I picked up my Doberman gal from the puppy mill bust in SC this past weekend. She was in heat when I got her (heavily bleeding) and is still bleeding now. Prior to being taken in by animal control she was housed with males. I have no experience with heat cycles as all of my dogs have been fixed prior to adoption.. So I jumped on Google to see what I could find, and from what I read there are only 3-4 days out of the entire heat cycle that they can become pregnant and it is towards the end when bleeding has stopped and the discharge is clear?? Is that accurate at all? Is there a chance that she could be pregnant?? Im not allowed to have her spayed until the court case is over but read that there is a shot that can be given to prevent pregnancy.. Any help/advice/guidance?
I've heard 3-5 days but it can just as easily be in the beginning as the end. I have noticed with Gretchen that hers is about 10 days in. Gretchen doesn't have a clear discharge she bleeds the entire 3 weeks. There's def. a chance that she could be pregnant. There is a drug they can be given to terminate the pregnancy. From what I know the shot prevents the heat cycle from starting. If I'm honest you are just a foster to this dog correct? I would say it's not fair to terminate her pregnancy unless it's a health risk.
I am just a foster at this point, directly through AC. I'm not sure what you mean by it not being fair to terminate the pregnancy? With her still being in heat, the pregnancy (which may or may not exist) wouldn't be far enough along for me to worry about actually physically harming puppies, and the shape she's in right now is awful... she's emaciated and wormy. I'm not sure the stress of a pregnancy would be the best option for her sake. But I'm open to hearing your opinions on it, as I would like to learn what I can from people that have dealt with this before.
I picked up my Doberman gal from the puppy mill bust in SC this past weekend. She was in heat when I got her (heavily bleeding) and is still bleeding now. Prior to being taken in by animal control she was housed with males. I have no experience with heat cycles as all of my dogs have been fixed prior to adoption.. So I jumped on Google to see what I could find, and from what I read there are only 3-4 days out of the entire heat cycle that they can become pregnant and it is towards the end when bleeding has stopped and the discharge is clear?? Is that accurate at all? Is there a chance that she could be pregnant?? Im not allowed to have her spayed until the court case is over but read that there is a shot that can be given to prevent pregnancy.. Any help/advice/guidance?
I've heard 3-5 days but it can just as easily be in the beginning as the end. I have noticed with Gretchen that hers is about 10 days in. Gretchen doesn't have a clear discharge she bleeds the entire 3 weeks. There's def. a chance that she could be pregnant. There is a drug they can be given to terminate the pregnancy. From what I know the shot prevents the heat cycle from starting. If I'm honest you are just a foster to this dog correct? I would say it's not fair to terminate her pregnancy unless it's a health risk.
While it may not be fair in your eyes I would say it would be the proper thing to do. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this forum is based on promoting healthy pups with great temperaments from great breeders. There is a likely chance that a litter from this dog could be none of the above. I'm sure the OP didn't plan on fostering a litter of pups so I imagine that would just be another litter of pups sent to a rescue.
I understand if your morally against the whole aborting issue, but I do believe it would be in the best interest in this situation.
If she is bleeding heavily, there is a chance that she hasn't ovulated yet. Usually, when they are close to ovulating, the discharge turns yellowish to clear, and they will "flag" their tail. There are usually only a few days around ovulation when she would be fertile, but dogs don't always read the book, and extremely early or extremely late breedings have been known to take.
There is a drug that can be given if you know that she's been bred, but it has a fairly short administration window to be effective, I want to say within 72 hours of the breeding. However, the drug itself can cause problems, and also extends the heat cycle.
Right about now, I think your only real choice might be to cross everything you can and pray.
I appreciate all of the input. If she had been with a male it would've been about 3 days ago.. While all of the dogs she was exposed to are "AKC yadda yadda blah blah blah" I know nothing of their health, conformation, or temperaments - although my girl has proven to be a very docile little lady... I doubt she will end up being pregnant simply because of her body condition, but if there is a chance she is then I want to be as prepared as I can. The pups would most certainly have to go to rescue because I cannot devote the time into screening people, checking vet references/homes for who knows how many puppies. And for the record, I am not against extremely early termination/prevention, but once they are actually formed I wouldn't be able to emotionally deal with aborting them.
The shot does indeed extend the heat cycle, and has been known to induce pyometra in some bitches. Your vet can do a vaginal slide and determine pretty much where she is in her cycle and you can make an informed decision at that point. Best of luck with your girl, I'm so thankful she's in good hands with someone who cares about her!
You can always get her progesterone tested to see if she has ovulated yet. Of course, an abortion shot is probably as cheap as a progesterone test if you want to make sure. However, the abortion shots must be given within a certain number of days after the breed happened.
One time my bitch got out of the house. I took her to the best specialist and they can't terminate until they know she's pregnant. So it will cost you about $200 to find out.
I just think legally you could be in a heap of a mess if you terminate the pregnancy. If I were you I wouldn't even be talking about it on a public forum.
I'm not sure how bad your girl is but I've seen and fostering wormy, parasite, only skin and BONES mothers who have whelped healthy litters. It may not be what you want but God sends you what you need. If I were you I'd reach out to you nearest dobe rescue and see if they can help.
I'm sorry but this is a load of crap. These dogs were forced to undergo awful, horrible abuse. Now you want a frail, underweight, worm ridden female who has been subjected to these horrors to have puppies because 'god gave her what she needs'?
That poor female needs love and care and to be healed - not forced to raise a litter of puppies (for the what, 4th time? 5th time? 9th time?) that could kill her because of your moral obligations.
OP - find a good, empathetic vet who can guide you. Do what is best for the girl you're fostering - not her hypothetical puppies. I'd 100% terminate the pregnancy. I wouldn't hesitate. Please don't put more strain on the rescue groups already working so hard to clean this mess and put that poor girl through more. Let her heal and learn what love is!
If I were you I'd have a checkup and terminate the pregnancy. It would be something I told absolutely no one about due to legal possibilities. With all that has happened and the evidence against him I highly doubt he's getting his dogs back so it's more than likely not an issue anyway. Even if he did, I highly doubt he had any idea which dogs were and were not pregnant out of the 100+ dogs in his possession. It's a terrible situation either way but no one benefits from another litter being sent to a rescue.
I definitely agree with that.. The fact that 100 dogs are now stuck in limbo until dude is either denied the right to his dogs or - God forbid - wins them back, is enough to discourage me from bringing another litter into this mess. Not to mention Clover, as young as she appears to be, has already had several litters in her lifetime - probably every heat cycle she's ever had just from the looks of her.
If she is pregnant and I didn't terminate and he does (somehow!!) win the case - this litter of pups ends up back in the hands of a psychopath. I'm not one to sneak around, and would absolutely contact the shelter first but all of this is hypothetical anyway. No one, at this point, can say that she is or is not pregnant so if I were to "terminate" there would be no proof that she ever was pregnant. Even with me posting on this public forum, I am simply asking advice - not saying that she is pregnant and that I am going to destroy the pup.
I am not legally allowed to have the dog spayed. I am legally allowed to prevent a pregnancy by administering a shot. I'm not fostering through a rescue, I am fostering directly through animal control and while there is a chance that the dogs could be awarded back to the "owner", I see no reason why AC would want to remove her from my home when they are on the verge of having to euthanize 30 healthy dogs that are currently at their facility simply because they don't have a home. Out of the hundred dogs that were taken, I would like to know the number of average people that took in dogs that have actually even taken their dogs to the vet yet. If preventing an unwanted litter of puppies is "overstepping" and cause for me being eliminated from a fostering position there is not the slightest chance I would even *think* of fostering for that organization. I can understand if the dog was far enough along to recognize if she is pregnant or not, but that is not the case. And whether this litter (that may or may not exist) is terminated or not, if the guy is awarded the dogs back (and that is the only way my Clover will be leaving me), I'm sure he will have every opportunity to breed her over and over and over again to make up for the loss of this one hypothetical litter.
Either way, at this point, it would have been well past the 72 hour mark for the shot to be effective. I highly doubt she's pregnant given her current health, but if she is how do I ensure that this litter doesn't kill her? She is being fed 5x a day (small portions) - a mixture of Diamond Naturals chicken and rice and Taste of the Wild duck variety and now the dewormer. I am planning on having her vaccinated on Saturday because I cannot have an unvaccinated dog intermingling with client dogs. Should I add in a supplement for added calories or should coconut oil be enough to help?
Thank you for taking her on. I am contacting some rescue friends that may be a resource to you for the very legitimate questions that you have. I will PM you once I have their contact info.
1) you couldn't possibly count the number of cells (because at this point that is exactly what they are) that are being aborted at this stage in her hypothetical pregnancy in order for him to sue me over an amount of nonexistent dogs.
2) it's too late for the shot and I can't have her spayed so there is really no point in arguing about it any further.
I mean, really, what's going to happen if she does get the shot? This one out of 100... He's just going to assume that this one should have been pregnant and attempt to sue? Maybe he will attempt to sue anyone that had one of the females in their possession since they are all probably shady people that sneakily administer "morning after" shots to all of their dogs. It's ridiculous. At this point, she either is pregnant or she isn't. And so far no one has offered a suggestion to help me get her healthy enough to safely endure this if she is pregnant since the shot will no longer be effective and I can't have her spayed. Any suggestions for helping the living, breathing dog would really be appreciated.
Really, pretty much what you are already doing. A vet check, a good deworming, and lots of good food in small amounts. Getting rid of intestinal parasites and feeding her a high quality food are probably the most important things.
If she does wind up being pregnant, a vet and/or other experienced person to coach you through whelping would be your greatest assets.
Can you share some pictures of your girl in another thread? Some of us are interested in her journey to being a loved healthy doberman. Thanks for doing what you're doing.
OP: I contacted one of our wonderful moderators who is in touch with the dobe specific rescues fostering these dogs. My understanding is that she's PMing you the name of a contact that can help you with these questions. Best wishes to you and this dog that you have so kindly volunteered to foster in her time of need.
I'm a big fan of Nupro as a food additive. I don't usually follow directions though<G> I simply use the maintenance dose from the beginning. Other than that possibility, I think you're doing things right for the girl. Good food in multiple feedings, good worming to get rid of those nasty whipworms(watch where you let her potty so as not to leave the potential for infestation of your other dogs) and providing her with a home where she is cared for, loved and comfortable. I think you'll see a tremendous improvement in her well being in short order. Best of luck on this journey, and kudos for taking on the job of restoring her to health!
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