GEE , LOOKS LIKE YOUR ONE OF THOSE BACKYARD AMERICIAN BREEDERS NOT HELD TO THE SAME STANDARDS
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post #18 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 01:25 PM
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Really? I would love to know why you say I am a backyard breeder. I have done health testing on all of my dogs before I breed them and they have the best temperaments you could ask for in a Doberman. Funny how anyone commenting on these posts that has met me or my dogs has nothing but good things to say about me and anyone who did not is saying negative things but I wonder where you are getting your information and who you are to even make these comments. All I can do as a breeder is try to find the best lines to purchase dogs from (in my opinion) to breed. I have turned down so many people in the past who have wanted to breed to my stud because I did not feel their female was qualified to be producing puppies, so anyone who says I just do this for money really does not know me. So once again before you make judgements you might want to talk to either myself or someone who has actually done business with me in the past. I pride myself on being there for people who purchase puppies from me and am there for them all every step of the way. If you happen to believe against what the majority of tests show from European dobermans being healthier than American dobermans than that's your choice but I have my opinion as well and don't appreciate people saying negative things about my breeding program after all the time and dedication I have spent to try to help make the breed better.
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post #19 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 01:36 PM
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If you happen to believe against what the majority of tests show from European dobermans being healthier than American dobermans than that's your choice but I have my opinion
I'd like to see your facts on this... Or where you got your statistic from

As far as health testing what do you test for? I don't see anywhere you mention that you health test...

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post #20 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 01:37 PM
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Meghan5344:

What specifically are YOU doing to better the Doberman breed? What warrants your breeding program?

If titles are worthless to you, how do you determine if your dogs are breed worthy? Having a few dogs that can breed does not warrant a breeding program.

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post #21 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 02:07 PM
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No I don't have the testing I have done on my site but anyone who calls me to ask me I can happily answer them. None of my dogs are affected with VwD, all have normal thyroids and hips and elbows all good. I am also working with my vet recentally to find a card test that is accurate to get that done as well. Just because I didn't post it on my site didn't mean I don't do health testing. Remember these dogs are my family pets and I want only the best. Just because a dog has a million titles does not mean anything. All of my dogs live in the house with us and my 6 month old daughter. They eat out of the same food dish and play with the same toys and have been consistantally producing puppies of the same temperaments. Most of the title stuff is so political it makes me sick and I really cant understand why all those dog people even bother to get together because all they do is talk bad to eachother once the other persons back turned, it's crazy. My dogs are in different social situations everyday so I can tell what kind of temperaments they have. I don't need someone else to do that for me. All of their parents have titles and that fine but I don't believe it's something that needs to be done to ensure good puppies. Obviously I have been producing excellent puppies for a few years now and have made many families happy- and that makes me happy. And just because I don't have 15 dogs to breed says I'm a bad breeder? Like I said before all my dogs are family pets and not just used for breeding that is why I don't have more of them. I would never be able to give them the one on one time they all want and deserve. And you can do any research on line or even talk to your vet about it. Bottom line is European dobermans are just better working dogs and have less health issues in general. Again you have your opinion and I have mine but I looked long and hard to find the dogs I purchased before I started my breeding program and I could not be happier with the dogs I have now and the puppies they have produced for the families that have come to me.
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post #22 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 02:17 PM
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Your number one priority in health testing should be 24 hour holtering and a yearly echocardiogram for any animals you are breeding. Not sure what you would be working with your vet on those are the only 2 tests that can show early indications of heart disease. The DNA test for one of the genes that can cause DCM is done at WSU.

My dog has been DNA tested for the gene, and he is holtered and echo'd yearly. Oh ya and he's neutered.

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post #23 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Meghan5344 View Post
No I don't have the testing I have done on my site but anyone who calls me to ask me I can happily answer them.

Bottom line is European dobermans are just better working dogs and have less health issues in general.

Why wouldn't you want to make it public? If you want to show them off why not display them to be the best they can be?

And I still don't see any FACTS that support your Euro's are better...


My dogs have no titles either, and both are awesome temperaments, but I wouldn't breed my boy just because of that...

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post #24 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by pdubois64 View Post
Your number one priority in health testing should be 24 hour holtering and a yearly echocardiogram for any animals you are breeding. Not sure what you would be working with your vet on those are the only 2 tests that can show early indications of heart disease. The DNA test for one of the genes that can cause DCM is done at WSU.

My dog has been DNA tested for the gene, and he is holtered and echo'd yearly. Oh ya and he's neutered.
Because I have actually heard from two different vets those tests aren't even completely accurate. If I am going to tell families that my dogs are clear of something I want to make sure I am telling them something I know for sure. There breeders out there that do nothing to make sure they are breeding quality dogs so I really don't think I'm someone who you need to worry about. But thank you all the same.

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post #25 of 219 (permalink) Old 03-21-2011, 02:38 PM
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My Petey's sire is Eros he came from Merab. He was diagnosed at 3 years old with DCM. I did a Holter on him just to be a good pro-active owner, and it came back bad. We went off to the Cardiologist the next day where he had a Echo-cardiogram, it also came back bad. Fast forward 15 months, thankfully my boy is still with me, each day we get now is a blessing. We are now in the hole $6000 and paying more then $6 a day for medications. We are praying and hoping for him to have a 5th Birthday.

I know your Hismerh dogs must have incredible temperaments....because Petey is the best dog I've ever owned. He is my heart and soul dog. I also met Eros and he was stunning and had an amazing temperament as well. I've met one of your puppies in a training class, and I was completely smitten by him. Beauty and temperament are only part of the picture that a breeder should strive to produce. I didn't know any better when I purchased my Petey.

Knowing now what I do....Health is most important thing breeders should be breeding for. DCM IS in the Euro lines too. About 40-50% of our beloved Dobes will see it in their lifetime, hopefully later on, not young like my boy. Anyone breeding must at the very least Holter and Echo the dogs they are breeding once a year, this way they can stop breeding them if they show signs of DCM, to at least spare potential owners the kind of hell I've been living with for the last 15 months.

I also want to add.....I hope that you never see DCM in your own personal pets nor any of the puppies you have produced. I wouldn't wish this heart breaking disease on my worst enemy.


Last edited by Luvbirds; 03-21-2011 at 02:44 PM.
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