Beware: Tina Aston Tia's Dobermans in Maine - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums
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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-06-2016, 09:37 PM Thread Starter
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Beware: Tina Aston Tia's Dobermans in Maine

This woman is all around bad news and has been for years, but recently there has been a rash of people losing deposits to her. Seems she loves to take money and refuse to refund when not enough pups are born (or pups are wrong color/sex). This is exacerbated by her complete lack of genetic knowledge, i.e. being dumbfounded that the combination of a red male and red bitch failed to produce any black pups.

She acquires dogs on Craigslist and sells them equally hastily. Uses Continental Kennel Club to say that her dogs are "papered" (sadly the general public does not seem to realize that Continental Kennel Club papers are essentially toilet paper). One of her most recently bred bitches appears to have some sort of skin condition. She brags about the large size of her dogs and puppies... in fact that seems to be her main selling point.

Steer clear!
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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-07-2016, 11:00 AM
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I can appreciate that you want to warn people about problems with a breeder, however, I think it can be a dangerous venture to criticize a business entity publicly like this if you aren't speaking about actual events which happened to you and/or things that other people can see for themselves via a link to an online website or other available information. JMHO

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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-16-2016, 07:56 PM Thread Starter
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I can appreciate that you want to warn people about problems with a breeder, however, I think it can be a dangerous venture to criticize a business entity publicly like this if you aren't speaking about actual events which happened to you and/or things that other people can see for themselves via a link to an online website or other available information. JMHO

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/01/us/01slapp.html?_r=0
There *was* a site, which I should have linked to... but it is gone now. I can only hope this means she has stopped breeding!

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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-16-2016, 08:14 PM
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There *was* a site, which I should have linked to... but it is gone now. I can only hope this means she has stopped breeding!
Lousy breeders usually just change kennel names to lose bad press. Be great if she went out of business tho. We can only hope.

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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-16-2016, 09:15 PM
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Seems she is getting some, um, er...press. Kinda sad photo to me. I can speak for those Dobermans and say they'd rather be at home by the fire.

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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-16-2016, 09:22 PM
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Ugh...
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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-17-2016, 06:17 AM Thread Starter
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She pats herself on the back about "rescuing" those Dobes (from Craigslist) but then gets them CKC registered and breeds them and sells the pups for $1000. No one should be breeding rescue dogs, they have been through enough.

Sadly Linda you are probably right. I noticed her Facebook page had gotten some pretty scathing reviews. Facebook does not let businesses edit or remove reviews so poof! went the entire page.

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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 04-17-2016, 10:56 AM
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Ugh! Shame on her but I'm so sick of people not doing a LICK of research! Not on the breed and not on the breeder!!! I stayed away from a few breeders just by googling their name!!! And quite a few had me convinced with their talk and their website (ahem White Sage Dobermans) A few I found on here thank heavens!!! I still didn't purchase from the best breeder with G but at least I put in some research! To me purchasing from the Smiths down the street who's Dobes aren't registered and can't give you papers is no different, or worse actually then a rescue puppy (at least rescues are cheaper and chipped and neutered and shots and adopted out at the right age!)!

As much as I hate BYB and breeders the people that keep them in business make me angriest!
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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 01-05-2017, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by havenminx View Post
There *was* a site, which I should have linked to... but it is gone now. I can only hope this means she has stopped breeding!
Still breeding. When challenged about her breeding practices, she refused to answer.

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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by havenminx View Post
This woman is all around bad news and has been for years, but recently there has been a rash of people losing deposits to her. Seems she loves to take money and refuse to refund when not enough pups are born (or pups are wrong color/sex). This is exacerbated by her complete lack of genetic knowledge, i.e. being dumbfounded that the combination of a red male and red bitch failed to produce any black pups.

She acquires dogs on Craigslist and sells them equally hastily. Uses Continental Kennel Club to say that her dogs are "papered" (sadly the general public does not seem to realize that Continental Kennel Club papers are essentially toilet paper). One of her most recently bred bitches appears to have some sort of skin condition. She brags about the large size of her dogs and puppies... in fact that seems to be her main selling point.

Steer clear!
Havenminx, I wonder if you could clarify your stance on what, exactly, you consider backyard breeding. I see you are doing a lot of promoting of your new albino puppy that you got from California, including what appears to be "promotion" of your "white doberman" from the tags on your instagram account (for reference: Prima the Doberman Pinscher (@primapinscherina) | Instagram photos and videos). Information such as "White Dobermans do not have a higher instance of deafness than colored Dobermans. As for my eyes, I do squint when looking toward the sun on a bright day but I still get around just fine. (Sort of like how you can still see even when you squint.)" (quoting from your instagram) certainly seem to be a promotion of albino Dobermans, does it not? And, it also seems that since you have pictures of her from the time she was a newborn...perhaps this was a planned purchase, especially as she came from California, and you live in Maine.

Just curious, given your nine years of participation on this forum, and the fact that you would never name your last boy's breeder, either. I'm hoping I'm wrong, and fearing that I am not. It would be extremely disappointing, to put it mildly, to see such a long time forum member not only purchase, but indeed PROMOTE an albino Doberman in the manner that you are doing.

Further, see attachments.
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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 10:38 AM
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Not surprising somehow. Waiting on the lies and excuses...
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 10:51 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeadowCat View Post
Havenminx, I wonder if you could clarify your stance on what, exactly, you consider backyard breeding. I see you are doing a lot of promoting of your new albino puppy that you got from California, including what appears to be "promotion" of your "white doberman" from the tags on your instagram account (for reference: Prima the Doberman Pinscher (@primapinscherina) | Instagram photos and videos). Information such as "White Dobermans do not have a higher instance of deafness than colored Dobermans. As for my eyes, I do squint when looking toward the sun on a bright day but I still get around just fine. (Sort of like how you can still see even when you squint.)" (quoting from your instagram) certainly seem to be a promotion of albino Dobermans, does it not? And, it also seems that since you have pictures of her from the time she was a newborn...perhaps this was a planned purchase, especially as she came from California, and you live in Maine.

Just curious, given your nine years of participation on this forum, and the fact that you would never name your last boy's breeder, either. I'm hoping I'm wrong, and fearing that I am not. It would be extremely disappointing, to put it mildly, to see such a long time forum member not only purchase, but indeed PROMOTE an albino Doberman in the manner that you are doing.

Further, see attachments.
Never, ever would I promote white/albino Dobermans. (You seem to take offense with me switching between terms; you will notice on Instagram I use both hashtags on almost every photo, as I use the terms interchangeably.) I am learning firsthand as I go with Prima, and wanted to share what I am observing and learning with the people that constantly comment on her photos "is she deaf/is she blind." I do not believe that sharing my honest observations of her behavior/vision is promoting; I will always tell the truth and openly share my journey with her.

Find me one time that I did not correct/educate someone when they said "where can I get one?" I maintain my position that albinos should not be produced. I have felt this way since I first got into Dobermans and became aware of white Dobermans. It has never changed.

Prima was born of an accidental litter between a friend's two Z-factored, normal colored dogs. Each was out of normal colored parents so she truly had no idea what Z-factor was. Regardless, they were not intentionally bred. The mom is now spayed. The litter contained two albino pups which she planned to keep, as she could not find a home that she felt was educated on white Dobermans and prepared for their medical expenses/special needs. I felt prepared to offer this home. So we made arrangements to fly Prima to me. The other white pup stayed with her.

Prima is six months old and has just recovered from being spayed. No accidents in my house. But I am not going to flog my friend for having an accidental litter; she did enough of that to herself when she found them tied. I do not consider Prima a rescue--she has never known a bad day in her life and was never in any danger--so I have hesitated on just what to call her. An "oops" puppy is the best I have so far but usually I just explain the situation, as above.

As for Eros' breeders, right from the start they became dear friends and I do not hesitate to recommend them, but I also do not want to subject them to any kind of public flogging here for even the smallest of offenses (like placing Eros in a home with another male Doberman).

So there it is. Hopefully I put your mind at ease, MeadowCat. Reporting on what I observe and am learning from my albino Doberman =/= promoting albino Dobermans. I am saddened that you took it that way.

I am not sure why this is happening on this thread, but none of my dogs, past or present, are from Tia's Dobermans/Tina Aston. My definition of a backyard breeder IS Tia's Dobermans and everything she stands for. I am discouraged to hear she is still breeding.

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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 11:00 AM
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Thanks for explaining, havenminx! I was also curious about this, and was hoping she wasn't from BYB either. I my opionion a BYB is someone who intentionally breeds dogs without proper knowledge of their genetics, health, etc. However, like you said, the owner of the dogs should've had some COMMON SENSE when it came to keeping an intact male and female. It's not BYB necessarily, but its just SO careless of the owner.

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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by havenminx View Post
Never, ever would I promote white/albino Dobermans. (You seem to take offense with me switching between terms; you will notice on Instagram I use both hashtags on almost every photo, as I use the terms interchangeably.) I am learning firsthand as I go with Prima, and wanted to share what I am observing and learning with the people that constantly comment on her photos "is she deaf/is she blind." I do not believe that sharing my honest observations of her behavior/vision is promoting; I will always tell the truth and openly share my journey with her.

Find me one time that I did not correct/educate someone when they said "where can I get one?" I maintain my position that albinos should not be produced. I have felt this way since I first got into Dobermans and became aware of white Dobermans. It has never changed.

Prima was born of an accidental litter between a friend's two Z-factored, normal colored dogs. Each was out of normal colored parents so she truly had no idea what Z-factor was. Regardless, they were not intentionally bred. The mom is now spayed. The litter contained two albino pups which she planned to keep, as she could not find a home that she felt was educated on white Dobermans and prepared for their medical expenses/special needs. I felt prepared to offer this home. So we made arrangements to fly Prima to me. The other white pup stayed with her.

Prima is six months old and has just recovered from being spayed. No accidents in my house. But I am not going to flog my friend for having an accidental litter; she did enough of that to herself when she found them tied. I do not consider Prima a rescue--she has never known a bad day in her life and was never in any danger--so I have hesitated on just what to call her. An "oops" puppy is the best I have so far but usually I just explain the situation, as above.

As for Eros' breeders, right from the start they became dear friends and I do not hesitate to recommend them, but I also do not want to subject them to any kind of public flogging here for even the smallest of offenses (like placing Eros in a home with another male Doberman).

So there it is. Hopefully I put your mind at ease, MeadowCat. Reporting on what I observe and am learning from my albino Doberman =/= promoting albino Dobermans. I am saddened that you took it that way.

I am not sure why this is happening on this thread, but none of my dogs, past or present, are from Tia's Dobermans/Tina Aston. My definition of a backyard breeder IS Tia's Dobermans and everything she stands for. I am discouraged to hear she is still breeding.
Did you pay for this puppy? Is your friend's male also neutered, since she was apparently not educated enough to keep intact dogs from breeding?

I hope you can understand the concern on the forum when a long time member suddenly has a cropped albino Doberman without a word about the new addition and how she was acquired.


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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 11:21 AM Thread Starter
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Did you pay for this puppy? Is your friend's male also neutered, since she was apparently not educated enough to keep intact dogs from breeding?

I hope you can understand the concern on the forum when a long time member suddenly has a cropped albino Doberman without a word about the new addition and how she was acquired.
I paid for crate + airfare + cropping/health cert fees; she even sent me receipts.

No, her male is not neutered, though I believe he will be soon. We have talked about it.

A half dozen times I started to type an update on my pack here--other things have happened besides Prima coming home in October, like Eros getting his CGC--but I was pretty sure I would just get flamed and no one would believe me. Which maybe still is the case. But I have never told anything but the truth, and despite that am met with assumptions that I am lying... which is very frustrating and discouraging, as you can imagine.

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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 11:31 AM
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I don't know...when I asked you specific, pointed questions in my group on Facebook (which you'd have anticipated had you read the rules), instead of responding, you blocked me.

That doesn't make you seem terribly interested in being honest or forthcoming.

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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 11:40 AM
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I paid for crate + airfare + cropping/health cert fees; she even sent me receipts.

No, her male is not neutered, though I believe he will be soon. We have talked about it.

A half dozen times I started to type an update on my pack here--other things have happened besides Prima coming home in October, like Eros getting his CGC--but I was pretty sure I would just get flamed and no one would believe me. Which maybe still is the case. But I have never told anything but the truth, and despite that am met with assumptions that I am lying... which is very frustrating and discouraging, as you can imagine.
Thank you for clarifying. I hope your friend does the responsible thing soon.

I do hope you educate people on the problems with albinos. It is particularly difficult when you have a striking dog, because people think they are beautiful and cool and they want one. I have a friend with some, and she is VERY vocal about not only the problems albinos have (shorter life span, cancer, sight issues, and the list goes on), but also that if you want one, that the ONLY ethical option is to find one in rescue. I SINCERELY hope that you do the same, OFTEN. I also hope that even though you use the hashtag "whitedoberman" that you always, always make sure to clarify that she is, indeed, albino. The burden of ethics is higher when you own one. My opinion is that you need to go out of your way to educate people, because albino breeders are pushing hard to normalize albino breeding. There is a lot of good information on the DPCA page that you can steer them to.

As an aside, you may want to start getting her adjusted to something like Doggles. While she may not seem to have eyesight problems, the sun can be really harsh on their eyes, and I did see her squinting quite a bit in some of your photos. I also hope you are using sunscreen when she's out on sunny days - skin cancer is a big risk for them.


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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by havenminx View Post
Never, ever would I promote white/albino Dobermans. (You seem to take offense with me switching between terms; you will notice on Instagram I use both hashtags on almost every photo, as I use the terms interchangeably.) I am learning firsthand as I go with Prima, and wanted to share what I am observing and learning with the people that constantly comment on her photos "is she deaf/is she blind." I do not believe that sharing my honest observations of her behavior/vision is promoting; I will always tell the truth and openly share my journey with her.

Find me one time that I did not correct/educate someone when they said "where can I get one?" I maintain my position that albinos should not be produced. I have felt this way since I first got into Dobermans and became aware of white Dobermans. It has never changed.

Prima was born of an accidental litter between a friend's two Z-factored, normal colored dogs. Each was out of normal colored parents so she truly had no idea what Z-factor was. Regardless, they were not intentionally bred. The mom is now spayed. The litter contained two albino pups which she planned to keep, as she could not find a home that she felt was educated on white Dobermans and prepared for their medical expenses/special needs. I felt prepared to offer this home. So we made arrangements to fly Prima to me. The other white pup stayed with her.

Prima is six months old and has just recovered from being spayed. No accidents in my house. But I am not going to flog my friend for having an accidental litter; she did enough of that to herself when she found them tied. I do not consider Prima a rescue--she has never known a bad day in her life and was never in any danger--so I have hesitated on just what to call her. An "oops" puppy is the best I have so far but usually I just explain the situation, as above.

As for Eros' breeders, right from the start they became dear friends and I do not hesitate to recommend them, but I also do not want to subject them to any kind of public flogging here for even the smallest of offenses (like placing Eros in a home with another male Doberman).

So there it is. Hopefully I put your mind at ease, MeadowCat. Reporting on what I observe and am learning from my albino Doberman =/= promoting albino Dobermans. I am saddened that you took it that way.

I am not sure why this is happening on this thread, but none of my dogs, past or present, are from Tia's Dobermans/Tina Aston. My definition of a backyard breeder IS Tia's Dobermans and everything she stands for. I am discouraged to hear she is still breeding.
I guess...here's part of my problem. The person you got her from - this is their second "accidental" litter. It's easy to find on instagram. Nothing is private online anymore. They clearly made money off this litter, as she talks about selling the pups all over all the puppy pictures. Her entire instagram account is glorifying her beautiful albino puppy. Not once does in the many pictures I scrolled through with comments do I see any mention of why breeding albinos is bad. I could post a ton of screenshots, but I don't need to do that.

I have a real problem with supporting that, even if all you did was pay airfare. Why even be involved with that? What's the point? And I see your posts back to her, and it's all a great big "aren't our pups beautiful" lovefest. And frankly, all the people chiming in about "how pretty! I want one! Where can I get one???" just makes me feel slightly ill.
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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 12:16 PM
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I agree, MC.

It makes me wonder why someone hates this breed SO MUCH that they'd let their albino bitch breed TWICE, even if it's supposedly accidental. That's horribly distressing...just as distressing as the lovefest.

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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 12:23 PM
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Maybe the puppy should be named Swiss cheese.

Lots of holes in that story...
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post #21 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 12:24 PM
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Because this whole thing makes me so very cranky: https://www.instagram.com/dobermans_shadowandscarlett/


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post #22 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by falnfenix View Post
I agree, MC.

It makes me wonder why someone hates this breed SO MUCH that they'd let their albino bitch breed TWICE, even if it's supposedly accidental. That's horribly distressing...just as distressing as the lovefest.
Makes you wonder why someone who professes so much love for the breed would repeatedly support everything this forum rails against.


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post #23 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 02:37 PM
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Albino Dobermans are not white and should not be referred to as such in any way shape or form.

For a Doberman to be white, it would have to have white color genes. Albino Dobermans have a gene mutation that masks the color of the dog. The mutation has been identified and associated with known mutations that cause albinism in humans.

If one's aim is to educate about these dogs it is important that distinction is made. Two z factored Dobermans having a litter, accidental or not, is a backyard breeder practice at its core.
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post #24 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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I don't know...when I asked you specific, pointed questions in my group on Facebook (which you'd have anticipated had you read the rules), instead of responding, you blocked me.

That doesn't make you seem terribly interested in being honest or forthcoming.
You asked me, knowing full well that this is not the case, if all three of my dogs were rescues. As I stated above, I don't feel comfortable calling Prima a rescue. I knew that you knew that my boys were not rescues. I could not even think of how to reply to that succinctly and you have historically been very rude to me in the past, plus I considered the phrasing of your question rude. I actually was answering someone lower down in the comment thread when the whole thing went poof and disappeared.

For clarification, this is NOT her second litter... no way, no how. It was the red bitch that had the the pups. The albino bitch is Prima's sister and is six months old. I don't know where you are getting that she had two litters. She did have one pup come back to her and she found a home for him a second time. But he is clearly the same age as the other pups. I have known her for years. These are her first Dobermans, and they are young. They just had the one litter.

I was pretty sure at least some would not believe me but I figured it would be worth a try to tell the truth here, for clarification. Yes, I do love my puppy. Yes, I do adore my friend. I am 100% for educating people on the health issues of whites and why they should not be bred, both online and in person, as is she. I use both the hashtags "whitedoberman" and "albinodoberman" on just about every photo. I have already pointed this out.

This is all I can give you. I have answered all questions openly and honestly and that is all I can do.

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post #25 of 30 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 03:22 PM
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1 litter by can be called an 'accident' anything after that is a choice to be irresponsible.

ITs rather easy to avoid having litters even with intact pets in the home.


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